Leinster's Halfback Options going forward

[Flash Gordon]

the player has got to agree.

Yes but the pressure on the player is enormous. I spoke to a player recently who the IRFU (not current regime) tried to force to leave Connacht to join Munster. The player didn't want to go so they pulled his Connacht contract. It was only when he said "fine, I'll play for Connacht as an amateur" that they gave him a contract. The player could and should have played for Ireland given the level he played at and his position but never did.

Having tasted international success as Joey has it would be a huge call to put himself in a position where he was not available for the world cup. My understanding that the player is struggling big time with the issue and is not sleeping. Don't forget, he's still a kid! You have to ask why the hell this issue wasn't raised and resolved during the close season for the benefit of the player and Leinster but anyway.....

The issue for Leinster is that it took 10 years for the Academy to get where it needed to be and to be as productive as it is. It could take 10 years for the Ulster and Munster Academy to get to the same place so we could have 10 years of this...... and of course, if Sexton's career is finished in the next couple of years we could be in a position as the most successful club in European history where we have half backs who are not international class. That seems crazy and unbelievably unfair.

[neiliog93]

Yeah, the current situation of penalising the most productive academy by far is a disincentive to develop more players where we already have depth (a number of positions at the moment), as they'll likely be whisked away.

[mildlyinterested]

IT saying carbery said no to ulster, but move to munster may be on the cards..

[blockhead]

A 1 year loan too.
This is going to end in a mess one way or another.
They'll probably be booing him from the start.

[mildlyinterested]

A 1 year loan too.
This is going to end in a mess one way or another.
They'll probably be booing him from the start.

ah we all know what a 1 year loan deal leads to.. If carbery goes well, i'd be surprised if he ever played for leinster again, sadly.

[OTT]

the player has got to agree.

Yes but the pressure on the player is enormous. I spoke to a player recently who the IRFU (not current regime) tried to force to leave Connacht to join Munster. The player didn't want to go so they pulled his Connacht contract. It was only when he said "fine, I'll play for Connacht as an amateur" that they gave him a contract. The player could and should have played for Ireland given the level he played at and his position but never did.

Having tasted international success as Joey has it would be a huge call to put himself in a position where he was not available for the world cup. My understanding that the player is struggling big time with the issue and is not sleeping. Don't forget, he's still a kid! You have to ask why the hell this issue wasn't raised and resolved during the close season for the benefit of the player and Leinster but anyway.....

The issue for Leinster is that it took 10 years for the Academy to get where it needed to be and to be as productive as it is. It could take 10 years for the Ulster and Munster Academy to get to the same place so we could have 10 years of this...... and of course, if Sexton's career is finished in the next couple of years we could be in a position as the most successful club in European history where we have half backs who are not international class. That seems crazy and unbelievably unfair.

The thing for me which is the really big point is that the only reason Joey is where he is today is because he has played so much for Leinster. The guy is still only 22. he is getting a serious amount of rugby for a 22 year old. Leo and Stuart's Leinster back our young players. Ask Bill Johnson if Munster have the same appreciation or JJ before him?

[Laighin Break]

A 1 year loan too.
This is going to end in a mess one way or another.
They'll probably be booing him from the start.

ah we all know what a 1 year loan deal leads to.. If carbery goes well, i'd be surprised if he ever played for leinster again, sadly.

On the other hand, judging from how people react to poor performances from Keatley, if Carbery does move south and has a bad game he could well get scapegoated and then lost his starting place.

[fourthirtythree]

For different reasons but equal to Ulster, Munster would be a terrible destination for Carvery as a player and he would also not be what the club want.

[Dave Cahill]

Its great that after all this shite in the build up to the Champions Cup final Schmifora kept a little kaka for the build up to the Pro14 final.

[mildlyinterested]

So assuming Carbery is off...

Outhalf next season:
Jonathan Sexton(33)
Ross Byrne(23)
Ciaran Frawley(20)
Harry Byrne(19)

[wixfjord]

Carbery going to Munster for a 1 year loan deal would be more mental than him going to Ulster imo.

Munster already have three 10s that are at or below international level along with Bill Johnston coming through.

As an outsider on a year deal, he would be on the back foot from the start.

If he's to move to Munster, he'd be better going the whole hog.

[Oldschool]

Carbery going to Munster for a 1 year loan deal would be more mental than him going to Ulster imo.

Munster already have three 10s that are at or below international level along with Bill Johnston coming through.

As an outsider on a year deal, he would be on the back foot from the start.

If he's to move to Munster, he'd be better going the whole hog.

He should go to Connacht , hell is elsewhere!

