Leinster Squad 19-20

[leinsterforever]

I'm struggling to get my head round the need for the Kelleher signing a bit. I wonder if there was an element of wanting to show the IRFU that Leinster is the best place for players to be to develop. He's got to an OK level at Connacht, but he's plateaued a bit, and isn't really in the frame for international selection. Do Leinster want to be able to point to having developed him to a higher level?

[mildlyinterested]

I think it's quite clear why they signed him, there will be large turnover in the back three very soon and he is an experienced talented player who is still relatively young who came through the academy setup. Bar Larmour there aren't any back three players younger than him that you'd say are obviously better than him or have noticeably more talent and certainly don't have as much experience:

Cian Kelleher(25)
Hugo Keenan(23) - injured playing 7's, severity unknown.
Jimmy O'Brien(22) - converted centre.
Jordan Larmour(22) - absent during WC
Jack Kelly(21) - on temp WC contract, 7's player, yet to take part in preseason.
Gavin Mullin(21) - converted centre.
Tommy O'Brien(21) - missed most of last season due to injury, unclear if he will play centre or wing
Michael Silvester(21) - 7's player, yet to take part in preseason.
Liam Turner(20) - unclear if he will play centre or wing.
Aaron O'Sullivan(19) - missed most of last season due to injury, expected to play 7's next season.

[leinsterforever]

I think it's quite clear why they signed him, there will be large turnover in the back three very soon and he is an experienced talented player who is still relatively young who came through the academy setup. Bar Larmour there aren't any back three players younger than him that you'd say are obviously better than him or have noticeably more talent and certainly don't have as much experience:

Cian Kelleher(25)
Hugo Keenan(23) - injured playing 7's, severity unknown.
Jimmy O'Brien(22) - converted centre.
Jordan Larmour(22) - absent during WC
Jack Kelly(21) - on temp WC contract, 7's player, yet to take part in preseason.
Gavin Mullin(21) - converted centre.
Tommy O'Brien(21) - missed most of last season due to injury, unclear if he will play centre or wing
Michael Silvester(21) - 7's player, yet to take part in preseason.
Liam Turner(20) - unclear if he will play centre or wing.
Aaron O'Sullivan(19) - missed most of last season due to injury, expected to play 7's next season.

All that's true, but none of DK, A. Byrne, Lowe and Barry Daly is going anywhere anytime soon. Even if Robert Kearney, McFadden, Tomane, Jack Kelly and Gavin Mullin are all gone by the start of the season after next, you could still put out the following three backlines without Kelleher.

9. Gibson-Park, 10. Sexton, 11. Lowe, 12. Henshaw, 13. Ringrose, 14. Daly, 15. Larmour; 21. McGrath, 22. R. Byrne, 23. O'Loughlin
9. O'Sullivan, 10. Frawley, 11. D. Kearney, 12. C. O'Brien, 13. J. O'Brien, 14. A. Byrne, 15. Keenan; 21. Patterson, 22. H. Byrne, 23. T. O'Brien
9. Cormac Foley, 10. Conor Kelly/David Hawkshaw, 11. Robert Russell/U20 winger, 12. David Hawkshaw/Mick O'Gara, 13. Liam Turner, 14. Aaron O'Sullivan, 15. Michael Sylvester; 21. Rowan Osborne/James Kenny/U20 scrumhalf, 22. Paddy McKenzie, 23. Adam la Grue

You'd know more about who's in the sub academy and U20 sides and thus more likely to get selected in the third line up, but you get the picture.

I suppose it makes a bit more sense if you're looking at him as a 15. For me, though, he's much more suited to left wing. I think I'd prefer to see all of Keenan, Frawley, Kelly and JOB looked at at fullback ahead of him, and I'm not sure he makes the Euro squad for next season at this stage.

[leinsterforever]

Thinking about it, I suppose the squad numbers required for Lancaster's training methods could be a factor in the Kelleher signing. Ross Molony talked about it in this article https://www.the42.ie/ross-molony-leinst ... 5-May2019/

“The most notable thing about Stuart is the work he does for the whole squad, as opposed to just focusing on the main 23,” says Molony. “The way our sessions are done, it’s three full teams involved.

