Joe Tomane

[ronk]

Close to signing so probably a good time for a thread. Been rumoured for a while.
http://www.the42.ie/leinster-joe-tomane ... 7-May2018/

Under contract to Montpellier but they're willing to let him go due to salary cap: not promising but they have a lot of big names and he's always been a good player. Big and powerful centre or winger but expected to mostly be used at centre.

[hugonaut]

Close to signing so probably a good time for a thread. Been rumoured for a while.
http://www.the42.ie/leinster-joe-tomane ... 7-May2018/

Under contract to Montpellier but they're willing to let him go due to salary cap: not promising but they have a lot of big names and he's always been a good player. Big and powerful centre or winger but expected to mostly be used at centre.

I'm convinced that it would be a really, really good signing for us. I can't see Henshaw playing more than 14 games for us next season [if that many, and it would be more than he has played in the last two seasons], and we'll play between 28 and 33, depending on success. That's 14-19 starts in the No12 jersey alone. Isa and Reider had 24 starts in the No12 jersey between them this season [10 for Isa, 14 for Reider]. He also offers versatility, in that he has played in all the threequarter positions for Montpellier this season.

We're supplying 17 players to the Irish squad that's touring Australia, almost triple the number of the next biggest supplier [Munster, six players]: not double, triple. We're already carrying a massive load for the national team. As I've previously written, Schmidt has capped five players in the No12 jersey in the last 16 months; Henhsaw, Aki, Marshall, McCloskey and Scannell. Ireland is well stocked for inside centres, so there's no need to fret about us bringing in an NIQ player in the position.

[Oldschool]

One fear is that Fardy will not get a contract extension and we'll be up against it for SRs after the RWC (2019/20).
We'll also be in a 4 into 2 won't go for next season and then a 3 into 2 won't go for the post RWC season.
LPG (2018/19), Lowe (2019/2020), Fardy and Tomane.
Fardy for one more season might be very desirable.

[ronk]

I could see it being a little like Fardy at lock. For the business end of the deason he moved more to 6 (partly due to injuries).

Him and Lowe would be hard to stop on the wings and Lowe's minutes are limited because of GJP and Fardy.

With the big names away we struggled with impact at lock and centre. Tomane would help in many ways.

[ronk]

Tomane might back himself for one year, given that's when his current deal is due to expire.

Fardy's renewal is next year's problem. Tomane doesn't change that. He wont be subject to the same restrictions because he's an islander.

At Fardy's age the IRFU won't care much about blocking a renewal if they think keeping him is justified. Signing Tomane to a multiyear deal hurts our chances of signing someone in a years time and renewing Fardy at the same time.

[Donny B.]

Leinster might want to check out his Twitter feed first

https://twitter.com/joetomane29?lang=en

He's a big supporter of Israel's Folau's brand of homophobia dressed up as Jesus love! Leinster go on about values and inclusivity so do they really want to spend the whole summer defending the signing of some who defends saying homosexuals will burn in hell?

"He's entitled to his opinion" some will inevitably say! Sure and we're entitled to want nothing to do with a bigot!

"It's his religious beliefs and they should be respected" some will inevitably say. Sure, but if your religion teaches you to hate people just because of their sexuality and you don't have the brains or common decency to reject that teaching, then either pick a better bloody religion or just admit you're fine with the gay bashing aspect of it.

"He's a right to free speech" they will say. Sure, but if he was retweeting racist propaganda, would that be okay?

He's a useful player, although he never looked particularly fit against us, but I hope we don't go within a mile of this cretin. It will be a Grobler level blackeye on the organisation when the media inevitably cottons onto his homophobic views.

[locho]

As an Australian does this not make our champions cup conundrum worse eg 2 from 4 now!

[johng]

No.

[Flash Gordon]

Leinster might want to check out his Twitter feed first

https://twitter.com/joetomane29?lang=en

He's a big supporter of Israel's Folau's brand of homophobia dressed up as Jesus love! Leinster go on about values and inclusivity so do they really want to spend the whole summer defending the signing of some who defends saying homosexuals will burn in hell?

"He's entitled to his opinion" some will inevitably say! Sure and we're entitled to want nothing to do with a bigot!