[MelbourneRebel]

I thought that this move could have appealed to Byrne. Could be his one and only shot at a central contract and he'd be nailed on for a squad position in the World Cup.

I feel sorry for Carbery in all of this, a victim of his own success in his first year. I don't expect Ulster or Munster fans to offer much support. I don't think we would like the idea of a 1 year loan either would like some commitment. The best move for game-time at 10 honestly would be a move abroad, which will never happen.

[fourthirtythree]

Absolutely Melbourne, abroad would be the best move for him (other than staying at Leinster) and you never know, they might make that happen. Certainly not endearing themselves to Carbery right now.

[Lar]

Absolutely Melbourne, abroad would be the best move for him (other than staying at Leinster) and you never know, they might make that happen. Certainly not endearing themselves to Carbery right now.

I am sure its been posted elsewhere on this forum before but I don't know what Carbery's current contract is for. Is there a possibility that the reason only one year is being discussed is because Carbery only has one year left on his contract and is refusing (probably quite rightly) to discuss a further contract precisely because of the way he is being messed around?

[riocard911]

Darce gives his tuppence in today's IT: https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/ ... -1.3504744

[ronk]

Schmidt has been lukewarm at best on Byrne, which limits how hard he’ll push Byrne to Ulster and how much Byrne wants it.

Carbery’s 2nd season wasn’t the same at outhalf but he was needed at fullback and injured at the wrong time. Mightn’t happen again. Best thing for his development would be Leinster signing a fullback to cover Kearney.

[Oldschool]

Schmidt has been lukewarm at best on Byrne, which limits how hard he’ll push Byrne to Ulster and how much Byrne wants it.

Carbery’s 2nd season wasn’t the same at outhalf but he was needed at fullback and injured at the wrong time. Mightn’t happen again. Best thing for his development would be Leinster signing a fullback to cover Kearney.

Schmidt needs a 3rd OH and has obviously decided that RB is the next in line.
It's obviously untenable from an Ireland pov to have his three OHs playing for the same club.
Ergo one of them has to move and JC is the nominee at the moment.
Maybe that will change over the course of the OZ tour.
From JS' pov Ulster would be the best option.
Fears that McPhilips? would lose out are over stated.
JC would be out of town for the international windows and injuries are inevitable so McPhilips' development would be phased rather than fast track.
Ulster (including their fans) should have tried a lot harder than they appear to have to entice JC north.
As a player the most unattractive part of a move away from Leinster for and player is that they are likely moving away from silverware - it's a big ask.

[curates_egg]

Schmidt has been lukewarm at best on Byrne, which limits how hard he’ll push Byrne to Ulster and how much Byrne wants it.

Carbery’s 2nd season wasn’t the same at outhalf but he was needed at fullback and injured at the wrong time. Mightn’t happen again. Best thing for his development would be Leinster signing a fullback to cover Kearney.

Schmidt needs a 3rd OH and has obviously decided that RB is the next in line.
It's obviously untenable from an Ireland pov to have his three OHs playing for the same club.
Ergo one of them has to move and JC is the nominee at the moment.
Maybe that will change over the course of the OZ tour.
From JS' pov Ulster would be the best option.
Fears that McPhilips? would lose out are over stated.
JC would be out of town for the international windows and injuries are inevitable so McPhilips' development would be phased rather than fast track.
Ulster (including their fans) should have tried a lot harder than they appear to have to entice JC north.
As a player the most unattractive part of a move away from Leinster for and player is that they are likely moving away from silverware - it's a big ask.

Jesus. What's with initialisms? Makes it very difficult to read.
JS - in the context of a post about outhalves and the national side - is particularly egregious.
But if you insist on using them, please then don't use all caps for a nickname, like Oz.

[curates_egg]

I love watching Carbery play. I think he is a uniquely talented player. I prefer the way he plays at outhalf to Byrne.
I think he has skills, which you can't coach, that Byrne doesn't. Whereas what Byrne has over him can be coached.
I think I would puke if I seem him playing for Munster. It would really be horrible.

I have grown to really hate the IRFU and think they give basically all of the provinces a raw deal, bar Munster.
I find their meddling in this situation loathsome.

Despite all that, I am slowly coming to the conclusion that, if we have to lose one of Carbery or Byrne for a year, I would rather lose Carbery.
I would also want a cast-iron guarantee that we have control over whether he comes back or not though.
And I would want us to exact a pound of flesh: signing a good quality centre and full back, who are of a high standard but not Anzac, and so will not mess with our selection.
Maybe one IQ, like Sam Arnold or somebody like that, and one Safa - I don't know who is available.