Barry Daly

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Re: Barry Daly

Postby Peg Leg » October 20th, 2017, 4:05 pm

jimbobjoe wrote:
mildlyinterested wrote:
Oldschoolsocks wrote:
route a - going through the academy
different route - not going through the academy

seems like two different routes there, no?

Answer the question


both routes involve playing AIL rugby and 7's rugby, so very little difference at the end of the day bar the extra training, S&C support etc.

If he had went into the academy, i think it's fair to say he'd have emerged earlier.


Is it really that simple? Maybe the rejection gave him the extra impetus to prove doubters wrong but then again maybe he could be starting winger for Ireland. We don't/won't know.

What matters is that he's with Leinster now and playing well.
Zactly.
I am particularly looking forward to seeing BDaly play against Kelleher this season.
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby Oldschoolsocks » October 20th, 2017, 6:23 pm

Oldschoolsocks wrote:
mildlyinterested wrote:
Oldschoolsocks wrote:Fair enough, I still don’t accept that current form can be used to argue decisions made at a point in time in the past.

And besides it has to be a motivation to players not in the professional schools that have little or no hope of selection for the academy that there is more than one route to the professional game.


mildlyinterested wrote:Barry Daly went to Gonzaga, it's not Michael or Blackrock but it's a pretty big rugby school all the same.

In fact back in the day, a club player was chosen over Daly, a schools player. So I reject the idea club players have "little or no hope of selection for the academy"


What schools did the bulk of sub academy and academy entrants go to?

St. Michaels and Blackrock for the full academy anyway, unsurprisingly as they have the best coaching for rugby skills and S&C.

Not going to complain about that fact, as without those schools Leinster rugby would be in a much worse position.

Leinster do a better job than the other provinces in getting players from club only background into sub academy and full academy FYI.


oh right - just noticed the shift in goal posts there.

my position is that I firmly believe that unless you were a student of Michaels or Rock there is little chance of selection for the academy. in fact I m going to use your own words "St. Michaels and Blackrock for the full academy anyway, unsurprisingly as they have the best coaching for rugby skills and S&C"

I also believe that the reason that these two schools have the best coaching for rugby skills and S&C is due to the vast budgets they have to spend on Rugby.

whether this is a good or bad thing for Leinster Rugby is another matter altogether - and I have seen both side of that coin argued very convincingly.
the irony being that ad-hominen and appeal to majority are the most often used defences of the apologist.
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby artaneboy » October 20th, 2017, 6:29 pm

mildlyinterested wrote:
Oldschoolsocks wrote:
mildlyinterested wrote:proves he should have been given an academy offer when he was under-20, something a lot of people thought at the time.


How so? He developed and proved himself through a different route, no?

Surely the outcome of that development can’t be used as evidence that he should have been given an academy position?


how is it a different route?

he would have been playing AIL and 7's while in the academy.

If anything if he had joined the academy at 19, he'd probably have broken through earlier.

That’s true- or so it would seem. I’ve always been a fan of Adam Byrne, but his defence is so bad, you have to ask what was the coaching like in the academy. Then Daly seems- well not the finished article, but certainly a quicker learner for a lad coming in from the outside. Logic would say he might be even better if he was coached in the academy from school. But then you look at Byrne who was...


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Re: Barry Daly

Postby neiliog93 » October 21st, 2017, 4:03 pm

Re. the Blackrock budget for rugby, you would be surprised. I'm a (sort of) recent graduate. Unlike in Clongowes, Roscrea or Belvedere, the main coaches are all teachers (I can't speak for Michael's). Now, the teachers know their stuff and wouldn't get the gigs if they didn't, and maybe they focus more on the rugby than the teaching, but they're not full-time coaches as such. The gym is tiny, has old, sometimes rusty equipment and is in a horrible, cramped prefab. The changing rooms for matches/training are ancient and positively nasty, with barely functioning showers.

On the other hand, they do have good equipment in terms of scrum machines, ruck and tackle pads, etc, and a proper recording camera for video analysis. They also draft in outside help for scrum coaching and strength and conditioning, which is probably expensive (but those guys are not full time and come in maybe once per week). The main strength of the school is sheer numbers, its reputation in attracting already promising players (but the whole 'rugby scholarship' thing of signing guys from other schools is a thing of the past in Blackrock at least) and teachers who are very good rugby coaches, but who are not full-time coaches. Money definitely helps, I am absolutely not denying that, but it's a lot less cushy than you might think!
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby Oldschoolsocks » October 21st, 2017, 4:46 pm

neiliog93 wrote:Re. the Blackrock budget for rugby, you would be surprised. I'm a (sort of) recent graduate. Unlike in Clongowes, Roscrea or Belvedere, the main coaches are all teachers (I can't speak for Michael's). Now, the teachers know their stuff and wouldn't get the gigs if they didn't, and maybe they focus more on the rugby than the teaching, but they're not full-time coaches as such. The gym is tiny, has old, sometimes rusty equipment and is in a horrible, cramped prefab. The changing rooms for matches/training are ancient and positively nasty, with barely functioning showers.

