The pitch

[RobbieRockBoy]

The pitch is like that because of all the badgers in Donnybrook.. the love to come out on a Sunday especially...

they have a cupla focal as well...

Its a bit early for Harp Robbie????

What the fock are you on about!!!

think about it... all the clues there..

[Flash Gordon]

The pitch is like that because of all the badgers in Donnybrook.. the love to come out on a Sunday especially...

they have a cupla focal as well...

Its a bit early for Harp Robbie????

What the fock are you on about!!!

think about it... all the clues there..

Thought about it, still don't have a clue. Tell you what, I'll have 8 pints of Harp and get back to you.....

[RobbieRockBoy]

Its a bit early for Harp Robbie????

What the fock are you on about!!!

think about it... all the clues there..

Thought about it, still don't have a clue. Tell you what, I'll have 8 pints of Harp and get back to you.....

Tell you Sunday.. in the meantime check out what's written on the Bus garage..

[Dave Cahill]

From D'Indo

Pitch battles hit Leinster and Chelsea


QUESTION: What do Chelsea football club and Leinster rugby club have in common?

Answer: A lousy pitch. In Leinster's case, it is Donnybrook which is now in a state which outdoes the much-criticised Stamford Bridge surface.

At the start of the season, the pitch at Donnybrook was so good that it resembled the centre court at Wimbledon. How times have changed.

The very obvious problem that there are far too many games played on the surface, particularly at this time of year in rain or, in the case of yesterday, snow.

No pitch could survive the huge amount of various school competitions played there in such a short space of time.

Just as well then that Leinster had the option of playing their Heineken Cup, and other important games, at the RDS.

Having said that, if the IRFU had similar funds to Chelsea's billionaire Russian owner Roman Abramovich, things might well be different.

[Uncle Mort]

Mr Cahill, when are you going to realise that the schools are the past, present and future of Leinster Rugby. A pitch matters not, tradition counts for Everything. A pitch can be relaid. For the teams in the schools cups their time is now, they won't get a second chance, they can't be relaid.

[Dave Cahill]

Mr Cahill, when are you going to realise that the schools are the past, present and future of Leinster Rugby. A pitch matters not, tradition counts for Everything. A pitch can be relaid. For the teams in the schools cups their time is now, they won't get a second chance, they can't be relaid.

Let the schools pay for it then. That'll be half a million, cash or bankers draft please. Oh and would you mind coughing up for the ticket sales down the trolley because the IRFU wouldn't let our star names play on the pitch, oh and of course the insurance for those that did play and got knackered. We'll say €750,000. Thanks

[Uncle Mort]

Let the schools pay for it then. That'll be half a million, cash or bankers draft please. Oh and would you mind coughing up for the ticket sales down the trolley because the IRFU wouldn't let our star names play on the pitch, oh and of course the insurance for those that did play and got knackered. We'll say €750,000. Thanks

Oh Mr Cahill, these are schoolboys were talking about. They don't have that much pocket money between them all. You're making the same old mistake that I used to make when it comes to the SCT, it's not about now, it's about the past and the future. The past in that we've always done it this way and the future because it is the only place where our best players of the future will come from. The present doesn't matter - it merely gets in the way. In the same way that our best players of now had their day in the sun then today's schoolboys need their day in the sun and tomorrow's schoolboys will need their day in the sun. After all so many schoolboys stop atfter the schools cups we must accept that it's the pinnicle of any rugby player's career. They deserve the best - they are the game - we the paying public don't and aren't.

[CM]

Best scenario for me would be to explore, if at all possible, redeveloping the RDS for Leinster and that would leave Donnybrook, as is, to host all the school's matches they wanted. I know there are issues over developing the RDS that are probably insurmountable but it's in a much better location and a better venue already. I just can't see how Donnybrook can ever be right for the future of Leinster rugby given the location.

[thecoolfreak]

RDS would be a brilliant location for Leinster to set up a new home. However, i thought it will ever happen due to the fsct that it is used for that boring event which is on for only 1 week in the year, the show-jumping

[CM]

RDS would be a brilliant location for Leinster to set up a new home. However, i thought it will ever happen due to the fsct that it is used for that boring event which is on for only 1 week in the year, the show-jumping

I think there might be more to it than that. Can't see how the two can't take place in the same stadium. Surely there's a way to design it that would work? As it is we can get 14,000 in with temporary seating and didn't there used to be a stand opposite the main one, which didn't affect the Horseshow?

[thecoolfreak]

That would mean we would have to use the temporary seating the whole time, because the show jumping uses the spaces where the seating is positioned

[limecat]

That would mean we would have to use the temporary seating the whole time, because the show jumping uses the spaces where the seating is positioned

couldn't we just move the show jumping to donnybrook, it's not as though it'd disimprove the surface

[CM]

That would mean we would have to use the temporary seating the whole time, because the show jumping uses the spaces where the seating is positioned

But does it use the space where the South stand is situated? I've no problem with needing temporary seating for the goaline ends because some CL matches probably wouldn't need them so a situation where we had two decent stands holding maybe 10,000 or more between them would work. There also must be a design that can work around the show jumping.

What areas exactly are used?

[Flash Gordon]

Mr Cahill, when are you going to realise that the schools are the past, present and future of Leinster Rugby. A pitch matters not, tradition counts for Everything. A pitch can be relaid. For the teams in the schools cups their time is now, they won't get a second chance, they can't be relaid.

I couldn't give a fig for tradition frankly. Tradition has only brought Ireland the worst (by far) record of all the original 5 nations teams.

