Celtic Cup

[D4surfer]

8 15 into last few minutes

[Dave Cahill]

All over, Leinster win, 8 - 15. Prepare the ticker tape.

[D4surfer]

Final score Scarlets 8 Leinster A 15. Our first cup this season.

[cormac]

When's the homecoming?

Fair play to them. Seven wins from seven. First, and hopefully not the last, trophy of the season.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Anyone know if the celebration will be in Thomond or Musgrave?

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Well done to everyone involved. I was pretty impressed with the games I saw. Great attitude and skills, well done!

[riocard911]

To beat the Scarlets in Scarletania in a final is not to be sniffed at. Well done to all involved!!!!

[naraic]

Is that the A team done for the season?

[cormac]

Is that the A team done for the season?

Well it's the end of this season's Celtic Cup. Quite a few of that side are going to be playing a lot of Pro14 rugby between now and the end of the 6N.

[Ruckedtobits]

And othees a lot of AIL - because there's nothing in between. A complete nonsense.

[dropkick]

And othees a lot of AIL - because there's nothing in between. A complete nonsense.

There was talk that they might play more A games against the Welsh sometime after Christmas.


If the tournament is seen as a success it might be expanded next season. Wayne Pivac praised it saying it's a big step up from the Welsh league. They were probably testing the waters to see how these 7 weeks went.

[CiaranIrl]

Most of that team will be playing Treviso away in 6 days and then flying to South Africa to play the kings. Players almost certainly that will be missing from the trips are McGrath, Healy, Cronin, Furlong, Porter, Ryan, Toner, Leavy, VDF, O'Brien, Conan, Ruddock, Sexton, McGrath, Henshaw, Ringrose, Rob Kearney.

[backrower8]

Leinster Rugby ‘A’

15. Jack Kelly(U22) CAPTAIN
14. Adam Byrne
13. Jimmy O’Brien
12. Tom Daly
11. Michael Silvester(U21)
10. Ciarán Frawley(U22)
9. Hugh O’Sullivan(U21)
1. Peter Dooley
2. Ronan Kelleher(U21)
3. Vakh Abdaladze
4. Ross Molony
5. Mick Kearney
6. Josh Murphy
7. Scott Penny(U20)
8. Caelan Doris(U21)

16. Bryan Byrne
17. Ed Byrne
18. Jack Aungier(U21)
19. Ian Nagle
20. Oisín Dowling(U22)
21. Patrick Patterson(U21)
22. Harry Byrne(U20)
23. David Hawkshaw(U20)

Ryan Baird in for Ian Nagle.

8 ex-St. Michael's players in the winning 23. With half the pack plus 2 forward subs.

7 with the Senior team in Toulouse (including Deegan & Reid as cover)

2 injured (Leavy and Dunne)

Of course I think that is great kudos to Michael's on the one hand but on the other hand it is a danger to have too many players coming through too few channels. Three schools provide over 50% of te Academy. As I have said elsewhere, all it takes is a change of tack at school Board level and supplies could dwindle within 2 years. Its a significant risk that Leinster Rugby doesn't have much leverage over.

[mildlyinterested]

So what? the system is producing an excess of players which are ending up elsewhere.. if St. Michaels starts to produce less, there are still plenty of players being produced.

[backrower8]

So what? the system is producing an excess of players which are ending up elsewhere.. if St. Michaels starts to produce less, there are still plenty of players being produced.

I doubt Mick Dawson sees it as 'so what?' If you lose one engine there is more pressure on the other engines to compensate and produce the same power/ player calibre. They may not.

Also, there may be contagion. Other schools, with pressure from parents, deciding to follow suit and de-emphasise rugby.

In fact this is already happening. Lots of schools have decided not to enter the Leinster schools rugby 'arms race'. Most have decided to operate at a lower level, believing that rugby should be in proportion to the rest of the curriculum. Others have internal debate on what is right for the sons/pupils and go through phases of scaling up and down on the rugby programme depending on the school leadership, coaching ticket and parents in situ at any given time.

The safety/injury levels in the sport, especially at schools, is the main barometer factor that will affect this. Another factor is the time involved as it competes with energy levels needed for leaving cert study. I had a son playing an SCT seconds game on a Saturday recently at 10:30. He had to be there at 8:30 for a video analysis session beforehand. That is to go with the 7am gym sessions twice weekly, etc. This is not one of the rugby super power schools.

With the excepton of Rock, highly professional rugby school programmes are a new thing. They are not bedded in yet and can't be seen as a permanent fixture.

Driven by the injury profile and the prospect of litigation, Rugby is fast changing and the Rugby Academy schools cannot be counted on to stay the course and power the Leinster-model as they have done up until now.

I am not saying that change is imminent. I am saying it is a much more fluid situation than we might imagine and that it currently presents a moderate risk to the Leinster Academy system and that Leinster has not got control over what happens. Influence, but not control.

[mildlyinterested]

You are talking about an almost worst case scenario and a fundamental shift in rugby in the province/country..

[TrapperChamonix]

Of course I think that is great kudos to Michael's on the one hand but on the other hand it is a danger to have too many players coming through too few channels. Three schools provide over 50% of te Academy. As I have said elsewhere, all it takes is a change of tack at school Board level and supplies could dwindle within 2 years. Its a significant risk that Leinster Rugby doesn't have much leverage over.

Not this again. Can you put it on a different thread.

[paddyor]

I doubt Mick Dawson sees it as 'so what?' If you lose one engine there is more pressure on the other engines to compensate and produce the same power/ player calibre. They may not.

Also, there may be contagion. Other schools, with pressure from parents, deciding to follow suit and de-emphasise rugby.

In fact this is already happening. Lots of schools have decided not to enter the Leinster schools rugby 'arms race'. Most have decided to operate at a lower level, believing that rugby should be in proportion to the rest of the curriculum. Others have internal debate on what is right for the sons/pupils and go through phases of scaling up and down on the rugby programme depending on the school leadership, coaching ticket and parents in situ at any given time.

The safety/injury levels in the sport, especially at schools, is the main barometer factor that will affect this. Another factor is the time involved as it competes with energy levels needed for leaving cert study. I had a son playing an SCT seconds game on a Saturday recently at 10:30. He had to be there at 8:30 for a video analysis session beforehand. That is to go with the 7am gym sessions twice weekly, etc. This is not one of the rugby super power schools.

With the excepton of Rock, highly professional rugby school programmes are a new thing. They are not bedded in yet and can't be seen as a permanent fixture.

Driven by the injury profile and the prospect of litigation, Rugby is fast changing and the Rugby Academy schools cannot be counted on to stay the course and power the Leinster-model as they have done up until now.

I am not saying that change is imminent. I am saying it is a much more fluid situation than we might imagine and that it currently presents a moderate risk to the Leinster Academy system and that Leinster has not got control over what happens. Influence, but not control.

Lot's of "ifs", "mights" and "mays" in there. Really what you are talking about is systemic risk. If parents turn away from the sport on mass that affects the game everywhere. You can't actually account for it until it arises and trying to involves adopting loss aversion strategies which in the absense of the risk manifesting are just irrational. For example, instead of expanding you would contract or instead curtail spending.

I'm also not convinced that the scaling up/down of rugby programs is that common or that it's not something that the branch aren't aware of.

[backrower8]

Not this again. Can you put it on a different thread.

Done. To the Academy thread.

[mildlyinterested]

shame there was never any decent coverage of the final, not even highlights.