the spoofer wrote:It's like watching kids throw 15 yard passes in a warm up drill and then they can't execute a 5 yard pass when the 7 is looking to kill them. It's about time and space. You have loads in 7's and little in 15's.
If you think a kid needs more development then please put him into real world situations in the AIL rather than the rubbish that is 7's. Hell, if league and 7's was on telly I'd probably watch the league.
This. I'd say 7s actually has a detrimental effect on player's development because it tunes them into situations that will never (or very rarely) happen in a proper 15s game.
I would wager that Stu Lancaster is of the same opinion going on recent interviews with him and his approach to training.
Players getting sloppy because of the extra space, I don't buy that. That's like saying players will pick up bad habits from walking or running half speed through set-plays in training.
The lack of space in 15s makes it difficult to practice things. And if you can't practice, then you can't get better. I'm not sure of the sports science, but I'd imagine the way to improve a skill or technique is to lower the pressure it's performed under until the player can practice good execution, and then incrementally increase the pressure as the skill level improves. I could see 7s being a good way to replicate this procedure before you try out stuff in 15s
Players could become over-specialised if they went off to play World Series 7s for a year or something. I could see somebody struggling to re-adjust to the physicality and lack of space after that, but we're talking about guys going off for a few weeks to play at the lower level that Ireland are currently at. I think there are benefits to be had from that for Leinster
leinsterforever wrote:Players getting sloppy because of the extra space, I don't buy that. That's like saying players will pick up bad habits from walking or running half speed through set-plays in training.
The lack of space in 15s makes it difficult to practice things. And if you can't practice, then you can't get better. I'm not sure of the sports science, but I'd imagine the way to improve a skill or technique is to lower the pressure it's performed under until the player can practice good execution, and then incrementally increase the pressure as the skill level improves. I could see 7s being a good way to replicate this procedure before you try out stuff in 15s
Players could become over-specialised if they went off to play World Series 7s for a year or something. I could see somebody struggling to re-adjust to the physicality and lack of space after that, but we're talking about guys going off for a few weeks to play at the lower level that Ireland are currently at. I think there are benefits to be had from that for Leinster
leinsterforever wrote:Players getting sloppy because of the extra space, I don't buy that. That's like saying players will pick up bad habits from walking or running half speed through set-plays in training.
The lack of space in 15s makes it difficult to practice things. And if you can't practice, then you can't get better. I'm not sure of the sports science, but I'd imagine the way to improve a skill or technique is to lower the pressure it's performed under until the player can practice good execution, and then incrementally increase the pressure as the skill level improves. I could see 7s being a good way to replicate this procedure before you try out stuff in 15s
Players could become over-specialised if they went off to play World Series 7s for a year or something. I could see somebody struggling to re-adjust to the physicality and lack of space after that, but we're talking about guys going off for a few weeks to play at the lower level that Ireland are currently at. I think there are benefits to be had from that for Leinster
They do if it's sustained and becomes a habit. That's what Lancaster's 'unstructured chaos' is all about, replicating the game scenario as closely as possible. That's why you hear so much about KK hurling's notoriously hot and heavy training sessions too.
7s definitely breeds confidence, the likes of Tom Daly have benefited from it, but in terms of skills, it's more like saying Shane Horgan benefited from playing GAA.
mildlyinterested wrote:Anyone who played GAA to a decent level benefited from being a multi sport athlete.
I agree, in fact that's my point.
If Shane Horgan played GAA regularly while also playing for Leinster, that wouldn't have been a positive.
You are what you do regularly, guys that play 7s might benefit from some skills transfer, but many pick up bad habits because it's a different sport. That's why the crossover between the games in terms of players is so minimal.
leinsterforever wrote:Players getting sloppy because of the extra space, I don't buy that. That's like saying players will pick up bad habits from walking or running half speed through set-plays in training.
