D'Arcy called up

[Durkah Durkah]

I await Mr Cotton's apology to D'Arcy. I do hope he makes his apology as public as he decided he make his negative, incorrect remarks. Somehow I doubt we will hear anything.

[Turnip Boy]

Perhaps EOS owes him an apology as well?

Woodward's assistant Test coach O'Sullivan yesterday confirmed D'Arcy's action and said: "He's really beaten up at the moment. He had a big game Tuesday night and he's exhausted.

"Clive discussed it with him yesterday morning and they talked about his state of health and he told him he was pretty exhausted. It's a big call for him, he could have said nothing maybe. But he wasn't up for Test rugby and he could've under-performed and let himself and the team down. So it's a pretty brave call and I like to think that that sort of honesty should be encouraged in a player. He felt that way and I'm okay with that. He's done the right thing."

http://archives.tcm.ie/irishexaminer/20 ... 752958.asp

[Dave Cahill]

You're making the same mistake, you've forgotten who actually wrote all the articles that came from the Lions players and staff.

Could it be the man who re-wrote each entry of Geordan Murphys tour diary?

Could it be the man who organised for lord bald to walk briefly past henson while he hid in some bushes with a photographer with a long lens in order to mock up a picture that made it look like they were on speaking terms?

Could it be the man who organised the players media and confidentially contracts that were nearly 50 pages long (compared to their participation agreements which were only 5)?

And you've forgotten that EOS, whatever his faults, was unremittingly loyal to his players, too loyal as it turned out in some cases, and would never say anything like that in public.

[Danthefan]

You're making the same mistake, you've forgotten who actually wrote all the articles that came from the Lions players and staff.

Could it be the man who re-wrote each entry of Geordan Murphys tour diary?

Could it be the man who organised for lord bald to walk briefly past henson while he hid in some bushes with a photographer with a long lens in order to mock up a picture that made it look like they were on speaking terms?

Could it be the man who organised the players media and confidentially contracts that were nearly 50 pages long (compared to their participation agreements which were only 5)?

I guess lord bald = SCW?

Jaysus if that stuff is true then no wonder the tour failed horribly.

[Dave Cahill]

You're making the same mistake, you've forgotten who actually wrote all the articles that came from the Lions players and staff.

Could it be the man who re-wrote each entry of Geordan Murphys tour diary?

Could it be the man who organised for lord bald to walk briefly past henson while he hid in some bushes with a photographer with a long lens in order to mock up a picture that made it look like they were on speaking terms?

Could it be the man who organised the players media and confidentially contracts that were nearly 50 pages long (compared to their participation agreements which were only 5)?

I guess lord bald = SCW?

Jaysus if that stuff is true then no wonder the tour failed horribly.

Yep, Lord Bald is SCW and his evil lieutenant was Alistair "Prince of Darkness" Campbell

[Turnip Boy]

You're making the same mistake, you've forgotten who actually wrote all the articles that came from the Lions players and staff.

Could it be the man who re-wrote each entry of Geordan Murphys tour diary?

Could it be the man who organised for lord bald to walk briefly past henson while he hid in some bushes with a photographer with a long lens in order to mock up a picture that made it look like they were on speaking terms?

Could it be the man who organised the players media and confidentially contracts that were nearly 50 pages long (compared to their participation agreements which were only 5)?

And you've forgotten that EOS, whatever his faults, was unremittingly loyal to his players, too loyal as it turned out in some cases, and would never say anything like that in public.

so first Fran Cotton is a liar and now the journo who has quoted EOS is a liar. keep your tinfoil hat on.

I can accept the viewpoint that Fran Cotton was misinformed and posters made valid points that perhaps he wasn't close enough to the 2005 tour but to say a direct quote from a coach at the time of the incident (and as you pointed out a coach who was unbelievably loyal to his players) is untrue is just clueless. Whatever scope Alistair Campbell had on that tour to amend tour diaries and written interviews I'm fairly sure he wasn't a focking ventrilaquist and actually able to throw his voice - the above is a direct quote.

