Toner & ?

[CiaranIrl]

How often has he played for them? He's well behind Kruis, Itoje, Hamilton, Skelton anyway.

[lummix]

What about jack Conan as a second row. He's 6 foot 4. Nearly 18 stone and with heaslip signing on for another 3 years I think we will lose him to another province if we don't do something.

[22dropout]

What about jack Conan as a second row. He's 6 foot 4. Nearly 18 stone and with heaslip signing on for another 3 years I think we will lose him to another province if we don't do something.

If you're not 6''6 or taller you're not a 2nd row option in my book

[Oldschoolsocks]

What about jack Conan as a second row. He's 6 foot 4. Nearly 18 stone and with heaslip signing on for another 3 years I think we will lose him to another province if we don't do something.

If you're not 6''6 or taller you're not a 2nd row option in my book

Brad Thorne - 6'5"

[simonokeeffe]

What about jack Conan as a second row. He's 6 foot 4. Nearly 18 stone and with heaslip signing on for another 3 years I think we will lose him to another province if we don't do something.

If you're not 6''6 or taller you're not a 2nd row option in my book

Brad Thorne - 6'5"

Mike McCarthy 6'5

Tadhg Beirne is getting rave reviews all over the place at Scarlets

[22dropout]

You're going to get exceptions to the rule of course. I know Leinster a few years back had a route 66 initiative where they were asking any lads 18-21 who also measured at 6ft 6 or taller to come in for a trial even without any rugby playing experience. They clearly see it as a mark to work by.

[Oldschoolsocks]

You're going to get exceptions to the rule of course. I know Leinster a few years back had a route 66 initiative where they were asking any lads 18-21 who also measured at 6ft 6 or taller to come in for a trial even without any rugby playing experience. They clearly see it as a mark to work by.

To be fair the Brad Thorne response was a bit tongue in cheek, but using this example, it does show how a coach with vision will compromise having two line out options in the second row for what can be brought to other aspects on the pitch.

And to be clear, is much rather we keep our Jack at 8 or 6, he's proven himself to be very effective there already.




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[ronk]

Tall backrows aren't automatically good locks, they rarely are. Faster locks rarely make good backrows. There's a common skill set and physical demands that allows some crossover for a small range of hybrid players but they almost always settle in one.

Players move because the requirements of the game (& young bodies) change as the they move up the age ranks.

Ireland and Leinster need an 8 as good as Conan. He'd never be nearly as good if we tried to fit him in at lock.

Ruddock confuses me a little. Maybe they're onto something but maybe it's more about getting another backrow out there and available in the big games.

[neiliog93]

Tall backrows aren't automatically good locks, they rarely are. Faster locks rarely make good backrows. There's a common skill set and physical demands that allows some crossover for a small range of hybrid players but they almost always settle in one.

Players move because the requirements of the game (& young bodies) change as the they move up the age ranks.

Ireland and Leinster need an 8 as good as Conan. He'd never be nearly as good if we tried to fit him in at lock.

Ruddock confuses me a little. Maybe they're onto something but maybe it's more about getting another backrow out there and available in the big games.

I think it's a combination of accommodating our surfeit of backrowers and dealing with our lack of adequate second rows.

[goreyguy]

How often has he played for them? He's well behind Kruis, Itoje, Hamilton, Skelton anyway.

not often..

[goreyguy]

There are several very good second row prospects in sub academy and school.. none that I would put in the James Ryan bracket though.

My guess I the player you heard about is Charlie Ryan, who recently captained ireland u18. But I'd be excited about several lads at that position in the underage section. In 5 years time leinster should have no worries at lock

A follow up on this, there are 4 second rows in the sub academy:
Jack Regan(UCD/Birr RFC) - involved with Ireland u20
Oisin Dowling(Lansdowne/St. Michaels) - involved with Ireland u20
Aaron Browne(Old Wesley/Roscrea/Birr RFC) - currently injured
Cormac Daly(Navan/North Kildare RFC) - started for Leinster Development versus Ireland u20

With 4 obvious prospects still in school:
Jack Dunne(St. Michaels)
Charlie Ryan(Blackrock)
Adam Melia(Terenure)
Ryan Baird(St. Michaels)

[simonokeeffe]

You're going to get exceptions to the rule of course. I know Leinster a few years back had a route 66 initiative where they were asking any lads 18-21 who also measured at 6ft 6 or taller to come in for a trial even without any rugby playing experience. They clearly see it as a mark to work by.

I jest
A short lock combo is not a good thing either (something Connacht suffered a lot with before) and if we keep SOB at 6 we dont have much tall timber in the backrow

[goreyguy]

You can get away with one lock under 6'6, assuming he can necessary bulk without losing his athleticism.. don't think two locks under 6'6 work for elite teams.

[jezzer]

Ruddock confuses me a little. Maybe they're onto something but maybe it's more about getting another backrow out there and available in the big games.