“Two teams are playing against each other at one time, while the third team is wrestling and then swapping in all the time. It’s not just focused on the matchday 15 or 23, it’s about everyone getting their hands on the ball, getting equal reps.

“Seeing young lads coming out of school and getting those sessions, they’re going to learn so much quicker. If I had that in my first year coming out of school, I know for a fact I’d be a better player today. They’re so lucky to have that experience".

I guess you still need those three teams of players when the internationals are away, so that's probably why they have a few extra bodies around.

Discounting RWC squad members:

9: JGP, HOS, Patterson, Osborne
10: Frawley, H. Byrne, Hawkshaw
11: Lowe, McFadden, Kelleher
12: COB, Tomane, TOB
13: ROL, JOB, Mullin, Turner
14: Daly, A. Byrne, O'Sullivan
15: Keenan, Kelly, Sylvester

Then with Reid and Tom Daly leaving and maybe a few players off with the 7s, and factoring in the probability of some injuries, that's probably where the need for the signing is coming from.

[mildlyinterested]

WC Squad

LH Prop(3)
Ed Byrne(26)
Peter Dooley(25)
Michael Milne(20)

TH Prop(5)
Michael Bent(33)
Vakh Abdaladze(23)
Roman Salanoa(21)
Jack Aungier(20)
Tom Clarkson(19)

Hooker(4)
James Tracy(28)
Bryan Byrne(26)
Ronan Kelleher(21)
Dan Sheehan(21)

Lock(7)
Scott Fardy(35)
Devin Toner(33)
Ross Molony(25)
Oisin Dowling(22)
Jack Dunne(20)
Ryan Baird(20)
Charlie Ryan(20)

Backrow(9)
Josh Murphy(24)
Will Connors(23)
David Aspil(23)
Max Deegan(22)
Caelan Doris(21)
Scott Penny(20)
Martin Moloney(19) - injured?
Brian Deeny(19)

Scrumhalf(4)
Jamie Gibson Park(27)
Rowan Osborne(22)
Hugh O'Sullivan(21)
Patrick Patterson(20)

Outhalf(2)
Ross Byrne(24)
Harry Byrne(20)

Centre(7)
Joe Tomane(29)
Rory O'Loughlin(25)
Conor O'Brien(23)
Gavin Mullin(21)
Tommy O'Brien(21)
Liam Turner(20)

Back Three(7)
Fergus McFadden(33)
Dave Kearney(30)
James Lowe(27)
Adam Byrne(25)
Cian Kelleher(25)
Hugo Keenan(23)
Jimmy O'Brien(22)
Jack Kelly(21) - injured?

Unavailable due to injury
Dan Leavy(25)
Ciaran Frawley(21)
David Hawkshaw(20)
Barry Daly(27)

[blockhead]

JACK CONAN WILL have surgery on the foot he injured at the World Cup as Leinster prepare to be without their number eight for an extended period, including the opening stages of their Heineken Champions Cup campaign.
Conan suffered the injury in the build-up to Ireland’s second World Cup game against Japan and having returned to Leinster last week, will now have a procedure in the UK to repair the damage

The first casualty of the World Cup.

[wixfjord]

Huge shame for him. He has been really unlucky with injuries.

Big change now for Deegan/Doris to step up, and potentially Connors to take a bench spot too.

[mildlyinterested]

Craig Ronaldson pictured training with Leinster today.

Apparently he has a USA job lined up and is in getting fit with Leinster.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Mentioned this before when I said I was wrong about us not missing Jordi (because of numbers, not his quality) but it's hard to believe that we'll be starting the season without Conan, Leavy, Heaslip, SOB, and Jordi. Hopefully Rhys and Josh make it back from Japan in one piece.

[LeinsterLeader]

Craig Ronaldson pictured training with Leinster today.

Apparently he has a USA job lined up and is in getting fit with Leinster.

Yeah but did we have to give him gear. I hope it's only a loan.