[Dave Cahill]

It kind of slipped under the radar what a media war the last tour was. Well before the tour started, Graham Henry and the NZRFU called the heads of all the media companies in NZ to a meeting. There, they were informed that unless the NZRFU had copy approval of any and all communications in papers, radio, television and new media relating to the tour, then the offending company would have their staffs credentials pulled, they would be refused player access, would have their photo rights pulled etc. They also wanted the media companies to seed certain stories and adhere to a agreed media message. The NZ media, fearful of what would happen to their circulation/viewership/listenership etc without being able to carry All Black news, agreed. The home nations media heard about this, and they organised a meeting between SCW and the senior member of each countrys rugby press, including the likes of Peter O'Reilly and Stephen Jones. They warned him about what the NZers were up to and told him in the strongest terms possible that he had to get a top level media manager in his party, this was when Alastair Campbells name was first mentioned. Lord Bald took this on board and hired Campbell to be media manager for the tour. Campbell was of course infamous for being the pitbull behind the New Labour projects public face. He was intensely disliked, feared and admired by turns by the UK media. His presence on the tour ramped up what was already a fractious relationship between the hosts and the tourists to a frenzy in media terms.

It was also a classic piece of what the tabloids like to call 'double bubble', where you get two stories for the price of one...you run "Vicar Is Sex Pest" on a saturday, then you can run "Vicar denies Sex Pest Slur" on a sunday. The media could then go with SCW appoints prince of darkness as media manager, and follow it up with lots of "Prince of darkness does x, y and z" stories

[Dave Cahill]

so first Fran Cotton is a liar and now the journo who has quoted EOS is a liar. keep your tinfoil hat on.

No, Fran Cotton has been proven to be a liar. But again, you're making the mistake of thinking a) There was a quote in the first place, and b) A journalist quoted it, when its far more likely that the press were given a press release as only the TV media were given access to press conferences

[Turnip Boy]

Fran Cotton's a liar,
Clive Woodward is a liar,
Alistair Campbell is not only a liar but also has faked comments from EOS to show D'Arcy in a bad light,
EOS never made those comments,
Gordon D'Arcy takes four years to make a reply and is of course quoted correctly and without question correct - case closed.

Up there with comments like Gerry Thornley being a turncoat for giving a fair analysis of Leinsters performance around the turn of the year.

[Dave Cahill]

Anyone who believes the Cotton/Bald story is simply intellectually subnormal.

QED

Don't worry though, I'm sure Keith will be allowed watch the tests from the stand. Its only any chance of a start that Darce has taken from him.

[suisse]

I don't know as much of this as I probably should, and I know it is totally unrelated to your argument guys, but did SCW ask Alaistair Campbell to perform a "motivational speech" to the squad prior to one of the tests matches? Apparently telling the players how/where they can beat the All Blacks, and then trying some Jim Telfer 1997 stuff? I think it was Ben Kay who exposed this, and he felt like walking out because he felt, and rightly so; "who is this guy talking to us about rugby?". There was then a press release/quote from somewhere and someone trying to disprove Kay's comments, and stating that maybe the players needed all the help they could get, given the poor standard of their rugby, as opposed to the coaching and team selections which were never slated.

[Turnip Boy]

its funny how well know and (some) well respected rugby coach's, managers etc all of whom were there and some in an offical capacity are all liars, misquoted or never said anything and interspazz web posters know the entire behind the scenes story.

The truth is out there.

[Xanthippe]

Apart from being in the Irish Times (which some people might claim is biased in favour of Irish players) Darce's side of the story is currently up on the official Lions website - would they publish it if it wasn't true?

Gordon D'Arcy is happy to be back in the British & Irish Lions fold and wants to put to bed some of the myths and rumours that circulated around his last trip with the tourists four years ago.
Then it was claimed by Clive Woodward that the Leinster and Ireland centre was “too exhausted” to be considered for the final Test match against the All Blacks.

It was an episode, as he told Gerry Thornley of the Irish Times before linking up with the Lions in South Africa, that hurt him deeply.

“I was deeply disappointed that any rugby player, whatever about commentators or pundits, and particularly former British & Irish Lions, might suggest I would have chosen not to play in a Test match for the Lions because I was exhausted or suffering from exhaustion. That’s just nonsensical,” he said.

“I have to admit I was upset by it. Unfortunately the spin that was put on what occurred has ensured that certain people believed that.

“I know the truth of what happened but I want to put the matter to rest and there’s no better way of doing that than having the opportunity to play for the Lions again.”

That chance will come sooner rather than later in South Africa given the injury sustained by England’s Riki Flutey in his brief appearance off the bench in the opening game against the Royal XV. D’Arcy may only have just arrived, but he is in commanding form.

