Academy 2018/2019

[mildlyinterested]

A team/U20's named to start in AIL action,

Harry Noonan(LH Prop/Old Wesley)
John McKee(Hooker/Old Belvedere)
Declan Adamson(Hooker/Clontarf)
Alan Francis(Openside/Blackrock)
Ronan Watters(Backrow/St. Marys)
Ronan Foley(Backrow/UCD) - u21
Peter Maher(Wing/Old Belvedere) - u21
Hugo Conway(Wing/St. Marys)
Sam Dardis(Wing/Terenure) - u19
Rob Russell(Fullback/DUFC)

Other notable players from last years sub-academy starting:
Joe Byrne(TH Prop/Blackrock)
Cormac Daly(Lock/Clontarf)
Max Kearney(Openside/DUFC)
Tim Murphy(Scrumhalf/Lansdowne)
Tom Roche(Centre/Lansdowne)
Peter Sullivan(Wing/Lansdowne)

[mildlyinterested]

report from CLontarf 20's game on Hawkshaw:

Leinster lads... David Hawkshaw is legit.

My 20s play Tarf 20s today and he was their 10.

Lost 34-13..And they actually got a try last play for a little gloss on score but his range of passing is ridiculous...

Ran one in from his own 10 also. Has lots of pace.

[mildlyinterested]

Academy Update

Prop
Jack Aungier(Year 2/Suttonians RFC/Terenure) - sub for Leinster A.
Michael Milne(Year 1/CC Roscrea-Birr RFC/UCD) - 24th man for Leinster A.

Giuseepe Coyne(U20/Blackrock/DUFC) - bench for DUFC.
Thomas Clarkson(U19/Blackrock/DUFC) - bench for DUFC.
Harry Noonan(U19/Greystones RFC/Old Wesley) - started at 1 for Old Wesley

Hooker
Ronan Kelleher(Year 2/St. Michaels/Lansdowne) - started at 2 for Leinster A
Dan Sheehan(Year 1/Clongowes/DUFC) - bench for DUFC.

Declan Adamson(U20/Clontarf/Clontarf) - started at 2 for Clontarf.
Richie Bergin(U20/St. Marys/UCD) - bench for UCD.
John McKee(U19/Campbell/Old Belvedere) - started at 2 for Old Belvedere.
Ethan Baxter(U19/St. Gerards/Old Belvedere) - bench for Old Belvedere.

Lock
Jack Dunne(Year 1/St. Michaels/DUFC) - injured.
Ryan Baird(Year 1/St. Michaels/DUFC) - injured.

Charlie Ryan(U20/Blackrock/UCD) - didn't play this weekend.

Backrow
Oisin Dowling(Year 2/St. Michaels/Lansdowne) - bench for Leinster A.
Scott Penny(Year 1/St. Michaels/UCD) - started at 7 for Leinster A, 2 tries.

Ronan Foley(U21/St. Marys/UCD) - started at 8 for UCD, 1 try.
Ronan Watters(U20/St. Marys/St. Marys) - started at 8 for St. Marys.
Martin Moloney(U20/Athy RFC/Old Belvedere) - bench for Old Belvedere.

Scrumhalf
Hugh O'Sullivan(Year 2/Belvedere/Clontarf) - bench for Leinster A, 1 try.
Patrick Patterson(Year 1/Blackrock/UCD) - started at 9 for Leinster A.

Cormac Foley(U20/St. Gerards/St. Marys) - bench for St. Marys.

Outhalf
Ciaran Frawley(Year 2/Skerries RFC/UCD) - bench for Leinster A.
Harry Byrne(Year 1/St. Michaels/Lansdowne) - injured.
David Hawkshaw(Year 1/Belvedere/Clontarf) - started at 10 for Clontarf 20's.

Conor Kelly(U20/Roscrea/Clontarf) - bench for Clontarf.

