Summer tour to Argentina

[ichabodscrane]

Heaslip was top carrier in the pack tonight in terms of carries and distance, I'd say he was near enough to top tackler, took a sh!t load of lineouts, clean breaks, beat defenders, I'd say only Ruddock surpassed him in MAC.

Which begs the question, what unseen work? Or did you just not want to see it?

What I was watching was a senior 8 outshone by his junior partner playing at six, I think he can be better, he's still the best 8 by a mile in Ireland, I just feel and felt he can do more. I dunno what match you were watching but I felt he had a quiet enough game, standard Heaslip, solid.

Your feelings are irrelevant. Heaslip carried more often, for greater distance, beating more defenders whilst taking more lineout balls and making the same number of tackles. What you were watching is what you wanted to see in an attempt to back up an unsupportable argument absent of empirical evidence.

Ha ha , you've been Dave'd..

[offshorerules]

I'm not expecting a big improvement from the team but then I don't think a 'big' improvement is needed, just a little one in some key areas.

You were correct, they were considerably worse.

There was certainly no improvement. But there were positives I suppose, ruddock being one and a win the other. Hard to find many more. Having said that though there weren't a whole heap of negatives either other than it was kind of hard to watch.

[Donny B.]

I'm not expecting a big improvement from the team but then I don't think a 'big' improvement is needed, just a little one in some key areas.

You were correct, they were considerably worse.

There was certainly no improvement. But there were positives I suppose, ruddock being one and a win the other. Hard to find many more. Having said that though there weren't a whole heap of negatives either other than it was kind of hard to watch.

Zebo was another positive for me. Best all round game for Ireland IMO, made some big tackles, chased the ball well and was a constant threat in attack. Let's hope he keeps his fitness up over the summer and comes back even hungrier.
Madigan's match-winning try will hopefully stand to him to in terms of confidence. Ruddock made a couple of mistakes but showed a real physicality in close contact that POM and Diack can't match. Heaslip made two high profile errors but carried well otherwise while Chris Henry didn't have a tour to remember in either game. Overall the breakdown work was pretty sloppy from all concerned.

Toner has his quietest game of the season but I'm reading now he got concussed in the first half, so that may explain it.
The centre pairing were very poor. Cave can offer something at 13 but not 12 and it's the wing or nothing for Ferg as he just dies with the ball every time in contact and also looked uncertain defensively.

Dave Kilcoyne had a decent game but it was noticeable how much stronger our scrum was when Jack McGrath came on. Eoin Reddan had a fine game but some of Sexton's decision making was poor. After the early yellow Trimble recovered well and would have had the try of the season but for a superb tap tackle from Tuculet. Rob Kearney was excellent and we should have earned more points off his excellent running.

So, some positive and happy to win what was a much tougher series than expected, but another frustrating test considering how much we dominated possession and territory.

[offshorerules]

Regarding the centres I remember the feeling that Darcy playing at 12 really helped earls a couple of seasons ago and I think whoever steps in at 13 next year would really benefit from him being there.

[outcast eddie]

Ah lads c'mon, we could have this pro/anti Heaslip debate for the remainder of his contract. He is what he is, he made one mistake this week, HEASLIPPED has already got some of us going like busy bodies in a Saturday market due to getting unceremoniously dumped on his back last week. It's been a long two seasons for Jamie with The Lions and Leinster, so,

Let's focus on the positives

1) Ruddock rampaging like a tank, the likes that have not been seen by the Argentines since the Falklands war..

2) Jordi getting time at 7

3) Ried making his debut, gives him confidence for next year.

4) Mads getting a try

5) not getting beaten, and as Dave alluded to, not having to go back to Argentina for a long time.[/quote]


There were no tanks, rampaging or otherwise, in the Falklands war.

[offshorerules]

Ah lads c'mon, we could have this pro/anti Heaslip debate for the remainder of his contract. He is what he is, he made one mistake this week, HEASLIPPED has already got some of us going like busy bodies in a Saturday market due to getting unceremoniously dumped on his back last week. It's been a long two seasons for Jamie with The Lions and Leinster, so,

Let's focus on the positives

1) Ruddock rampaging like a tank, the likes that have not been seen by the Argentines since the Falklands war..

2) Jordi getting time at 7

3) Ried making his debut, gives him confidence for next year.

4) Mads getting a try

5) not getting beaten, and as Dave alluded to, not having to go back to Argentina for a long time.

There were no tanks, rampaging or otherwise, in the Falklands war.[/quote]
Apart from the scorpion scimitar and Samson tanks of course. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_gr ... klands_War

[outcast eddie]

Ah lads c'mon, we could have this pro/anti Heaslip debate for the remainder of his contract. He is what he is, he made one mistake this week, HEASLIPPED has already got some of us going like busy bodies in a Saturday market due to getting unceremoniously dumped on his back last week. It's been a long two seasons for Jamie with The Lions and Leinster, so,

Let's focus on the positives

1) Ruddock rampaging like a tank, the likes that have not been seen by the Argentines since the Falklands war..

2) Jordi getting time at 7

3) Ried making his debut, gives him confidence for next year.

4) Mads getting a try

5) not getting beaten, and as Dave alluded to, not having to go back to Argentina for a long time.