He scored a try for the Barbarians in their 33-26 win over England at Twickenham and was alongside fellow Lions Brian O’Driscoll, Luke Fitzgerald, Rob Kearney and Jamie Heaslip when Leinster won the Heineken Cup for the first time a week earlier at Murrayfield.

He had headed to San Franciso for a holiday after that Twickenham triumph, but took the call inviting him to come to South Africa a few hours after having a work-out in the gym at his hotel.

“While I’d hoped to make the original squad I don’t feel that the honour is in any way lessened by being called up in this manner,” said D’Arcy.

His call-up completes a dramatic transformation in fortunes. After suffering multiple fractures of his arm, and undergoing three operations, in 2008 there were some who feared he would never get back to his best.

But he returned to the Leinster fold, eased his way back into the Irish RBS Six Nations side with a try against the French and by the end of the Grand Slam campaign was as integral and influential a part of the team as ever.

“It just shows you how dramatically things can turn around. In the same way as you can be on an absolute high as a player and get an injury that can rule you out for six months or a year, it can happen in reverse,” he told the Irish Times.

“I had to earn my place back in the Leinster team, and then the Irish team. Then there was the Grand Slam, then the Heineken Cup and now the Lions. So things have gone full circle from the pits of despair to now achieving everything and anything in a season that any player would want to achieve.”


http://www.lionsrugby.com/news/7957.php

[Hickiefan]

Turnip Boy, what you don't seem to understand is that media and PR managers routinely represent players/coaches' thoughts etc in text based on the "message" that the organisation want to "promote". Sometimes the person being "quoted" sees it first and signs it off but frequently they don't. So just because something is issued to the press in quotes does not mean someone ever uttered those words. This does not make journalists who reproduce them liars - more like pawns if the truth be told.

Every time a rugby player is involved with a product PR wise and a press release is issued do you think the words "quoted" as coming from them are really theirs or those of the product's PR manager?

Same with players' columns in newspapers - most are ghost written. Sometimes, but not always, based on a phone conversation.

This is not a comment on the D'Arcy saga as I don't know anything about it* but about media generally, of which I have plenty of experience.

Don't always believe what you read basically!

*From what I know about GD though I find it hard to believe the story and the facts support the injury case.

[Turnip Boy]

Apart from being in the Irish Times (which some people might claim is biased in favour of Irish players) Darce's side of the story is currently up on the official Lions website - would they publish it if it wasn't true?

Gordon D'Arcy is happy to be back in the British & Irish Lions fold and wants to put to bed some of the myths and rumours that circulated around his last trip with the tourists four years ago.
Then it was claimed by Clive Woodward that the Leinster and Ireland centre was “too exhausted” to be considered for the final Test match against the All Blacks.

It was an episode, as he told Gerry Thornley of the Irish Times before linking up with the Lions in South Africa, that hurt him deeply.

“I was deeply disappointed that any rugby player, whatever about commentators or pundits, and particularly former British & Irish Lions, might suggest I would have chosen not to play in a Test match for the Lions because I was exhausted or suffering from exhaustion. That’s just nonsensical,” he said.

“I have to admit I was upset by it. Unfortunately the spin that was put on what occurred has ensured that certain people believed that.

“I know the truth of what happened but I want to put the matter to rest and there’s no better way of doing that than having the opportunity to play for the Lions again.”

That chance will come sooner rather than later in South Africa given the injury sustained by England’s Riki Flutey in his brief appearance off the bench in the opening game against the Royal XV. D’Arcy may only have just arrived, but he is in commanding form.

He scored a try for the Barbarians in their 33-26 win over England at Twickenham and was alongside fellow Lions Brian O’Driscoll, Luke Fitzgerald, Rob Kearney and Jamie Heaslip when Leinster won the Heineken Cup for the first time a week earlier at Murrayfield.

He had headed to San Franciso for a holiday after that Twickenham triumph, but took the call inviting him to come to South Africa a few hours after having a work-out in the gym at his hotel.

“While I’d hoped to make the original squad I don’t feel that the honour is in any way lessened by being called up in this manner,” said D’Arcy.

His call-up completes a dramatic transformation in fortunes. After suffering multiple fractures of his arm, and undergoing three operations, in 2008 there were some who feared he would never get back to his best.

But he returned to the Leinster fold, eased his way back into the Irish RBS Six Nations side with a try against the French and by the end of the Grand Slam campaign was as integral and influential a part of the team as ever.