Centre
Conor O'Brien(Year 3/Mullingar RFC/Clontarf) - injured.
Jimmy O'Brien(Year 3/Newbridge/UCD) - started at 13 for Leinster A, 1 try.
Gavin Mullin(Year 2/Blackrock/UCD) - injured.
Tommy O'Brien(Year 2/Blackrock/UCD) - injured.

Liam Turner(U20/Blacrock/DUFC) - didn't play this weekend.

Back Three
Hugo Keenan(Year 3/Blackrock/UCD) - injured.
Jack Kelly(Year 3/St. Michaels/DUFC) - started at 15 for Leinster A, captain.
Michaels Silvester(Year 1/Clongowes/DUFC) - bench for Leinster A
Aaron O'Sullivan(Year 1/Exile/UCD) - injured.

Peter Maher(U21/Belvedere/Old Belvedere) - started at 11 for Old Belvedere.
Rob Russell(U20/St. Michaels/DUFC) - started at 15 for DUFC.
Ruairi Shields(U20/St. Marys/St. Marys) - bench for St. Marys.
Hugo Conway(U20/St. Marys/St. Marys) - started at 11 for St. Marys, 1 try.
Sam Dardis(U19/Terenure/Terenure) - started at 14 for Terenure.

[TrapperChamonix]

If you are talking U20's 2 players from DUFC are very impressive... No6. Anthony Ryan (ex CWC) & No 11. Ronan Quinn (ex Glenstal). Pretty sure Quinn is from County Limerick not sure about where Ryan is from.

[mildlyinterested]

If you are talking U20's 2 players from DUFC are very impressive... No6. Anthony Ryan (ex CWC) & No 11. Ronan Quinn (ex Glenstal). Pretty sure Quinn is from County Limerick not sure about where Ryan is from.

Ryan is U19, from Kilkenny went to Clongowes and played Leinster U19.

Quinn is U19, from Limerick went to Glenstal and played Munster U19.

[mildlyinterested]

A potential Leinster 23 and under team:

1. Michael Milne(19/Roscrea-Birr RFC)
2. Ronan Kelleher(20/St. Michaels)
3. Andrew Porter(22/St. Andrews)
4. Jack Dunne(19/St. Michaels)
5. James Ryan(22/St. Michaels)
6. Caelan Doris(20/Blackrock)
7. Scott Penny(19/St. Michaels)
8. Max Deegan(22/St. Michaels)
9. Nick McCarthy(23/St. Michaels)
10. Ross Byrne(23/St. Michaels)
11. Tommy O'Brien(20/Blackrock)
12. Conor O'Brien(22/Mullingar RFC)
13. Garry Ringrose(23/Blackrock)
14. Jack Kelly(21/St. Michaels)
15. Jordan Larmour(21/St. Andrews)

[mildlyinterested]

Leinster U19 interpro winning squad:

[mildlyinterested]

Leinster U18 schools winning squad:

[Dave Cahill]

Both teams trudged embarassedly (is that a word?) past the terrace on Friday night to good response


(which reminds me of something else...)

[hugonaut]

Both teams trudged embarassedly (is that a word?) past the terrace on Friday night to good response


(which reminds me of something else...)

It was Kevin and Perry-esque.

[mildlyinterested]

SCT League results:
Presentation College Bray 23 V 25 Newbridge College
St Andrews College 10 V 31 Cistercian College Roscrea
The Kings Hospital 12 V 21 Castleknock College
Gonzaga College 18 V 22 Kilkenny College

JCT League results:
Castleknock College 31 V 14 The Kings Hospital
Cistercian College Roscrea 17 V 5 Temple Carrig
Newbridge College 27 V 35 Presentation College Bray
Kilkenny College 17 V 17 Gonzaga College

[mildlyinterested]