"It's his religious beliefs and they should be respected" some will inevitably say. Sure, but if your religion teaches you to hate people just because of their sexuality and you don't have the brains or common decency to reject that teaching, then either pick a better bloody religion or just admit you're fine with the gay bashing aspect of it.

"He's a right to free speech" they will say. Sure, but if he was retweeting racist propaganda, would that be okay?

He's a useful player, although he never looked particularly fit against us, but I hope we don't go within a mile of this cretin. It will be a Grobler level blackeye on the organisation when the media inevitably cottons onto his homophobic views.

Never heard him express homophobic views, when and where we these expressed?

[leinsterforever]

I'm conflicted on this one. On the one hand he's an excellent player who I'm sure will tear it up, and, on a human level, the guy obviously dearly wanted to join, so its nice that he gets his wish. On the other hand, with Lowe here as well, gametime for ROL, Barry Daly, Conor O'Brien and Jimmy O'Brien could be severely restricted, and with it their chance to grow further as players.

Were Ferg and (after the weekend) O'Loughlin not options to do a Nacewa and fill in at 12?

[paddyor]

This needs a poll, What would Isa do?

[mildlyinterested]

His pro-Folau, anti-gay point of view will almost certainly become a talking point next season.. personally wouldn't want leinster signing him but can see the logic behind the move.

[curates_egg]

It may not work out, you can never know, but - on the face of it - Tomane is exactly the player we need.
A Samoan passport, so does not count as a Johnny Fahrdener. Brings grit and experience. Would be available to play in Rodney Parade but could also do a job in the Champion's' Cup.
Possibly now has more experience at 12 than Isa did, when taking on that role for us. Tomane has played mostly at 12 this season.
Now, you never know how players will settle, but this would be no Lote Tuqiri signing.

For those who are against it, please point out another experienced, versatile, international quality back, who has experience at 12, is not Australian or Kiwi, is free, and we can afford. If you can't, then I suggest you change your conclusion.

Edit: as for him supporting Folau (I haven't read/heard any explicitly homophobic stuff from him), I can see it becoming a meeja thing. However, I take issue with the Grobler comparison: he is a steroids cheat, who - even if you think he deserves a "second chance" - should not be getting a second chance on Leinster money (indirectly via our contribution to the IRFU). I would say most of the Safas and islanders playing in Ireland have similar religious blindspots regarding homosexuality if you scratch the surface. At present, we are the only province not to have bible bashers, afaik.

[Peg Leg]

It may not work out, you can never know, but - on the face of it - Tomane is exactly the player we need.
A Samoan passport, so does not count as a Johnny Fahrdener. Brings grit and experience. Would be available to play in Rodney Parade but could also do a job in the Champion's' Cup.
Possibly now has more experience at 12 than Isa did, when taking on that role for us. Tomane has played mostly at 12 this season.
Now, you never know how players will settle, but this would be no Lote Tuqiri signing.

For those who are against it, please point out another experienced, versatile, international quality back, who has experience at 12, is not Australian or Kiwi, is free, and we can afford. If you can't, then I suggest you change your conclusion.

deleted by me- un-informed claptrap.

[artaneboy]

Leinster might want to check out his Twitter feed first

https://twitter.com/joetomane29?lang=en

He's a big supporter of Israel's Folau's brand of homophobia dressed up as Jesus love! Leinster go on about values and inclusivity so do they really want to spend the whole summer defending the signing of some who defends saying homosexuals will burn in hell?

"He's entitled to his opinion" some will inevitably say! Sure and we're entitled to want nothing to do with a bigot!

"It's his religious beliefs and they should be respected" some will inevitably say. Sure, but if your religion teaches you to hate people just because of their sexuality and you don't have the brains or common decency to reject that teaching, then either pick a better bloody religion or just admit you're fine with the gay bashing aspect of it.

"He's a right to free speech" they will say. Sure, but if he was retweeting racist propaganda, would that be okay?

He's a useful player, although he never looked particularly fit against us, but I hope we don't go within a mile of this cretin. It will be a Grobler level blackeye on the organisation when the media inevitably cottons onto his homophobic views.