“It just shows you how dramatically things can turn around. In the same way as you can be on an absolute high as a player and get an injury that can rule you out for six months or a year, it can happen in reverse,” he told the Irish Times.

“I had to earn my place back in the Leinster team, and then the Irish team. Then there was the Grand Slam, then the Heineken Cup and now the Lions. So things have gone full circle from the pits of despair to now achieving everything and anything in a season that any player would want to achieve.”


http://www.lionsrugby.com/news/7957.php

whats to stop anyone claiming what he has said is a lie and he's only covering himself for what really happened in 2005. If you are to believe certain tinfoil wearing hat posters here thats what Fran Cotton, Clive Woodward, Eddie O'Suillivan, Alistar Campbell and certain journalists have all done.

[Hickiefan]

whats to stop anyone claiming what he has said is a lie and he's only covering himself for what really happened in 2005. If you are to believe certain tinfoil wearing hat posters here thats what Fran Cotton, Clive Woodward, Eddie O'Suillivan, Alistar Campbell and certain journalists have all done.

Very selective reading of the situation. Did you read my post? You are a very trusting soul and, clearly, you resent D'Arcy having another chance (one way or another). Why not just say so?

[Danthefan]

whats to stop anyone claiming what he has said is a lie and he's only covering himself for what really happened in 2005. If you are to believe certain tinfoil wearing hat posters here thats what Fran Cotton, Clive Woodward, Eddie O'Suillivan, Alistar Campbell and certain journalists have all done.

Very selective reading of the situation. Did you read my post? You are a very trusting soul and, clearly, you resent D'Arcy having another chance (one way or another). Why not just say so?

Somebody is just cranky that Earls' chances at a test have pretty much gone, you are wasting perfectly good keyboard strokes Hickiefan.

[Turnip Boy]

whats to stop anyone claiming what he has said is a lie and he's only covering himself for what really happened in 2005. If you are to believe certain tinfoil wearing hat posters here thats what Fran Cotton, Clive Woodward, Eddie O'Suillivan, Alistar Campbell and certain journalists have all done.

Very selective reading of the situation. Did you read my post? You are a very trusting soul and, clearly, you resent D'Arcy having another chance (one way or another). Why not just say so?

I wish D'Arcy well dispite what Dan the MF.com wum thinks. His inclusion in the squad is hardly likely to impact Earls. Earls was always unlikely to make the starting test XV and is more likely to be considered for a wing or full back slot or perhaps at best a spot on the bench for the test matches. I don't see D'Arcy affecting that too much to be honest. D'Arcy is more a starting player at 12 than likely to cover on the bench and there are far better options at wing and full back.

selective reading? there are many quotes out there from different people - some closer to the incident than others. Yet all those who are in anyway opposed to the D'Arcy is whiter than white point of view is a proven liar and bollix.

I have read your post and agree with it to a point. The 2005 was a car crash of a tour from a media perspective - but that was due to the actions of players in 2001 and something had to be done (i do agree it did go over the top). The going for a few "walks" was one of my favourites and I think the belief that all quotes related to this issue were made up are laughable.

the idea that anyone whether it be a former player/coach/journalist etc who says anything that is not pro Leinster is a turncoat/liar/proven liar /bollix etc is hardly new to the site.

[stuwilson]

If an ant farted in Jo'burg would it get it's own topic here.....who cares what was said by whom 4 odd years ago....D'Arcy is there now he'll get his chance and it's up to him to take it!!

[jhc99]

I think, for what it's worth (not much), that there was likely to be a bit of embellishment on both sides. Perhaps D'Arcy did have an injury that he thought would preclude him from playing and perhaps the management team thought that D'Arcy's shoulder injury was more of a 'chip on the shoulder' due to his shabby treatment by SCW and should not have precluded him from playing (which is what I heard from someone inside the camp but maybe that was also a load of balls).

I think the main thing is that we wish D'Arcy and all the Irish players well on the tour. As many posters have pointed out most quotes that are printed in the written media should be taken with a large pinch of salt. Most are paraphrased and from what friends in the game have told me, usually completely made up by a media relations manger. Thus, I think to suggest that anyone quoted in the written media as a liar is perhaps a little harsh.

Both D'Arcy and Cotton deserve a lot of respect for their work with different charities, whatever else you think of them. However, Woodward is still a clown.