Leinster players in Ireland U18 Schools Squad

Forwards-
Prop: Sam Illo (Wesley College/Leinster)
Prop: Levi Vaughan (Terenure College/Leinster)
Hooker: Lee Barron (St. Michael's College/Leinster)
Lock: Alex Soroka (Belvedere College/Leinster)
Backrow: Jack Barry (Gonzaga College/Leinster)
Backrow: Aaron Coleman (Belvedere College/Leinster)
Backrow: Will Hickey (St. Michael's College/Leinster)

Backs-
Scrumhalf: Ben Murphy (Pres Bray/Leinster)
Centre/Fullback: Chris Cosgrave (St. Michael's College/Leinster)
Centre: Simon O'Kelly (St. Michael's College/Leinster)
Wing: Josh Pyper (Pres Bray/Leinster)

Leinster players in Ireland U18 Clubs Squad

Forwards-
Backrow: Mark Boyle (Gorey RFC/Leinster)

Backs-
Centre: Karl Martin (Boyne RFC/Leinster)
Centre/Wing: Josh O'Connor (Wexford Wanderers RFC/Leinster)
Fullback: Jamie Osborne (Naas RFC/Leinster)

Somewhat disappointing from a leinster club perspective, thought there'd be more than 4. Might be injury related.

Only surprise from schools, is no Matt Grogan, that also could be injury related though.

[mildlyinterested]

There are more to follow. The loss of Conor Nash to Aussie Rules increasingly looks permanent but the next Tadhg Furlong or Seanie O’Brien, via the Youths club system, are already visible.

“There are two names that spring to mind. I’m not going to put their name out there but we are really hopeful that they will come through.

"We are also incredibly fortunate with the schools system

.”

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/ ... -1.3668357

Karl Martin and Brian Deeny are two players who come to mind for me.

[mildlyinterested]

Academy Update

Prop
Jack Aungier(Year 2/Suttonians RFC/Terenure) - sub for Leinster A.
Michael Milne(Year 1/CC Roscrea-Birr RFC/UCD) - 24th man for Leinster A.

Giuseppe Coyne(U20/Blackrock/DUFC) - DUFC 20s.
Thomas Clarkson(U19/Blackrock/DUFC) - bench for DUFC, 1 try.
Harry Noonan(U19/Greystones RFC/Old Wesley) - started at 1 for Old Wesley.

Hooker
Ronan Kelleher(Year 2/St. Michaels/Lansdowne) - started at 2 for Leinster A, 2 tries.
Dan Sheehan(Year 1/Clongowes/DUFC) - bench for DUFC.

Declan Adamson(U20/Clontarf/Clontarf) - started at 2 for Clontarf, 1 try.
Richie Bergin(U20/St. Marys/UCD) - bench for UCD.
John McKee(U19/Campbell/Old Belvedere) - started at 2 for Old Belvedere.
Ethan Baxter(U19/St. Gerards/Old Belvedere) - didn't play this weekend.

Lock
Jack Dunne(Year 1/St. Michaels/DUFC) - injured.
Ryan Baird(Year 1/St. Michaels/DUFC) - bench for Leinster A.

Charlie Ryan(U20/Blackrock/UCD) - started at 4 for UCD.

Backrow
Oisin Dowling(Year 2/St. Michaels/Lansdowne) - bench for Leinster A.
Scott Penny(Year 1/St. Michaels/UCD) - started at 7 for Leinster A.

Ronan Foley(U21/St. Marys/UCD) - started at 8 for UCD.
Ronan Watters(U20/St. Marys/St. Marys) - started at 7 for St. Marys, 1 try.
Martin Moloney(U20/Athy RFC/Old Belvedere) - didn't play this weekend.

Scrumhalf
Hugh O'Sullivan(Year 2/Belvedere/Clontarf) - started at 9 for Leinster A.
Patrick Patterson(Year 1/Blackrock/UCD) -bench for Leinster A.

Cormac Foley(U20/St. Gerards/St. Marys) - started at 9 for St. Marys.

