Should Leinster try and sign Tadhg Beirne?

[molloyjh]

That province is an absolute sh*t show run by amateurs. Just something to keep in mind when choosing a destination.

Yeah, but how do you really feel?

[wixfjord]

The original point was more that Munster hasn't really improved the careers of many of the Leinster players who have gone there. I can't think of any Leinster player who really improved and went on to have better international prospects by going to Munster.

Well Jones, Ronan, Keatley are three.
Dowling is another if you're counting Leinstermen rather than Leinster players.

Oliver and Hart are two who may reap the benefits in the future.

If I were Beirne, and leaving aside his links to Leinster positive or negative, at 26 and a half next year I'd want to be joining a side that I'm guaranteed first name on the teamsheet.
At Leinster, that wouldn't be the case, at Munster it would be.

I'd love to see him in blue, but I think it's better for Ireland and him if he moves south.

[curates_egg]

The original point was more that Munster hasn't really improved the careers of many of the Leinster players who have gone there. I can't think of any Leinster player who really improved and went on to have better international prospects by going to Munster.

Well Jones, Ronan, Keatley are three.

I think the only one of those three who you could argue unequivocally improved both his play and prospects is Ronan.

[wixfjord]

The original point was more that Munster hasn't really improved the careers of many of the Leinster players who have gone there. I can't think of any Leinster player who really improved and went on to have better international prospects by going to Munster.

Well Jones, Ronan, Keatley are three.

I think the only one of those three who you could argue unequivocally improved both his play and prospects is Ronan.

Jones and Keatley would be nowhere near an Irish cap had they not left Leinster, if only because they wouldn't have gotten the game time.

Both got regular starting berths in key positions, regular Euro gametime and made Irish teams because of it.

Like Ronan. And Dowling.

Likewise Oliver and Hart's place in the international pecking order automatically shoot up, merely because they're far closer to meaningful game time at a high level than had they stayed at Leinster.

[COYBIB]

That province is an absolute sh*t show run by amateurs. Just something to keep in mind when choosing a destination.

Yeah, but how do you really feel?

To be fair though, I think if you asked most Munster supporters they would say the same thing. Fitzgerald et al are not respected and rightfully so. Like I said, run by amateurs.

[COYBIB]

It would also mean that there would be as many Leinster born players in their senior squad as Limerick ones! Odd that.

Open to correction, but I believe that is not only already the case, but there are more Leinster players than Limerick ones at Munster.

There are only 5 Limerick players in their squad: Sherry, Kilcoyne, Goggin, Earls and Ronan O'Mahony.

There are currently 6 Leinster born players in the Munster squad: Conway, Harte, Keatley, Oliver, Copeland and Flanagan (just announced).

[ronk]

Jones would probably have gotten more gametime if he'd stayed, at least at first. Keatley left for Connacht and played a lot for them.

Beirne is playing in a team that has brought out his talents and would have to displace people in Munster or here.

Some of the guys who struggled on moving to Munster struggled because their strengths didn't play well. There's a reason why Caughlan was such a success and Stander plays mostly at 8. That worked against Copeland.

Kleyn is perfect for them, can do no wrong. They'll go for Beirne because they'll get him cheap and he's Irish. They wouldn't scout his style so quickly and they won't change to suit him. Beirne is a huge success playing to suit a very different team with a very different game plan. The risk factors escalate very quickly if he moves too quickly.

Moving here would also be a large risk but probably less risky. The best move for his game development now is to keep doing what's working at least for a few years while he gains experience and can move at a more senior level.

[Ruckedtobits]

Jones would probably have gotten more gametime if he'd stayed, at least at first. Keatley left for Connacht and played a lot for them.

Beirne is playing in a team that has brought out his talents and would have to displace people in Munster or here................

Kleyn is perfect for them, can do no wrong. They'll go for Beirne because they'll get him cheap and he's Irish. They wouldn't scout his style so quickly and they won't change to suit him. Beirne is a huge success playing to suit a very different team with a very different game plan. The risk factors escalate very quickly if he moves too quickly.

Moving here would also be a large risk but probably less risky. The best move for his game development now is to keep doing what's working at least for a few years while he gains experience and can move at a more senior level.

Last night's exhibition against Cheetahs suggests strongly that not only have we room for Beirne, we actually need him. He was always an excellent competitor for us. Not gifted with outstanding size or strength but a player who improved every outing. IMO, Molony has reached his physical ceiling and Kearney doesn't have the discipline to play at the level we need. Nagle appears not to have the inate hardness to be an enforcer and strong THL that would command a place in our pack.

