Dave Cahill wrote:Madigan wasn't staying with Leinster. His Leinster career ended the day Johnny re-signed. The mistake was not doing everything possible to keep him in the Irish system. He wanted to play for Ireland, he had to play to play for Ireland, and he had to play in Ireland to play for Ireland and ironically the only team he couldn't do that with was Leinster. Whilst he may have had issues moving south, moving west would have had real potential for him.
and a central deal may have done that
way both are being treated now will put the kibosh on anyone with ANY international ambitions moving out of the Irish system
Retired from babbling. Can be found on twittter @okeeffesimon
Madigan would have gotten caps staying in Leinster. He was better off competing with Sexton than Gopperth. His move made sense, Munster keep signing players in the same position if they have half a chance. He only had to look at JJ, why not back himself in France. In a few years he could get pulled back like Sexton was and if the talent coming through gets ahead of him well then at least he's moved on instead of squandering his best years riding the pine.
Moore and Madigan are just disadvantaged enough by their absence that they've slipped from view. Moore was injured enough at the wrong times that he wasn't going to be worth bringing in and Madigan might have been called if it weren't for Carbery's form.
Dave Cahill wrote:Madigan wasn't staying with Leinster. His Leinster career ended the day Johnny re-signed. The mistake was not doing everything possible to keep him in the Irish system. He wanted to play for Ireland, he had to play to play for Ireland, and he had to play in Ireland to play for Ireland and ironically the only team he couldn't do that with was Leinster. Whilst he may have had issues moving south, moving west would have had real potential for him.
I can understand that he would have questioned whether that was a progression. Last year was an absolute outlier (thus far) for Connacht, the stadium, the crowds, facilities and budget are a mile away from what he was used to and Connacht has very little recent history of Irish representation. Think it would be hard to rationalise to yourself that Connacht was anything other than a step down for him. Even now with the benefit of hindsight, Connacht lie 8th in the league, will find it tough to make Champions Cup rugby next year and their coach is on his way out.
If you can move beyond the rivalry as many players have done it would have made a whole pile of sense for him to join the turnips.
Dave Cahill wrote:His international career is currently over. It wouldn't have been if he stayed in Ireland.
Well yes absolutely. But that's the trade off he made, either go to Bordeaux or bench for Ireland (possibly). The more logical move would have been for him to go to Munster where you have both the facilities, set up, stadium and you get to play for Ireland.
Dave Cahill wrote:His international career is currently over. It wouldn't have been if he stayed in Ireland.
Well yes absolutely. But that's the trade off he made, either go to Bordeaux or bench for Ireland (possibly). The more logical move would have been for him to go to Munster where you have both the facilities, set up, stadium and you get to play for Ireland.
Was the option ever put to him? I don't think so.
Also, at the time he left, Munster didn't have the facilities, the set up was third rate, and the coaching team was a shambles
Dave Cahill wrote:His international career is currently over. It wouldn't have been if he stayed in Ireland.
Well yes absolutely. But that's the trade off he made, either go to Bordeaux or bench for Ireland (possibly). The more logical move would have been for him to go to Munster where you have both the facilities, set up, stadium and you get to play for Ireland.
Was the option ever put to him? I don't think so.
Also, at the time he left, Munster didn't have the facilities, the set up was third rate, and the coaching team was a shambles
Not sure I agree with you on the set up - the stadium and the training facilities at UL are as good as any club in Europe. Would agree with you on the coaching set up though - which may haveunderstandably impacted his decision to move. I believe the Munster option was part of the conversation on his future.
Flash Gordon wrote:
Not sure I agree with you on the set up - the stadium and the training facilities at UL are as good as any club in Europe. Would agree with you on the coaching set up though - which may haveunderstandably impacted his decision to move. I believe the Munster option was part of the conversation on his future.
For the members of the squad in Limerick, the facilities at UL were great, as were the facilities for the members of the squad in Cork at CIT. However, no matter how good a passer Madigan is, 60 odd miles is a bit of an ask - and thats why the set up was third rate at the time.
He is having a great time, loads of dosh, quaffing wine and getting a free ride in the Top 14 every so often. Better than being abused by Mickey Mouse coaches who don't know their arse from their elbow. O lucky man.
Raydollard wrote:He is having a great time, loads of dosh, quaffing wine and getting a free ride in the Top 14 every so often. Better than being abused by Mickey Mouse coaches who don't know their arse from their elbow. O lucky man.