Outhalf
Ciaran Frawley(Year 2/Skerries RFC/UCD) - started at 10 for Leinster A.
Harry Byrne(Year 1/St. Michaels/Lansdowne) - bench for Leinster A.
David Hawkshaw(Year 1/Belvedere/Clontarf) - bench for Leinster A.

Conor Kelly(U20/Roscrea/Clontarf) - started at 12 for Clontarf.

Centre
Conor O'Brien(Year 3/Mullingar RFC/Clontarf) - injured.
Jimmy O'Brien(Year 3/Newbridge/UCD) - started at 13 for Leinster A.
Gavin Mullin(Year 2/Blackrock/UCD) - injured.
Tommy O'Brien(Year 2/Blackrock/UCD) - injured.

Liam Turner(U20/Blacrock/DUFC) - bench for DUFC.

Back Three
Hugo Keenan(Year 3/Blackrock/UCD) - injured.
Jack Kelly(Year 3/St. Michaels/DUFC) - started at 15 for Leinster A, captain.
Michaels Silvester(Year 1/Clongowes/DUFC) - started at 11 for Leinster A.
Aaron O'Sullivan(Year 1/Exile/UCD) - injured.

Peter Maher(U21/Belvedere/Old Belvedere) - started at 11 for Old Belvedere.
Rob Russell(U20/St. Michaels/DUFC) - started at 15 for DUFC, 1 try.
Sam Dardis(U19/Terenure/Terenure) - started at 14 for Terenure.
Ruairi Shields(U20/St. Marys/St. Marys) - didn't play this weekend.
Hugo Conway(U20/St. Marys/St. Marys) - didn't play this weekend.

[TrapperChamonix]

Giuseppe Coyne played in the DUFC U20 team than won the Conroy (intervarsity) Cup in Cork on Sat. Beat UCC, NUIG & UCD.

[mildlyinterested]

Giuseppe Coyne played in the DUFC U20 team than won the Conroy (intervarsity) Cup in Cork on Sat. Beat UCC, NUIG & UCD.

Yeah I figured he played 20's rugby, but given how difficult it is to get team info for 20s games, I don't try to track appearances there.

[mildlyinterested]

St. Michael's College defeat Blackrock 24-3 to win Eric Lindsay Memorial Cup in Belfast.

Methodist College, Belfast celebrated their 150th Anniversary by hosting a two day tournament involving schools from all round Ireland as well as Mount Saint Mary’s from England and Cymeodd College from Wales. The tournament started on Friday 19th.

In Round 1:-
Methodist College 5 Clongowes Wood College 8
Belfast Royal Academy 7 Crescent Comprehensive College 15
Rockwell College 3 Mount St Mary’s College 0
Belvedere College 0 Wallace High School 0
Glenstall Abbey School 7 Ballymena Academy 0
St Michael’s College 21 Royal Belfast Academical Institution 7
Blackrock College 12 Campbell College 0
Christian Brother’s College 13 Cymoedd College 12

In Round 2:-
Belfast Royal Academy 10 Royal Belfast Academical Institution 17
Belvedere College 21 Christian Brother’s College 15
Ballymena Academy 0 Methodist College 17
Blackrock College 24 Rockwell College 0
St Michael’s College 17 Crescent Comprehensive College 7
Wallace High School 7 Cymoedd College 17
Clongowes Wood College 17 Glenstall Abbey 0
Campbell College 10 Mount St Mary’s College 7

In Round 3:-
Blackrock College 43 Mount St Mary’s College 0
Campbell College 12 Rockwell College 14
Belfast Royal Academy 7 St Michael’s College 14
Royal Belfast Academical Institution 12 Crescent Comprehensive College 0
Wallace High School 14 Christian Brother’s College 0
Clongowes Wood College 21 Ballymena Academy 11
Belvedere College 7 Cymoedd College 15
Methodist College 31 Glenstall Abbey 3

Results from the Methodist College 150th Anniversary Tournament games played on Saturday 20th:

Wallace High School 28 Ballymena Academy 0
Campbell College 8 Mount St Mary’s College 8
Crescent Comprehensive College 22 Belfast Royal Academy 12
Glenstall Abbey 10 Christian Brother’s College 7
Blackrock College 23 Belvedere College 7
St Michael’s College 16 Rockwell College 0
Clongowes Wood College 7 Royal Belfast Academical Institution 3
Cymoedd College 7 Methodist College 16

Eventually, with all the group games played and semi-finals of the various competitions played, Belfast Royal Academy defeated Ballymena Academy in the final of the Plate Competition, by 22-5, Campbell College lost by 12-0 against Wallace High School in the final of the Bowl Competition, Methodist College defeated Clongowes Wood College in the final of the Shield Competition and St Michael’s College defeated Blackrock College in the final of the Cup Competition winning the Eric Lindsay Memorial Cup in the process.

[neiliog93]

Interesting report. Based on the number of matches in a short space of time, it must have been like the Blackrock College 150th anniversary tournament in 2010, i.e matches with two 10-minute halves where unusually attacking rugby was encouraged, and then a slightly longer final.

I remember an Irish coach in Wales talking up the Colleg Gymoed initiative as it essentially pooled the playing resources of many different clubs/schools in the region and unashamedly and explicitly focused on rugby (whereas our private schools still have some academic focus, and have much smaller numbers). His whole tone at the time was how much better they were than our 'much vaunted' schools game. Nice to see them not to even make the semis of this tournament. Smug git.

[mildlyinterested]

Potential St. Michaels SCT team:

1. Jack Boyle(Leinster schools)
2. Lee Barron(Ireland & Leinster schools)
3. Fionn Finlay(Leinster u19) - ireland schools last season
4. Luke Dunne
5. Jonathan Fish(Leinster schools)
6. Jack Guinane(Leinster schools)
7. Mark Hernan
8. Will Hickey(Ireland & Leinster schools)
9. Rob Gilsenan(Leinster schools)
10. Niall Carroll(Leinster schools)
11. Mark O'Brien(Leinster u19) - Ireland u18 7's
12. Simon O'Kelly(Ireland & Leinster schools)
13. Chris Cosgrave(Ireland & Leinster schools) - Ireland schools last season as a u17
14. Andrew Smith(Leinster u19) - Ireland u18 7's last season & Ireland schools
15. Ed Kelly(Leinster schools)

[backrower8]

REDIRECTED POST THREAD FROM "CELTIC CUP" TOPIC

I doubt Mick Dawson sees it as 'so what?' If you lose one engine there is more pressure on the other engines to compensate and produce the same power/ player calibre. They may not.

Also, there may be contagion. Other schools, with pressure from parents, deciding to follow suit and de-emphasise rugby.

In fact this is already happening. Lots of schools have decided not to enter the Leinster schools rugby 'arms race'. Most have decided to operate at a lower level, believing that rugby should be in proportion to the rest of the curriculum. Others have internal debate on what is right for the sons/pupils and go through phases of scaling up and down on the rugby programme depending on the school leadership, coaching ticket and parents in situ at any given time.

The safety/injury levels in the sport, especially at schools, is the main barometer factor that will affect this. Another factor is the time involved as it competes with energy levels needed for leaving cert study. I had a son playing an SCT seconds game on a Saturday recently at 10:30. He had to be there at 8:30 for a video analysis session beforehand. That is to go with the 7am gym sessions twice weekly, etc. This is not one of the rugby super power schools.

With the excepton of Rock, highly professional rugby school programmes are a new thing. They are not bedded in yet and can't be seen as a permanent fixture.

Driven by the injury profile and the prospect of litigation, Rugby is fast changing and the Rugby Academy schools cannot be counted on to stay the course and power the Leinster-model as they have done up until now.

I am not saying that change is imminent. I am saying it is a much more fluid situation than we might imagine and that it currently presents a moderate risk to the Leinster Academy system and that Leinster has not got control over what happens. Influence, but not control.