Furthermore, I buy my season ticket at Leinster because I want to see my team play quality rugby and do their utmost to win things. I don't want to see games played in a quagmire or dustbowl because a bunch of 14 year old kids have been running around playing the first round of a JCT match on it. By all means play the final games there, but 40 games in 2 months is just ridiculous and its a further financial drain on Leinster - 500K is about 15% of the provinces budget - and when you add up the cost of hiring the RDS on top, you're moving to 20-25%. This affects our ability to sign players and to be competitive at the highest level.

The IRFU is losing money and the break even by 2009 plan is dependent on winning championships and getting to the semi-final of the world cup AND stadium deliver on time at 2003 estimated costs (i.e. we won't break even). This means we have to cut costs - so our budget could decrease. That means, Drico, Flash, Shaggy, Super Rob, Felipe etc could end up leaving because we simply can't afford to shell out 500K a year on a new pitch.

As an alternative, why don't they errect temporary stands at the rugby clubs? Belvo, Blackrock etc.....

[apple sourz]

couldn't we just move the show jumping to donnybrook, it's not as though it'd disimprove the surface [/quote]

That was discussed but the horses refused to run on such a bad surface

[Dave Cahill]

Why don't we look for a 5 year lease on the place. The Society only use it twice a year, for the Horse Show and the Spring Show.

[CM]

Tradition has only brought Ireland the worst (by far) record of all the original 5 nations teams.

Yeah, but that was through no fault of the schools game which was the only level we were competitive at in the dark ages. The problem was bridging the gap between schools and internationals and one novel way of doing that was starting to pick players that were under the age of 25!

Whether it's right to have such a 'professional' setup in schools I don't know but it does prepare the players for professional rugby much quicker than if they didn't have the same schools setup. Part of that 'professional' setup is borne out of the prestige of playing in Donnybrook and Lansdowne. If you take that opportunity away then you lose some of the 'professionalism'. That could be a good thing, I don't know.

What I can't figure out is how there are so many matches. It's not as simple as saying the school's cup is ruining it. Not all of the 1st round matches are played there so how many senior matches are there? 8?10? That's not a massive amount. They should only play the JCT semis and final there plus the league final and probably the section finals. That's it. 20 matches max over the course of 2-3 months

Anyway, who's saying that the pitch will need to be relaid? Whatever about the way it cuts up it's still going to be able to bounce back much better than the old pitch and for all we know this is a teething process. Don't forget the Lansdowne pitch was a mess for the first while.

[Flash Gordon]

Tradition has only brought Ireland the worst (by far) record of all the original 5 nations teams.

Yeah, but that was through no fault of the schools game which was the only level we were competitive at in the dark ages. The problem was bridging the gap between schools and internationals and one novel way of doing that was starting to pick players that were under the age of 25!

Whether it's right to have such a 'professional' setup in schools I don't know but it does prepare the players for professional rugby much quicker than if they didn't have the same schools setup. Part of that 'professional' setup is borne out of the prestige of playing in Donnybrook and Lansdowne. If you take that opportunity away then you lose some of the 'professionalism'. That could be a good thing, I don't know.

What I can't figure out is how there are so many matches. It's not as simple as saying the school's cup is ruining it. Not all of the 1st round matches are played there so how many senior matches are there? 8?10? That's not a massive amount. They should only play the JCT semis and final there plus the league final and probably the section finals. That's it. 20 matches max over the course of 2-3 months

Anyway, who's saying that the pitch will need to be relaid? Whatever about the way it cuts up it's still going to be able to bounce back much better than the old pitch and for all we know this is a teething process. Don't forget the Lansdowne pitch was a mess for the first while.

CM - the pitch actually has holes in it......significant areas are cut up with sections of fairly large "dips"....Knoxy commented on it after the Borders game, Gary Ella didn't actually play some of his players because he said the pitch was dangerous. Its a mess.


I think you're right about retention as an issue - but I think the main reason for retention is the schools system. This because:
1. Young bodies are under too much physical pressure. The U18 team that won the WC included only 2 or 3 players who made it. A large proportion were crocked. I'd also say that there's too much bulk on some young and still growing bones. School kids shouldn't be weight training and/or taking suppliments...
2. Schools rugby is obsessive. Many teenage guys just get sick of it. When you're 14 , training on St. Stephen's day or when your mates are out isn't fun. I know me and my mates stopped playing for a while post school because we'd been training constantly for years. We just got sick of it.
3. There are over 10.000 schools players in Ireland I think. I'd say about 3000 of them are in Leinster - only 15 guys can win the SCT. half of them will be out in the first round.....ultimately for 99% of schools players, the end result of their dedication and training is failure. For 50%, that's at the first hurdle. Psychologically, that's damaging. You can spend 2 or 3 years preparing for a career that could be over in 80 minutes.

So yes, some of the fault is the club system in that it doesn't do enough to recruit and maintain. But schools play a large part in that. This has been particularly the case because the schools have been the only show in town....so effectively, our rugby players have all been from the higher social classes and from certainly areas of Leinster.

So in my view, the schools have failled. And our record speaks for itself.

PS Agree on what you say about later stages being played at Donnybrook.....

[CM]

Knoxy commented on it after the Borders game,

All he said was that it was soft. We hardly had any problems running on the surface, did we?

I can accept it's gotten worse since then but it was fine for the Borders. Didn't have a huge amount of grass but the playing field was very level.

[Flash Gordon]

Knoxy commented on it after the Borders game,

All he said was that it was soft. We hardly had any problems running on the surface, did we?

I can accept it's gotten worse since then but it was fine for the Borders. Didn't have a huge amount of grass but the playing field was very level.

He said it was soft and cut up. And that was before the heavy stuff....I went down to have a look, its a total mess.....