We're not made of money

[Pilotman123]

Craig Ronaldson pictured training with Leinster today.

Apparently he has a USA job lined up and is in getting fit with Leinster.

Yeah but did we have to give him gear. I hope it's only a loan.

We're not made of money

He’s only doing it for the free gear, along with most of the Leinster players

[Workhorse]

Craig Ronaldson pictured training with Leinster today.

Apparently he has a USA job lined up and is in getting fit with Leinster.

Yeah but did we have to give him gear. I hope it's only a loan.

We're not made of money

He’s only doing it for the free gear, along with most most rugby players in the world.

Fixed that there for you. The free gear is one of the best parts of rugby and kit day is every players Christmas.

[mildlyinterested]

Leinster replacements for players in their mid 30's, who may be in their final season with Leinster:

Sean Cronin(34) -> Ronan Kelleher(22)
Michael Bent(34) -> Vakh Abdaladze(24)
Scott Fardy(36) -> Ryan Baird(21)
Rob Kearney(34) -> Jimmy O'Brien(23)
Fergus McFadden(34) -> Adam Byrne(26)

I doubt Cronin is in his final season playing pro rugby but it's possible he gets offered a move elsewhere he can't turn down, give it likely will be his final chance at a big payday.

[Morf]

Rob K and Ferg strike me as the two most feeling the miles of pro rugby in terms of recurring injury issues.

I think Fardy could do another season but difficult to see being sanctioned.
Similar with Bent despite his great service but is IQ.

Expect Cronin to re-sign.

[Pilotman123]

Leinster replacements for players in their mid 30's, who may be in their final season with Leinster:

Sean Cronin(34) -> Ronan Kelleher(22)
Michael Bent(34) -> Vakh Abdaladze(24)
Scott Fardy(36) -> Ryan Baird(21)
Rob Kearney(34) -> Jimmy O'Brien(23)
Fergus McFadden(34) -> Adam Byrne(26)

I doubt Cronin is in his final season playing pro rugby but it's possible he gets offered a move elsewhere he can't turn down, give it likely will be his final chance at a big payday.

Ryan Baird has just turned 20 he’s not 21

[mildlyinterested]

Leinster replacements for players in their mid 30's, who may be in their final season with Leinster:

Sean Cronin(34) -> Ronan Kelleher(22)
Michael Bent(34) -> Vakh Abdaladze(24)
Scott Fardy(36) -> Ryan Baird(21)
Rob Kearney(34) -> Jimmy O'Brien(23)
Fergus McFadden(34) -> Adam Byrne(26)

I doubt Cronin is in his final season playing pro rugby but it's possible he gets offered a move elsewhere he can't turn down, give it likely will be his final chance at a big payday.

Ryan Baird has just turned 20 he’s not 21

Ages are as of the start of next season, when they'd be theoretically replacing the older players in 1st team squad.

[cormac]

Rowan Osborne has been given a contract after impressing during his trial

[backrower8]

Rowan Osborne has been given a contract after impressing during his trial

Given the above, how do people reflect on the loss of Nick McCarthy to Munster? I thought he had the best pass in the squad and a good strategic head reflected by him being a former Ireland U20 Captain. Did he choose to go or was he pushed?

[arsebiscuits1]

Rowan Osborne has been given a contract after impressing during his trial

Given the above, how do people reflect on the loss of Nick McCarthy to Munster? I thought he had the best pass in the squad and a good strategic head reflected by him being a former Ireland U20 Captain. Did he choose to go or was he pushed?

He definitely chose.

I rated Nick but he's very much 3rd choice and still would be behind JGP and Luke.

Probably saw a good chance at Munster. Lot of first team rugby available there with Murray getting minutes managed. And a good chance for European rugby.

I don't think he banked on Matthewson still being there. I think he has a year or 2 left on his 3 month contract

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[ronk]

McCarthy would have seen Park due to qualify IQ and thought he was going to play less. He chose.

It's worked out surprisingly well for him so far in terms of selection. I thought he was a better player when he was here than what I've seen in the last few weeks.