The lack of space in 15s makes it difficult to practice things. And if you can't practice, then you can't get better. I'm not sure of the sports science, but I'd imagine the way to improve a skill or technique is to lower the pressure it's performed under until the player can practice good execution, and then incrementally increase the pressure as the skill level improves. I could see 7s being a good way to replicate this procedure before you try out stuff in 15s
Players could become over-specialised if they went off to play World Series 7s for a year or something. I could see somebody struggling to re-adjust to the physicality and lack of space after that, but we're talking about guys going off for a few weeks to play at the lower level that Ireland are currently at. I think there are benefits to be had from that for Leinster
I think Adam Byrne said the 7's helped him..
He certainly did, but Dave Cahill says "Its a waste of time that will only be detrimental to their careers." so Adam Byrne must be wrong.
leinsterforever wrote:Players getting sloppy because of the extra space, I don't buy that. That's like saying players will pick up bad habits from walking or running half speed through set-plays in training.
The lack of space in 15s makes it difficult to practice things. And if you can't practice, then you can't get better. I'm not sure of the sports science, but I'd imagine the way to improve a skill or technique is to lower the pressure it's performed under until the player can practice good execution, and then incrementally increase the pressure as the skill level improves. I could see 7s being a good way to replicate this procedure before you try out stuff in 15s
Players could become over-specialised if they went off to play World Series 7s for a year or something. I could see somebody struggling to re-adjust to the physicality and lack of space after that, but we're talking about guys going off for a few weeks to play at the lower level that Ireland are currently at. I think there are benefits to be had from that for Leinster
I think Adam Byrne said the 7's helped him..
He certainly did, but Dave Cahill says "Its a waste of time that will only be detrimental to their careers." so Adam Byrne must be wrong.
leinsterforever wrote:Players getting sloppy because of the extra space, I don't buy that. That's like saying players will pick up bad habits from walking or running half speed through set-plays in training.
The lack of space in 15s makes it difficult to practice things. And if you can't practice, then you can't get better. I'm not sure of the sports science, but I'd imagine the way to improve a skill or technique is to lower the pressure it's performed under until the player can practice good execution, and then incrementally increase the pressure as the skill level improves. I could see 7s being a good way to replicate this procedure before you try out stuff in 15s
Players could become over-specialised if they went off to play World Series 7s for a year or something. I could see somebody struggling to re-adjust to the physicality and lack of space after that, but we're talking about guys going off for a few weeks to play at the lower level that Ireland are currently at. I think there are benefits to be had from that for Leinster
Partly true from the motor control side see Gentile's Taxonomy of Tasks.
True that participation in multiple sports up to a certain age/maturity is linked to better skill acquisition and execution at higher levels of competition.
There is a general theme that movement patterns/skills that aren't quite directly relatable to the sport/task in question don't translate magically.
So Adam Byrne/Tom Daly felt it improved them could be because of higher confidence/ greater aerobic conditioning/ exposure to different environment/etc and so on
It could as easily have had no transferable positive effects or negative ones. I would said sport science would be firmly on the fence about it.
As he is still in the academy for the moment, this is the correct thread...
James Ryan played his 1st game back from injury yesterday and was absolutely brilliant. It was a warm up/trial game for the Irish u20s world cup squad played in St Michaels College. Ryan was playing for an all Ireland team made up mostly of academy and sub-academy players from all 4 provinces against the u20s team selection. He completely turned the game around virtually single handed. From 21 nil down the game ended in a 38 all draw. Jeremy Loughman was also impressive as they powered over for 2 pushover tries in the 2nd half.
In the context of the u20s WC, Conor Dean also showed great spark in his 20 mins.
El Diablo wrote:As he is still in the academy for the moment, this is the correct thread...
James Ryan played his 1st game back from injury yesterday and was absolutely brilliant. It was a warm up/trial game for the Irish u20s world cup squad played in St Michaels College. Ryan was playing for an all Ireland team made up mostly of academy and sub-academy players from all 4 provinces against the u20s team selection. He completely turned the game around virtually single handed. From 21 nil down the game ended in a 38 all draw. Jeremy Loughman was also impressive as they powered over for 2 pushover tries in the 2nd half.
In the context of the u20s WC, Conor Dean also showed great spark in his 20 mins.
Thanks,
Saw you posted elsewhere that you didn't have teamsheets, any players you know who were involved from each team?
