Northampton Saints v Leinster BT Friday 7.45

[riocard911]

It's a joke but it was always going to be.

I don't think it's 100% clear that he intended to land the haymaker on SOB's head, as Sean was falling back. But any thought he wasn't planning to make a blindside clatter at a defenceless player - that ended up intentionally or not giving the player a serious head injury - is bullshit. But it isn't a disgrace anymore because this is what citing panels around the world do.

However, Eddie Jones, Ritchie, Gatland, McGeechan, SCW (who else?) participated willingly in an unprecedented full-court-press media campaign to convince ordinary rugby fans who are worried about head injuries and dirty play that they didn't really see the England captain almost decapitate an opponent. That's the real disgrace.

+1.000,000!!!! Repect to Dallaglio. Although a Charioteer, he at least he'd the courage and character to call a spade a spade!

[outcast eddie]

It's a joke but it was always going to be.

I don't think it's 100% clear that he intended to land the haymaker on SOB's head, as Sean was falling back. But any thought he wasn't planning to make a blindside clatter at a defenceless player - that ended up intentionally or not giving the player a serious head injury - is bullshit. But it isn't a disgrace anymore because this is what citing panels around the world do.

However, Eddie Jones, Ritchie, Gatland, McGeechan, SCW (who else?) participated willingly in an unprecedented full-court-press media campaign to convince ordinary rugby fans who are worried about head injuries and dirty play that they didn't really see the England captain almost decapitate an opponent. That's the real disgrace.

+1.000,000!!!! Repect to Dallaglio. Although a Charioteer, he at least he'd the courage and character to call a spade a spade!

I think you'll find it's 'spide' ...apparently.

[jimbobjoe]

It's a joke but it was always going to be.

I don't think it's 100% clear that he intended to land the haymaker on SOB's head, as Sean was falling back. But any thought he wasn't planning to make a blindside clatter at a defenceless player - that ended up intentionally or not giving the player a serious head injury - is bullshit. But it isn't a disgrace anymore because this is what citing panels around the world do.

However, Eddie Jones, Ritchie, Gatland, McGeechan, SCW (who else?) participated willingly in an unprecedented full-court-press media campaign to convince ordinary rugby fans who are worried about head injuries and dirty play that they didn't really see the England captain almost decapitate an opponent. That's the real disgrace.

+1. Well said

[outcast eddie]

It's a joke but it was always going to be.

I don't think it's 100% clear that he intended to land the haymaker on SOB's head, as Sean was falling back. But any thought he wasn't planning to make a blindside clatter at a defenceless player - that ended up intentionally or not giving the player a serious head injury - is bullshit. But it isn't a disgrace anymore because this is what citing panels around the world do.

However, Eddie Jones, Ritchie, Gatland, McGeechan, SCW (who else?) participated willingly in an unprecedented full-court-press media campaign to convince ordinary rugby fans who are worried about head injuries and dirty play that they didn't really see the England captain almost decapitate an opponent. That's the real disgrace.

Whatever's been publicly said about the incident by the powers that be within English rugby we can all be assured that Hartley has seriously undermined his position on the teamsheet. Personally I love the idea of him captaining the England team on the 18th March, what a gimme.

Lancaster was right to drop him and I'm sure Dylan is sweating the rumours about the next DoR at NH although it appears the current relationship is not the best.

[IanD]

And despite its monumental stupidity, I'm not sure that what Hartley did was actually the stupidest thing Northampton did. Taking Wood off so the hooker could come back on ran it damn close.

Was discussing this after the match. My take is Saints Management knew game was over and decided to rest their Captain. This could be for next weekend or for other matches to come in the AP.

We might get more of an insight when they name the team for Saturday - will they rest other players too.

No Woods for tomorrow night backs up my theory.

Also no Foden or Lawes makes it look like the white flag may not be raised yet but certainly has been unfurled and is ready to go.

[ronk]

Wheeling out Ian Ritchie followed by Roger Uttley to defend Hartley on the basis that SO'B was falling into the tackle is playing with fire.

RFU and IRFU and other Union know very well that there is a major problem of perception with our game at present. The NZ thuggery, coupled with medics apparently ignoring the knock-out of a player, followed by what appeared to be a "clothesline assault" by the English Captain are presenting a game of violence which remains unpoliced and will do so until somebody gets seriously injured.

Wake up Administrators and smell the coffee, and all the others aromas some not so pleasant. Hartley is not irreplaceable but the reputation of the game is.

Absolutely agree. Having been a bit behind rugby, American Football is already ahead and streaking away in terms of head injury assessments. They were already ahead in terms of dangerous play.

For HIAs and the like, a new NFL report was recently commissioned, the results of which are extensive and make hard reading for the NFL in terms of its recommendations. But one key recommendation is gaining traction, that neutral doctors are needed at games to take away any inherent confirmation bias in assessments. Naturally, this is very sensitive as to adopt that recommendation is to acknowledge that doctors are making bad decisions for their patients, in favour of their paymasters. "Show me evidence doctors are biased" is the cry around the NFL owners ring.

Well, after the Northampton antics, evidence wouldn't be that hard to find in rugby. Neutral doctors might have to be the way it goes, but I don't see world rugby being prepared to foot the bill. Maybe teams would have to pay into a fund, from which matchday docs are appointed and the clubs would be expected to pare down on their own medical costs?

As for Hartley, that's not a laws-based discussion. It's about the image of the game. Guys who are bad for the game's image to the extent Hartley is should just be squeezed out of the sport. Bans help in lowering Hartley's contract value, but seemingly not enough. Clubs/RFU need to stop using the press to dilute his toxicity and the press need to stop being mouthpieces.

American football has independent doctors in addition to team ones. Independent oversight dials back temptations to turn a blind eye.

What American Football has done right is fine players. Pros don't like getting hit in their pockets. Especially when there's a cap.

Hartley has been controversial for hardly playing club rugby recently. Now he's sitting out club rugby to be ready for internationals.

A paid holiday punishes his club, not him. He's safely part of the international squad.

[Ruckedtobits]

Hartley gets 6 weeks & will be available for 6 Nations

http://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/38298026

Hartley now named in English Squad for two-day get together. My clear understanding was that a Disciplinary Ban was a suspension from any rugby - related activity. Has this changed or has World Rugby no cojones at all

[simonokeeffe]

Hartley gets 6 weeks & will be available for 6 Nations

http://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/38298026

Hartley now named in English Squad for two-day get together. My clear understanding was that a Disciplinary Ban was a suspension from any rugby - related activity. Has this changed or has World Rugby no cojones at all

no theyre still allowed train, just not play matches of any kind