The guy is a physical monster up close. He's veering into Hulk territory. But it's something I've often said about him that you don't really see that power translate itself on the pitch that often. He can look underpowered at times in carrying and tackling. Maybe the strength that he has is best used being pushed through his body laterally in scrum and maul. Haven't a clue. But like Ronk, both on height and the seeming lack of power for his physical bulk has me scratching the noggin a bit.

I still don't understand the treatment of Kearney. He had one bad game this season and the rest fo the time has comfortably looked our second best lock. I can only assume it's a personality issue or work ethic problem or something else that shows up off the pitch. Whatever it is, it needs to be sorted because there's no doubt in my mind he's our best foil for Dev.

Molony gets talked up, but I think he gets a lot of credit for his excellent angry face and the occasional splash play. Whenever he's in, there's a noticeable drop-off in power in scrum and maul. He's young, think of Toner back in his early days and the level he's at now seemed a bit like a pipe dream (though I was always on the Dev bandwagon, which was tall but not very long).

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Kearney definitely had a shoulder niggle that he couldn't shake at the start of the season. Don't know what the story is now though. If he still has it then I'd rather he stepped out and got it sorted, although maybe that's not possible.

[simonokeeffe]

Kearney definitely had a shoulder niggle that he couldn't shake at the start of the season. Don't know what the story is now though. If he still has it then I'd rather he stepped out and got it sorted, although maybe that's not possible.

it definitely got mentioned in at least one of the injury updates, but thats also the type of thing that can get into a players head

[Armchair]

There are several very good second row prospects in sub academy and school.. none that I would put in the James Ryan bracket though.

My guess I the player you heard about is Charlie Ryan, who recently captained ireland u18. But I'd be excited about several lads at that position in the underage section. In 5 years time leinster should have no worries at lock

A follow up on this, there are 4 second rows in the sub academy:
Jack Regan(UCD/Birr RFC) - involved with Ireland u20
Oisin Dowling(Lansdowne/St. Michaels) - involved with Ireland u20
Aaron Browne(Old Wesley/Roscrea/Birr RFC) - currently injured
Cormac Daly(Navan/North Kildare RFC) - started for Leinster Development versus Ireland u20

With 4 obvious prospects still in school:
Jack Dunne(St. Michaels)
Charlie Ryan(Blackrock)
Adam Melia(Terenure)
Ryan Baird(St. Michaels)

Not overly convinced by Jack Reagan to be honest very ordinary player except for his height, Dowling is better around the pitch but would say his future is as a 6 and not as a 2nd row

[goreyguy]

There are several very good second row prospects in sub academy and school.. none that I would put in the James Ryan bracket though.

My guess I the player you heard about is Charlie Ryan, who recently captained ireland u18. But I'd be excited about several lads at that position in the underage section. In 5 years time leinster should have no worries at lock

A follow up on this, there are 4 second rows in the sub academy:
Jack Regan(UCD/Birr RFC) - involved with Ireland u20
Oisin Dowling(Lansdowne/St. Michaels) - involved with Ireland u20
Aaron Browne(Old Wesley/Roscrea/Birr RFC) - currently injured
Cormac Daly(Navan/North Kildare RFC) - started for Leinster Development versus Ireland u20

With 4 obvious prospects still in school:
Jack Dunne(St. Michaels)
Charlie Ryan(Blackrock)
Adam Melia(Terenure)
Ryan Baird(St. Michaels)

Not overly convinced by Jack Reagan to be honest very ordinary player except for his height, Dowling is better around the pitch but would say his future is as a 6 and not as a 2nd row

Going to wait and see how they go for Ireland u20, before writing either off as potential academy players. If I had to guess now, both will make the academy next season.

A certain number of players from every age grade group will make academy, Regan and Dowling are two of the more highly rated players in the 1997 age group, both having already played for Leinster A.

[Peg Leg]

A follow up on this, there are 4 second rows in the sub academy:
Jack Regan(UCD/Birr RFC) - involved with Ireland u20
Oisin Dowling(Lansdowne/St. Michaels) - involved with Ireland u20
Aaron Browne(Old Wesley/Roscrea/Birr RFC) - currently injured
Cormac Daly(Navan/North Kildare RFC) - started for Leinster Development versus Ireland u20

With 4 obvious prospects still in school:
Jack Dunne(St. Michaels)
Charlie Ryan(Blackrock)
Adam Melia(Terenure)
Ryan Baird(St. Michaels)

Not overly convinced by Jack Reagan to be honest very ordinary player except for his height, Dowling is better around the pitch but would say his future is as a 6 and not as a 2nd row

Going to wait and see how they go for Ireland u20, before writing either off as potential academy players.

I'd recommend a trip to the doctor GG, not like you at all.

[goreyguy]

I'd recommend a trip to the doctor GG, not like you at all.