Here we go... I say- let’s not judge him by implications to have the same views as others. He may or may not gave these views- but I haven’t heard the things you claim expressed in those tweets. Is there any evidence that he has expressed such views?

Even if he has those views- a huge number of Pacific Islanders and Maori are very religious with many sharing views that are at best uncomfortable- or much worse. A lot of Saffers are too. Do you want a blanket ban on religious groupings where there a history of members of expressing disgraceful to unpalatable views? Would you want a public declaration of their position before signing?

See where this is going? Falou is probably far from the only player with such views. It doesn’t take much imagination to think what the views of other big players from these and other backgrounds may be. Several of them have played in Irekand.

It’s totally wrong in the first place to adopt this position to individuals. But worse- it’s absolutely incoherent and unsustainable. The only fair and reasonable thing is to ask players on signing to keep their moral, religious and political views to themselves- even those that are fashionable or mainstream. No tweeting, no badges, no tee shirt, no nuttin!!!

Elizabeth the First said at the time of her ‘Act of Uniformity’ on one established state religion , “I’ve no wish to make a window into men’s souls.”

The woman had a point. Believe what you want, if you must- but keep it to yourself when you’re paid by Leinster.

If the man is good enough and discreet enough, that also enough for me.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ronk]

Discriminating against someone over religeous views is just as bad as over sexual orientation, just not talked about as much.

I'm surprised we're even debating this. Have we become so hostile to religeous freedom. If he won't play on Sundays that's awkward and I can understand if that was an issue. If he might say something that other people might not agree with, does it actually matter.

[CiaranIrl]

I can't find what he has said that is bad. Can anyone enlighten me?

[curates_egg]

It may not work out, you can never know, but - on the face of it - Tomane is exactly the player we need.
A Samoan passport, so does not count as a Johnny Fahrdener. Brings grit and experience. Would be available to play in Rodney Parade but could also do a job in the Champion's' Cup.
Possibly now has more experience at 12 than Isa did, when taking on that role for us. Tomane has played mostly at 12 this season.
Now, you never know how players will settle, but this would be no Lote Tuqiri signing.

For those who are against it, please point out another experienced, versatile, international quality back, who has experience at 12, is not Australian or Kiwi, is free, and we can afford. If you can't, then I suggest you change your conclusion.

Good post barring your own conclusion. Values always trump value. I'm not one to concern myself with the sexual preferences of others and I don't know any of the players (barring my spiritual connection to Isa), but introducing a homophobe into the band of brothers, breaks the band of brothers ethos if you happen to be homosexual.
He's not willing to do anything for you, he hopes you burn in hell.

I'm annoyed about this, mostly because I think he is the ideal player to bring.

I haven't seen him express homophobic views - I have only seen him retweeting religious stuff from Folau, thus implicitly defending him. If he had come out and said homophobic stuff, I would share your view, but he hasn't, afaik.

As I, and someone above said, I would say a lot of Safas and most islanders believe the conservative brand of religion they practice (which includes homophobia). I would be very surprised if the bible bashing islanders already here don't (including the most prominent one).
I think that's nuts but I also think they should be free to believe what they want.
If they were to use their positions of influence to express homophobic views, as Folau has done, I would be totally opposed to that. I wouldn't want a player like that.
For me, there is a difference though.

[blockhead]

If he truly is a devout christian and follows that bible of his, then he must believe that anybody who is not a devout christian will burn in hell.
We should probably have a NO-Christians policy to recruitment, and an inqusition into our current playing staff to root out the fanatics.

[olaf the fat]

Yep, but we also live in the real world - albeit a liberal part of it.

Dont knowif Tomane was endorsing Folau or his attitudes towards other - but jeez you got to be careful and sure on who you sign. These guys have a media role for Leinster as well as just playing rugby.

Look to what happened after the circus of the Ulster trial - when those guys went to Sale, the sponsors put there foot down to say no. The reality is that if we bring in people with 'open' views or attitudes that dont match what is considered reasonable or acceptable by OUR society then we are open to a media witch hunt and that impacts directly on Leinsters brand.

Everybody has the right to whatever beliefs they want, Leinster also have the right to chose the right fits for their club.