On the other hand, they do have good equipment in terms of scrum machines, ruck and tackle pads, etc, and a proper recording camera for video analysis. They also draft in outside help for scrum coaching and strength and conditioning, which is probably expensive (but those guys are not full time and come in maybe once per week). The main strength of the school is sheer numbers, its reputation in attracting already promising players (but the whole 'rugby scholarship' thing of signing guys from other schools is a thing of the past in Blackrock at least) and teachers who are very good rugby coaches, but who are not full-time coaches. Money definitely helps, I am absolutely not denying that, but it's a lot less cushy than you might think!


just bolded a few words there
the irony being that ad-hominen and appeal to majority are the most often used defences of the apologist.
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby RoboProp » October 21st, 2017, 6:05 pm

neiliog93 wrote:Re. the Blackrock budget for rugby, you would be surprised. I'm a (sort of) recent graduate. Unlike in Clongowes, Roscrea or Belvedere, the main coaches are all teachers (I can't speak for Michael's). Now, the teachers know their stuff and wouldn't get the gigs if they didn't, and maybe they focus more on the rugby than the teaching, but they're not full-time coaches as such. The gym is tiny, has old, sometimes rusty equipment and is in a horrible, cramped prefab. The changing rooms for matches/training are ancient and positively nasty, with barely functioning showers.

On the other hand, they do have good equipment in terms of scrum machines, ruck and tackle pads, etc, and a proper recording camera for video analysis. They also draft in outside help for scrum coaching and strength and conditioning, which is probably expensive (but those guys are not full time and come in maybe once per week). The main strength of the school is sheer numbers, its reputation in attracting already promising players (but the whole 'rugby scholarship' thing of signing guys from other schools is a thing of the past in Blackrock at least) and teachers who are very good rugby coaches, but who are not full-time coaches. Money definitely helps, I am absolutely not denying that, but it's a lot less cushy than you might think!


I went to a school that doesn't have anything near Blackrock's illustrious Leinster schools record, we are Vinnie Murray calibre team now our Senior Cup wins were along time ago, but the set-up you described could have been my school. We just didn't have much in the way of playing numbers. A larger playing pool ultimately is the greatest benefit; you get guys who can play competing for spots over jokers there to make up numbers
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby Oldschoolsocks » October 21st, 2017, 6:10 pm

so - who knows the euro per player budget that is spent by the professional schools?
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby cormac » October 21st, 2017, 6:19 pm

Hopefully Barry's injury isn't too serious.
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby RoboProp » October 21st, 2017, 6:38 pm

Oldschoolsocks wrote:so - who knows the euro per player budget that is spent by the professional schools?


We are kind of going off topic. This maybe should be moved to another thread. Back in my schools days late 80s early 90s (God I'm old) not all the money came from the school budget. Local businesses gave sponsorship money or some parents donated a few quid. Some past pupils who were playing at high club level gave up their time to help coach us. Not really sure what money came from school itself. Short answer, I don't know.
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby curates_egg » October 22nd, 2017, 7:41 am

cormac wrote:Hopefully Barry's injury isn't too serious.


Was hoping someone here would know. I didn't see it. The replacement happened quickly and there was nothing on the telly.
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby Laighin Break » October 23rd, 2017, 9:16 am

According to the42 http://www.the42.ie/garry-ringrose-injury-update-3658510-Oct2017/

"Daly sustained a bang to his ankle during the first half and although receiving treatment on the pitch and having it strapped at the break...will be struggling to be fit for this weekend’s trip to Ravenhill."
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby mildlyinterested » October 27th, 2017, 8:25 am

Barry Daly will miss the next six weeks or more due to a high ankle sprain.
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby Peg Leg » October 27th, 2017, 10:54 am

That is shitty timing for Barry would have cemented the top try scorer position for the season in november
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby Leinsterlunatic » October 27th, 2017, 10:59 am

Shite!

I wonder would he have got into the Ireland squad ahead of DK or Byrne?
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby BlueWheels » October 27th, 2017, 11:09 am

Leinsterlunatic wrote:Shite!

I wonder would he have got into the Ireland squad ahead of DK or Byrne?


I thought he was in with a good shout of the call up ...... Hope he has a speedy recovery!
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby mildlyinterested » October 27th, 2017, 11:41 am

Leinsterlunatic wrote:Shite!

I wonder would he have got into the Ireland squad ahead of DK or Byrne?


you'd assume so but making assumptions with Joe..
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby Leinsterlunatic » December 7th, 2017, 9:53 am

Any news on Daly's injury?
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby mildlyinterested » December 7th, 2017, 9:56 am

Leinsterlunatic wrote:Any news on Daly's injury?


not expected back until after european games afaik
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Re: Barry Daly

Postby arsebiscuits1 » December 7th, 2017, 10:58 am

mildlyinterested wrote:
Leinsterlunatic wrote:Any news on Daly's injury?


not expected back until after european games afaik

Yeah think that's about right

I think it was Josh saying it when referencing his own injury that he was lucky because he managed to shake his off in 6 weeks where as Daly will be closer to 9.
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