Beirne should continue to prosper in his current environment where his skills continue to improve and Scarlets are beginning to build part of their game around his skills. If he wants to come back, his agent should demand a commitment of a minimum number of starts in season one. It can be done.

We could improve with his presence in our pack.

[ronk]

Agents shouldn't pick teams and it wouldn't help anyone to go down that route. You have to trust your form and the role you have in the plan.

Leinster might need him, but we'd be happy to use him in a squad role. Top of the pecking order would be a bonus. It would be the same at Munster. He's be giving that up for Scarlets which would be a bad move given how he's developing with gametime.

Fardy and Toner are our top guys now. If signing Beirne required us to give up one of them then the answer from fans would be a different one most of the time.

Now if he wants to come and fight it out down the depth chart and he trusts himself to move up then it's a different thing. That route is possible but it's an uphill move.

Bowe and Reddan did it right. They stayed long enough to develop their game and reputation so they came in higher up the depth chart and they times it right in terms of squad depth. Reddan replaced Whits, he didn't come to impress of the bench and get promoted.

[leinsterforever]

A lot will depend on who Munster's next coach is, but in a general sense Munster value blood and guts forwards over ball-handling ones. That's stereotyping, obviously. But I think it holds true for the most part. Beirne's got a good thing going at the Scarlets. He should be very wary of the fact that he might not be as suited to the type of game other teams play.

I think it would be good if the IRFU considered players at non-Irish Pro14 teams for national selection. There's not the same money threat as from England and France, so it's not as if first-choice players are going to be lured away. It could be good for squad players to go and get game-time and broadening the playing base.

[ronk]

Nick Williams demonstrated that it's not really just the coach.

Fans, media and player power can either a coaches resolve.

[simonokeeffe]

I think it would be good if the IRFU considered players at non-Irish Pro14 teams for national selection. There's not the same money threat as from England and France, so it's not as if first-choice players are going to be lured away. It could be good for squad players to go and get game-time and broadening the playing base.

Exiles then either miss Irish camps which massively sets back their chances of being picked or they miss a lot of league games for their club/run up serious mileage

Enough gaps at most of the other provinces too

[neiliog93]

Beirne is more than likely going to Munster, not much we can do about it. I had an unpopular view at the time that letting Quinn Roux go to Connacht and taking Mick Kearney was a bad trade for us, I think that's been vindicated now.

[molloyjh]

Beirne is more than likely going to Munster, not much we can do about it. I had an unpopular view at the time that letting Quinn Roux go to Connacht and taking Mick Kearney was a bad trade for us, I think that's been vindicated now.

Kearney showed up well in his first season here, particularly towards the end. He's been hampered by injuries since and struggled to get consistent game time. It's very much a case of hindsight being 20:20 there I think. Roux was hardly making a massive case for himself here at the time either. Kearney had been looking good for Connacht too.

[riocard911]

Beirne is more than likely going to Munster, not much we can do about it. I had an unpopular view at the time that letting Quinn Roux go to Connacht and taking Mick Kearney was a bad trade for us, I think that's been vindicated now.

Kearney showed up well in his first season here, particularly towards the end. He's been hampered by injuries since and struggled to get consistent game time. It's very much a case of hindsight being 20:20 there I think. Roux was hardly making a massive case for himself here at the time either. Kearney had been looking good for Connacht too.

Quinn Roux hasn't exactly been setting the world on fire with his performances i nGaillimh either, IMO, even if Joe did take him to SA summer 2016.

[simonokeeffe]

Roux is almost a Tom Court of second rows, back when there were 22 man squads; very few genuine Irish tighthead locks rather than him being an outstanding candidate. He was not even first choice for Connacht for all of last season

He was pretty much wiped out with injury during his time here be it layoffs or niggles.

[leinsterforever]

Roux's handling has improved a lot at Connacht. Would that have happened if he had stayed at Leinster?

[Dave Cahill]

Roux's handling has improved a lot at Connacht. Would that have happened if he had stayed at Leinster?

It didn't actually, it just appeared to improve because he got a run of games

[neiliog93]

For all his flaws, he's certainly better (and bulkier) than Mick Kearney.

[simonokeeffe]

For all his flaws, he's certainly better (and bulkier) than Mick Kearney.

The rarely spotted fully fit MK is a good player. IMO his not being huge contributed to overly abrasive style which kept leading to head and shoulder injuries

Indo today all but confirming Beirne is leaving Scarlets and for Munster in particular