Leinster Vs Scarlets Sat 17th Feb 15.15 Sky Sports

[blockhead]

The down lowe from Lowe
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ul8XjsOYC1c

[Atlas]

I thought Fardy and Beirne were head and shoulders above everyone else on the field.

The lineout steal from Fardy followed by the hold up and steal from Beirne followed by the charge down, regather and drive for the line from Fardy was brilliant piece of play from both players.

Given the replay is in 2 weeks it will largely be the same 2 squads and I'm sure the Scarlets will fancy doing better than 4-1.

On one hand, today was a good day with a lot of youngsters stepping up and on the other, it was a missed opportunity.

Massive game in 2 weeks time

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[artaneboy]

My man of the match definitely Fardy
Great operator at the line out and led the pack by example
Jordi made some super turnovers and seemed to be designated for all the non glam jobs
Lowe played well going forward took his tries well and kicked very effectively
Would like to see him work on his tackling though - he made one big hit but seemed to slide off the tackle and the Scarlets made huge yardage , at other times he did not seem to have the appetite to take his man.dont really understand this as he counter rucked really aggressively at other times
Lowe and Adam B are big guys if they tackled with say the aggressiveness of Isa ( who is considerably smaller ) they would level opposition players
Nice to see Frawley ( ? First cap not certain about name )
nail his place kicks with such composure

Fardy was great- as almost always. But Lowe was electric both with and without the ball. I saw little wrong with his tackle technique. There was a definite sense of positive expectancy whenever he got- or was ear the ball. And he didn’t disappoint. Deserving Man of the Match.





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[Peg Leg]

TB was man of the match

[Peg Leg]

Can i just say here RE depth, we are missing the best back row (6,7&8) in ireland due to injury. We would typically expect to have 2 of leavy, VdF & Conan with the team. Also, Ryan and Porter under any other coach would be with Leinster, Joe just happens to be down with the kids.

[hugonaut]

Just watching a recording of the first half, and extremely impressed by Josh Murphy at No6 for us. Obviously he didn't have the all-round game and big moments that his opposite number Tadhg Beirne showed, but he has got an enormous appetite for work and the competitive and abrasive attitude you're looking for in a pro blindside. Couple that with a prototypical modern blindside build [197cm and 106kg] and the building blocks are there for a really good Leinster career.

[hugonaut]

Also, seeing as we won and it's not cribbing after a loss ... John Lacey is an appalling ref.

I was talking to another pro ref a couple of months ago, and he was incredulous about how Lacey keeps on getting appointments. He pointed out how many penalties he gives in every game, and how he can't actually control a game by figuring out what the key penalty issues are and then issuing a card to break that pattern.

[artaneboy]

Also, seeing as we won and it's not cribbing after a loss ... John Lacey is an appalling ref.

I was talking to another pro ref a couple of months ago, and he was incredulous about how Lacey keeps on getting appointments. He pointed out how many penalties he gives in every game, and how he can't actually control a game by figuring out what the key penalty issues are and then issuing a card to break that pattern.

It wasn’t Clancy’s best game, he was inconsistent (to our disadvantage) in offside at the breakdown. Cost us at least a couple of penalties. But generally most if the time, I think he’s okay: not great- but not Clancy-terrible either.

Interesting to hear from the pro ref on sorting out the main infringement issues with yellow cards. I’d genuinely be interested to see where that has worked on a consistent (that word again!) basis for one of the better refs. My non-expert view had been of two basic styles of referring- the Nigel style of “free-glowing empathy”- sometimes appearing to make up rules or ignore them depending on that feel. The other is the rigid staccato, but no less erratic style if the aforementioned Clancy. There’s an online tutorial there for all us amateurs.

[wixfjord]

It'd be a waste of time.

Sorry?

The question stands. You said Byrne only looks good behind a dominant pack. I'd disagree there, but I'd also say that even if that is the case, Carbery hasn't shown anything different.

So could you back up your point with an example?

I'm afraid as I made no reference to the type of pack Carberry needs to play well that I'll have to refer you to your own research to back up whatever point it is you are trying to make.

Indeed, you made reference to the type of pack Byrne can play behind, (which is incorrect, but let's leave that aside).

So does that mean you judge Carbery by the same standards?

[wixfjord]

Without McGrath starting against Sarries, I think we can kiss a SF goodbye tbh. 6 weeks though, so hopefully he'll be grand.

McCarthy had a nice cameo when he came on. Does the nuts and bolts pretty well.

Maybe. But certainly not because McGrath is playing better than JGP and the latter would weaken the team. Jamison is more than capable of filling the SH role.

But possibly indirectly because that “foreigner” rule would mean we would have to leave Lowe or Fardy out. After today, the huge value of both is ever more evident.


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He's capable of filling the role alright, but Sarries would be the exact type of team that you wouldn't ideally want JGP starting against. Type of game that really wouldn't suit him.

JGP and McCarthy is obviously a huge step down on McGrath and JGP.

[curates_egg]

Also, seeing as we won and it's not cribbing after a loss ... John Lacey is an appalling ref.

I was talking to another pro ref a couple of months ago, and he was incredulous about how Lacey keeps on getting appointments. He pointed out how many penalties he gives in every game, and how he can't actually control a game by figuring out what the key penalty issues are and then issuing a card to break that pattern.

