Should Leinster try and sign Tadhg Beirne?

[mildlyinterested]

What do you make of the quote from Pivac below? Looks bad for the Leinster coaching team but not surprising judging on how both teams play.

When we got him, he was very enthusiastic," Scarlets coach Wayne Pivac told the Irish Independent this week.

Perseverance "His skills needed to be worked on, his pass, catch skills. We train the forwards to run into spaces. He's now doing very well after working on that skill set.

Well under MOC we didn't exactly run into spaces.. and until Lancaster came in we certainly had some gaps in the pass/catch area.

[Dave Cahill]

What do you make of the quote from Pivac below? Looks bad for the Leinster coaching team but not surprising judging on how both teams play.

When we got him, he was very enthusiastic," Scarlets coach Wayne Pivac told the Irish Independent this week.

Perseverance "His skills needed to be worked on, his pass, catch skills. We train the forwards to run into spaces. He's now doing very well after working on that skill set.

Well under MOC we didn't exactly run into spaces.. and until Lancaster came in we certainly had some gaps in the pass/catch area.

Explain the rest so? Maybe Tadhg was sick the day that the rest of his generation, some of whom are now Lions, most of whom are current internationals, did passing and catching.

[dropkick]

There are always exceptions to the rule. Some players are naturally talented which you can see at underage level. Others need good coaching to help them reach the required level.


What's most interesting is Pivac talking about forwards running into space. That's the opposite to what Leinster have been doing this season and the end of last season. Just watch last weekends matches involving Leinster and Scarlets to see the difference in coaching.

[CiaranIrl]

There are always exceptions to the rule. Some players are naturally talented which you can see at underage level. Others need good coaching to help them reach the required level.


What's most interesting is Pivac talking about forwards running into space. That's the opposite to what Leinster have been doing this season and the end of last season. Just watch last weekends matches involving Leinster and Scarlets to see the difference in coaching.

So, just so I'm clear: If you don't have skills, it's the coaches fault, but if you do have skills, it's because of natural talent. Is that right? Good to know.

[mildlyinterested]

Explain the rest so? Maybe Tadhg was sick the day that the rest of his generation, some of whom are now Lions, most of whom are current internationals, did passing and catching.

skills do not stay static, they need to be maintained even if excellent.
some players are more talented than others are retain skills easier or pick up certain skills easier.

the majority of Leinster players skill levels dropped significantly under MOC.

And of course there is individual responsibility.

Academy forwards from 1992 age group:

Tadhg Furlong
Tahdg Beirne
Jack Conan
Jordan Coghlan
Conor Gilsenan

[dropkick]

There are always exceptions to the rule. Some players are naturally talented which you can see at underage level. Others need good coaching to help them reach the required level.


What's most interesting is Pivac talking about forwards running into space. That's the opposite to what Leinster have been doing this season and the end of last season. Just watch last weekends matches involving Leinster and Scarlets to see the difference in coaching.

So, just so I'm clear: If you don't have skills, it's the coaches fault, but if you do have skills, it's because of natural talent. Is that right? Good to know.

I'm saying both natural ability and coaching matter. You can't point to one or two individuals as proof of the quality of coaching but rather look at the whole group. It's about getting the best out of players.


It doesn't mean Leinster are bad in a certain area. It just means the Scarlets are better in that area eg attacking rugby.

[Dave Cahill]

the majority of Leinster players skill levels dropped significantly under MOC.

The majority of Leinster players skill levels dropped significantly once there no longer was a full time skills coach at Leinster.

[simonokeeffe]

There are always exceptions to the rule. Some players are naturally talented which you can see at underage level. Others need good coaching to help them reach the required level.


What's most interesting is Pivac talking about forwards running into space. That's the opposite to what Leinster have been doing this season and the end of last season. Just watch last weekends matches involving Leinster and Scarlets to see the difference in coaching.

I would disagree
A lot of our forwards use footwork to try and beat players/make yards

[wixfjord]

There are always exceptions to the rule. Some players are naturally talented which you can see at underage level. Others need good coaching to help them reach the required level.


What's most interesting is Pivac talking about forwards running into space. That's the opposite to what Leinster have been doing this season and the end of last season. Just watch last weekends matches involving Leinster and Scarlets to see the difference in coaching.

I would disagree
A lot of our forwards use footwork to try and beat players/make yards

I'd say the same as that too. Look at the footwork of the likes of Molony, Ruddock, VDF, Leavy, Conan.
I don't think anyone could accuse Furlong or certainly Cronin of not running into space either.

In fact three of our best tries so far this year have come from forwards making huge breaks from running into space - Daly's third versus Cheetahs and Cronin versus Cardiff.

I seem to remember Conan and Ryan combining for a huge break against Dragons too. Did that lead to ROL's try?

Using one round of games to illustrate a very broad point isn't a great sample size either.

[riocard911]

Interesting interview with Tadhg himself in the middle of this week's Hard Yards podcast: https://www.sportsjoe.ie/rugby/munster- ... lry-138755

[paddyor]

What do you make of the quote from Pivac below? Looks bad for the Leinster coaching team but not surprising judging on how both teams play.

When we got him, he was very enthusiastic," Scarlets coach Wayne Pivac told the Irish Independent this week.

Perseverance "His skills needed to be worked on, his pass, catch skills. We train the forwards to run into spaces. He's now doing very well after working on that skill set.

He basically missed most of the academy. Of course he needed to work on his skills.

[ronk]

What do you make of the quote from Pivac below? Looks bad for the Leinster coaching team but not surprising judging on how both teams play.

When we got him, he was very enthusiastic," Scarlets coach Wayne Pivac told the Irish Independent this week.

Perseverance "His skills needed to be worked on, his pass, catch skills. We train the forwards to run into spaces. He's now doing very well after working on that skill set.

He basically missed most of the academy. Of course he needed to work on his skills.

For him to make a quick impact with Scarlets he needed to be doing a lot well already. They play a different game, he was always going to need to adjust.

He also kicked on when he got a run of games.

[leinsterforever]

For him to make a quick impact with Scarlets he needed to be doing a lot well already. They play a different game, he was always going to need to adjust.

He also kicked on when he got a run of games.

Well, yeah. It's not as if it took him years to develop at the Scarlets. He was being hailed as a great signing a few months after starting playing for them. He must have been pretty good already. That raises questions about Cullen's judgement. A player who has turned out to be so good in a position that Leinster struggle to develop quality players in wasn't worth a development contract or a fourth year in the academy?

[Dave Cahill]

For him to make a quick impact with Scarlets he needed to be doing a lot well already. They play a different game, he was always going to need to adjust.

He also kicked on when he got a run of games.

Well, yeah. It's not as if it took him years to develop at the Scarlets. He was being hailed as a great signing a few months after starting playing for them. He must have been pretty good already. That raises questions about Cullen's judgement. A player who has turned out to be so good in a position that Leinster struggle to develop quality players in wasn't worth a development contract or a fourth year in the academy?

Hindsight is a great thing. His departure was barely noticed apart from regular A team watchers and even at that there was no real sense that we'd lost a major player. He wouldn't be the first player to leave a team like Leinster, go to a team that happens to suit that players precise skillset, then go back to a bigger club and find himself pretty much where he started. Irish rugby squads have been littered with guys like Copeland, Mick Kearney, Fionn Carr etc.