I don't know, I reckon he'd been figured out by the time he left, his big wind up for the long pass and his step were not really as effective. Imho it was his goal kicking that was keeping him relevant.
Flash Gordon wrote:
Not sure I agree with you on the set up - the stadium and the training facilities at UL are as good as any club in Europe. Would agree with you on the coaching set up though - which may haveunderstandably impacted his decision to move. I believe the Munster option was part of the conversation on his future.
For the members of the squad in Limerick, the facilities at UL were great, as were the facilities for the members of the squad in Cork at CIT. However, no matter how good a passer Madigan is, 60 odd miles is a bit of an ask - and thats why the set up was third rate at the time.
Raydollard wrote:He is having a great time, loads of dosh, quaffing wine and getting a free ride in the Top 14 every so often. Better than being abused by Mickey Mouse coaches who don't know their arse from their elbow. O lucky man.
I don't know, I reckon he'd been figured out by the time he left, his big wind up for the long pass and his step were not really as effective. Imho it was his goal kicking that was keeping him relevant.
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That and I don't think he has the top 2 inches for a starting 10 berth at a top club. I like Mads a lot. You can't fault him for effort or commitment, and he does have a really strong array of skills. But he really should look to focus on a move out 1 to 12. He could do really well as a second five-eight type 12. Look at Reid, played a lot at 10 coming through but his move to 12 has made a huge difference to his career. I just worry that Mads has wasted too much of his career chasing a starting 10 slot that maybe he's just not suited to.
Saw him recently against (I think) Lyon. As was always his strength, he changed the speed of them completely when he came in. Only thing was they hardly involved him. Kept using forwards as first receiver. To me he looked a bit fed up with the stodgy fest, it didn't look fun. I don't think the French league is much of a place to develop as a player, but I did get the impression that if he came back here you'd be getting a more mature player, with all the skills that he had anyway. i.e maybe the making of him.
Madigan can't control a game. Great ball player but you'll never win a title with him playing 10. I think he'd be a better 9,12 or 13. Connacht's gameplay might have suited him though
Dave Cahill wrote:His international career is currently over. It wouldn't have been if he stayed in Ireland.
Well yes absolutely. But that's the trade off he made, either go to Bordeaux or bench for Ireland (possibly). The more logical move would have been for him to go to Munster where you have both the facilities, set up, stadium and you get to play for Ireland.
Think he was offered a move south but I, like many others, was relieved he didn't take it. He's a talented enough footballer but just hasn't got the game control to be top class. All things considered I don't think he's a major loss to Irish rugby. Jackson's far better, and based on what we've seen of them this season, Carbery and Bleyendaal are better too.
Amazing how things have changed so quickly though. At the time he was offered a move Holland would have been on the cusp of breaking through and Tyler B was a sicknote who looked like being a disaster of a signing.
Raydollard wrote:He is having a great time, loads of dosh, quaffing wine and getting a free ride in the Top 14 every so often. Better than being abused by Mickey Mouse coaches who don't know their arse from their elbow. O lucky man.
I don't know, I reckon he'd been figured out by the time he left, his big wind up for the long pass and his step were not really as effective. Imho it was his goal kicking that was keeping him relevant.
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Agree. Jackson had already overtaken him (even if Joe was slow to acknowledge it in squads) and with Carbery in now he'd be even further down the pecking order.
The guy should have been a scrum half, not a 10 or a 12. Wonder if his contract says anything about him being played at 9 in France. I'd have thought they might try it given how he's out of favour at 10.
Raydollard wrote:He is having a great time, loads of dosh, quaffing wine and getting a free ride in the Top 14 every so often. Better than being abused by Mickey Mouse coaches who don't know their arse from their elbow. O lucky man.
I don't know, I reckon he'd been figured out by the time he left, his big wind up for the long pass and his step were not really as effective. Imho it was his goal kicking that was keeping him relevant.
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Agree. Jackson had already overtaken him (even if Joe was slow to acknowledge it in squads) and with Carbery in now he'd be even further down the pecking order.
The guy should have been a scrum half, not a 10 or a 12. Wonder if his contract says anything about him being played at 9 in France. I'd have thought they might try it given how he's out of favour at 10.
As a signed up member of the madser to 9 effort I'm fully in agreement in that regard. Don't think Joe ever needed to be convinced wrt him v Jackson, if J10 was unavailable Jackson started. Madigan just provided more cover from the bench than Jackson.
Think we'll be talking about his potential long after he retires from a very successful career in its own right, which is quite strange.