It wasn’t Clancy’s best game, he was inconsistent (to our disadvantage) in offside at the breakdown. Cost us at least a couple of penalties. But generally most if the time, I think he’s okay: not great- but not Clancy-terrible either.

Interesting to hear from the pro ref on sorting out the main infringement issues with yellow cards. I’d genuinely be interested to see where that has worked on a consistent (that word again!) basis for one of the better refs. My non-expert view had been of two basic styles of referring- the Nigel style of “free-glowing empathy”- sometimes appearing to make up rules or ignore them depending on that feel. The other is the rigid staccato, but no less erratic style if the aforementioned Clancy. There’s an online tutorial there for all us amateurs.

Clancy is a terribly biased ref (like FitzGimpon, Munster branch and just loves to screw over Leinster), but he wasn't reffing us last night, it was Lacey.
For me, Lacey is a bad ref, but not as biased as the aforementioned Munster refs. He did seem to be itching to let Scarlets back into the game, but we should have been better able to manage it.

To me, they looked to be illegally scrummaging for the scrum penalties they got: stepping sideways and then driving in on Heffernan. However, you would feel any other of our scrummaging units would have dealt with it. Certainly, Bent wouldn't have let them get away with it more than once.
Hopefully, Heffernan learns from it. Hopefully, the IRFU do too, and give us Porter back next time.

[wixfjord]

No chance we were getting Porter back for this one given Furlong is carrying a knock and how much he played against Italy.
Rightly so too.

I'd say we did pretty well with Ireland callbacks yesterday in key areas.

[Atlas]

A penalty was given against Fardy half way through the second half, for what looked on the big screen, like a perfectly good clear out at the ruck.

Does anyone know what the penalty was for?

[LeRouxIsPHat]

A penalty was given against Fardy half way through the second half, for what looked on the big screen, like a perfectly good clear out at the ruck.

Does anyone know what the penalty was for?

Think it was contact with the head. Looked harsh to me, and there needs to be more thought put into the positions players put themselves in that means clear outs like that are the only option IMO.

[curates_egg]

No chance we were getting Porter back for this one given Furlong is carrying a knock and how much he played against Italy.
Rightly so too.

I'd say we did pretty well with Ireland callbacks yesterday in key areas.

As far as I remember, subs and fringe squad players used to be released to get game time, in these "rest weeks".
I accept that, from an IRFU perspective, their sole interest is in Ireland at the 6 Nations but they have totally cannibalised us this year.

Despite all the blather about our depth, we have 4 props, 1 hooker, 2 second rows, 3 back rows, 1 scrum half, 1 outhalf, 1 Joey Carbery and 3 back three players with Ireland - we got 4 of them back; coupled with injuries to 1 hooker, 4 back rows, 3 centres (now 4)...and now McGrath.
It is hugely disruptive. I think the IRFU could do more to balance the scales.

I know that, in the circumstances, we were not going to get Porter back for this one but, assuming Furlong is ok, I hope we get Porter back for the next one. As we will have to pick between Lowe and Fardy, to accommodate JGP, we definitely need an international replacement for them.

[Peg Leg]

A penalty was given against Fardy half way through the second half, for what looked on the big screen, like a perfectly good clear out at the ruck.

Does anyone know what the penalty was for?

Accidental contact with the head

[Oldschool]

Indeed, you made reference to the type of pack Byrne can play behind, (which is incorrect, but let's leave that aside).

So does that mean you judge Carbery by the same standards?

It means that when I see a dog with a bone I leave him to it.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Also, seeing as we won and it's not cribbing after a loss ... John Lacey is an appalling ref.

I was talking to another pro ref a couple of months ago, and he was incredulous about how Lacey keeps on getting appointments. He pointed out how many penalties he gives in every game, and how he can't actually control a game by figuring out what the key penalty issues are and then issuing a card to break that pattern.

Think it was yesterday's game (but may be confusing it with a recent one) where a scrum was going forward and the ball was at the back but the scrum was breaking up a bit. The scrumhalf just kept looking at Lacey who did/said nothing, and then eventually gave a penalty without actually indicating what it was for. It was quite clear he hadn't a clue what had happened or what he should do, but felt pressure to do something so gave a penalty just because one team was going forward.

There's also usually one or two instances in a game where he'll shout "hands away now"...but the ball is turned over and then shouts "turnover is good". I can't understand how he gets away with that.

Lastly, I've said this many times but the thing the most annoys me about a ref is when you can't talk to them. Instead of acting as if he's a part of the game, his attitude gives the impression that it's him against the world, like a teacher that people dread having.

[Oldschool]

A penalty was given against Fardy half way through the second half, for what looked on the big screen, like a perfectly good clear out at the ruck.

Does anyone know what the penalty was for?

The penalty was for a perfectly good clear out.

[wixfjord]

Indeed, you made reference to the type of pack Byrne can play behind, (which is incorrect, but let's leave that aside).

So does that mean you judge Carbery by the same standards?

It means that when I see a dog with a bone I leave him to it.

Your initial description of 'pure nonsense' was apt alright, just not in the way you meant!