There were no tanks, rampaging or otherwise, in the Falklands war.

Apart from the scorpion scimitar and Samson tanks of course. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_gr ... klands_War[/quote]

None of which are tanks of course.

[ichabodscrane]

Ah lads c'mon, we could have this pro/anti Heaslip debate for the remainder of his contract. He is what he is, he made one mistake this week, HEASLIPPED has already got some of us going like busy bodies in a Saturday market due to getting unceremoniously dumped on his back last week. It's been a long two seasons for Jamie with The Lions and Leinster, so,

Let's focus on the positives

1) Ruddock rampaging like a tank, the likes that have not been seen by the Argentines since the Falklands war..

2) Jordi getting time at 7

3) Ried making his debut, gives him confidence for next year.

4) Mads getting a try

5) not getting beaten, and as Dave alluded to, not having to go back to Argentina for a long time.

There were no tanks, rampaging or otherwise, in the Falklands war.

Apart from the scorpion scimitar and Samson tanks of course. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_gr ... klands_War[/quote]

Ah jeez lads, I was only trying to sound funny both are tracked vehicles so one could argue that what ever their primary role they are still 'light tanks'.

Anyway you ruined my buzz

[ronk]

You made a joke in bad taste about the Falklands, that makes you George Hook.

They were gentle.

[ichabodscrane]

You made a joke in bad taste about the Falklands, that makes you George Hook.

They were gentle.

Alright fair enough. I didn't think fellow posters would take it seriously. I apologise.

[jezzer]

Zebo was another positive for me. Best all round game for Ireland IMO, made some big tackles, chased the ball well and was a constant threat in attack. Let's hope he keeps his fitness up over the summer and comes back even hungrier.
Madigan's match-winning try will hopefully stand to him to in terms of confidence. Ruddock made a couple of mistakes but showed a real physicality in close contact that POM and Diack can't match. Heaslip made two high profile errors but carried well otherwise while Chris Henry didn't have a tour to remember in either game. Overall the breakdown work was pretty sloppy from all concerned.

Toner has his quietest game of the season but I'm reading now he got concussed in the first half, so that may explain it.
The centre pairing were very poor. Cave can offer something at 13 but not 12 and it's the wing or nothing for Ferg as he just dies with the ball every time in contact and also looked uncertain defensively.

Dave Kilcoyne had a decent game but it was noticeable how much stronger our scrum was when Jack McGrath came on. Eoin Reddan had a fine game but some of Sexton's decision making was poor. After the early yellow Trimble recovered well and would have had the try of the season but for a superb tap tackle from Tuculet. Rob Kearney was excellent and we should have earned more points off his excellent running.

So, some positive and happy to win what was a much tougher series than expected, but another frustrating test considering how much we dominated possession and territory.

Agree with every word. Saved me the bother of a lot of typing, Don. Cheers!

[offshorerules]

You made a joke in bad taste about the Falklands, that makes you George Hook.

They were gentle.

Alright fair enough. I didn't think fellow posters would take it seriously. I apologise.

I was thinking Paul Wallace on Sky myself.

[domhnallj]

You made a joke in bad taste about the Falklands, that makes you George Hook.

They were gentle.

Alright fair enough. I didn't think fellow posters would take it seriously. I apologise.

I was thinking Paul Wallace on Sky myself.

Ditto (although his was far worse)

[Logorrhea]

I think the Heaslip arguments are pretty stupid, especially after a non-performance by the whole team, but its worth noting that Heaslip will nearly always carry more as he takes it up from the back of the scrum (a solid scrum these last two outings), unopposed for the first few yards, and nearly always gets a fend on the scrumhalf. Its like calling Kearney the best carrier in the backs when all he does is run back deep kicks unopposed. Statistically hes run 3 times further than other backs but 95% of it was behind the gainline and before a tackle was made.

I thought Heaslip had a pretty good game to be honest. The pack in general did their job well, and Ruddock carried like an absolute beast. They were just let down by the shambles outside them.

[JB1973]

good win in a tough place to go, Ireland can be happy with their 2014 of test rugby.

A back row of Ruddock sob and heaslip should be something for you guys to look forward to next year

[Peg Leg]

good win in a tough place to go, Ireland can be happy with their 2014 of test rugby.

A back row of Ruddock sob and heaslip should be something for you guys to look forward to next year

Not enough Pashun

[ronk]

Given the way that SOB and POM get knocked about. It would seem that sensible policy would be to rotate through Ruddock/POM, Heaslip and Henry/SOB as Ireland's back row with Murphy and Henderson providing support.

[offshorerules]

good win in a tough place to go, Ireland can be happy with their 2014 of test rugby.

A back row of Ruddock sob and heaslip should be something for you guys to look forward to next year

Got the distinct impression that Joe Schmidt wasn't happy.

[Logorrhea]

Got the distinct impression that Joe Schmidt wasn't happy.

Yep. Still nothing wrong with setting higher standards.

[cormac]

good win in a tough place to go, Ireland can be happy with their 2014 of test rugby.

A back row of Ruddock sob and heaslip should be something for you guys to look forward to next year

Got the distinct impression that Joe Schmidt wasn't happy.

...and he shouldn't have been happy, we were very sloppy at times during the two tests.