James Ryan - Leinster Dev
Jeremy Loughman - Leinster Dev
Conor Dean - Ireland u20
El Diablo wrote:As he is still in the academy for the moment, this is the correct thread...
James Ryan played his 1st game back from injury yesterday and was absolutely brilliant. It was a warm up/trial game for the Irish u20s world cup squad played in St Michaels College. Ryan was playing for an all Ireland team made up mostly of academy and sub-academy players from all 4 provinces against the u20s team selection. He completely turned the game around virtually single handed. From 21 nil down the game ended in a 38 all draw. Jeremy Loughman was also impressive as they powered over for 2 pushover tries in the 2nd half.
In the context of the u20s WC, Conor Dean also showed great spark in his 20 mins.
Ryan being tipped to travel with Ireland Seniors on their summer tour this year
El Diablo wrote:As he is still in the academy for the moment, this is the correct thread...
James Ryan played his 1st game back from injury yesterday and was absolutely brilliant. It was a warm up/trial game for the Irish u20s world cup squad played in St Michaels College. Ryan was playing for an all Ireland team made up mostly of academy and sub-academy players from all 4 provinces against the u20s team selection. He completely turned the game around virtually single handed. From 21 nil down the game ended in a 38 all draw. Jeremy Loughman was also impressive as they powered over for 2 pushover tries in the 2nd half.
In the context of the u20s WC, Conor Dean also showed great spark in his 20 mins.
Ryan being tipped to travel with Ireland Seniors on their summer tour this year
Now thatd be something. And one young set of locks with lots of potential
Retired from babbling. Can be found on twittter @okeeffesimon
El Diablo wrote:As he is still in the academy for the moment, this is the correct thread...
James Ryan played his 1st game back from injury yesterday and was absolutely brilliant. It was a warm up/trial game for the Irish u20s world cup squad played in St Michaels College. Ryan was playing for an all Ireland team made up mostly of academy and sub-academy players from all 4 provinces against the u20s team selection. He completely turned the game around virtually single handed. From 21 nil down the game ended in a 38 all draw. Jeremy Loughman was also impressive as they powered over for 2 pushover tries in the 2nd half.
In the context of the u20s WC, Conor Dean also showed great spark in his 20 mins.
Thanks,
Saw you posted elsewhere that you didn't have teamsheets, any players you know who were involved from each team?
James Ryan - Leinster Dev
Jeremy Loughman - Leinster Dev
Conor Dean - Ireland u20
Anyone else?
I was watching the backrow mostly as that is where I have a personal interest....
Tom deJonge, Richard Dunne, JJO'Dea (munster), Sean Masterson (Connacht)
also Greg McGrath, Charlie Connolly, Rory Mulvihill (I think)
El Diablo wrote:As he is still in the academy for the moment, this is the correct thread...
James Ryan played his 1st game back from injury yesterday and was absolutely brilliant. It was a warm up/trial game for the Irish u20s world cup squad played in St Michaels College. Ryan was playing for an all Ireland team made up mostly of academy and sub-academy players from all 4 provinces against the u20s team selection. He completely turned the game around virtually single handed. From 21 nil down the game ended in a 38 all draw. Jeremy Loughman was also impressive as they powered over for 2 pushover tries in the 2nd half.
In the context of the u20s WC, Conor Dean also showed great spark in his 20 mins.
Thanks,
Saw you posted elsewhere that you didn't have teamsheets, any players you know who were involved from each team?
James Ryan - Leinster Dev
Jeremy Loughman - Leinster Dev
Conor Dean - Ireland u20
Anyone else?
I was watching the backrow mostly as that is where I have a personal interest....
Tom deJonge, Richard Dunne, JJO'Dea (munster), Sean Masterson (Connacht)
also Greg McGrath, Charlie Connolly, Rory Mulvihill (I think)
Thanks.
JJ O'Dea is a Leinter u19 backrow.
Last edited by mildlyinterested on May 9th, 2017, 9:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
Seems a bit soon, wouldn't they be better off with the Emerging Ireland team? (if they're touring this year).
"This is breathless stuff.....it's on again. Contepomi out to Hickie,D'Arcy,Hickie.......................HICKIE FOR THE CORNER! THAT IS AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