Lot's of "ifs", "mights" and "mays" in there. Really what you are talking about is systemic risk. If parents turn away from the sport on mass that affects the game everywhere. You can't actually account for it until it arises and trying to involves adopting loss aversion strategies which in the absense of the risk manifesting are just irrational. For example, instead of expanding you would contract or instead curtail spending.

I'm also not convinced that the scaling up/down of rugby programs is that common or that it's not something that the branch aren't aware of.

I am talking about risk management and, outside of a professional environement, that comes with "ifs", "mights" and "maybes".

The Leinster model of success is more dependent on schools (over which they have no direct control) than probably any other pro-rugby team. Further again, they are overly dependent on just 3 schools to consistently produce multiple pro players.

They need to manage that risk by focussing on three things:

(1) Firstly, though much is being done they must go much, much further in terms of making safety the number one priority across the sport in the province. It needs to be a key driver in the culture of rugby at all levels. This will help with the parents.

(2) Secondly, widen the number of schools and clubs that consistently produce pro players. Michael's, Clongowes & Rock are provider of over half and Michael's currently produce 1 in 4. Belvedere are beginning to produce more players, but they still only have one senior player in the ranks and he is in his 30s. There could be a harvest from Terenure (currently zero senior players and very few in the academy, if any?). Mary's (one third the size of Rock & Belvo) have produced more Lions players than any other school - currently they have 2 players aged 33 & 29. If those schools are added to the other 3 that are performing then we are reducing the risk.

Given the health of their rugby programmes, schools like Gonzaga (currently 3 pro players but one for Leinster), Newbridge (1 player), Gerard's (1 player), Castlenock (1 Leinster player) should all be targeted to consistently producing multiple pro players - if they aren't already. If they did the we would be up to 10 schools. I am not knowledgeable enough on the club scene to say what provincial clubs might have potential to be part of that.

How you do so, I don't know but perhaps grants towards 4G pitches and stronger coaching alliances are part of it.

The potential for schools to scale down their rugby programmes is considerable. Terenure, Belvedere and Mary's have done so in the recent past. Some of these are said to be scaling back up again - Belvedere obviously switched back to investing in rugby around the time, 15 years ago, when Terenure reduced their rugby focus. Other rugby schools have long ago decided to opt out of being seriously competitive for a range or reasons are CBC Monkstown, Pres Bray, Wesley, De La Salle, Kings Hospital, High School. That said the likes of Gerard's, Gonzaga and St Fintans have all invested and become stronger.

Safety is the main issue concerning parentsand school boards, but the time it takes out of the leaving cert cycle is another thing. Last week my son had to be in school at 8:30 on a Saturday for video analysis before a 10:30 match kick-off...and this is the SCT Seconds team in a non-superpower Dublin school. That is in addition to the twice-weekly 7am gym sessions to go with the regular practive and game time. I know that the SCT squad in Michael's perform very highly and have seen some pupils get higher scores than would have been expected because the coaches impress upon them that SCT rugby cannot be an excuse for Leaving Cert results and the pupils actually get used to performig to very high standards both academically as well as in rugby terms. Maybe other schools can foster a co-ordinated work-hard play harddynamic because it seems to be working for Michael's.

In addition to safety and time, there are also internal battles in terms of resources and many schools' belief that they must ensure a balanced curriculum where everyone's pastime is equally regarded and appropriately resourced.

All-in-all schools have a balancing act to perform and their is no guarantee that strong feeder schools won't dilute their rugby focus owing to negative events or just a change in leadership.

(3) Finally, Leinster Rugby should actively protect the egg-laying hens they have already. If they aren't already, Leinster Rugby should make sure there are regular one-to-ones between them and senior management (not just the DoRs) at the key feeder schools to make sure any issues are nipped in the bud early. This is easier said than done.


The sky is not falling on our heads, but we have a number of significant fault lines in our deservedly much-vaunted model that need to be actively (risk) managed.