Heaslipped wrote:
I found this quite whingey to be honest:
“Munster didn’t do anything extravagant whatsoever. Their first two tries were pick and gos, you see that in the AIL. I’m not taking away from them, but that’s all they did. It wasn’t an extravagant move, it wasn’t something really clever."
He sounds like a child, not like a captain.
Is he lying? Munster didn't do anything extravagant, it's was as simple as gameplan as you'd see in the modern game. In the last few years Leinster have stopped this thing at the source and Munster had nowhere else to go. This time Leinster were so passive in the breakdown and so weak in their fringe defence, that it worked for Munster but you're dreaming if you think this type of Kidney-ball will win you any silverware.
Again though you'll look for any stick to beat him with such is your obsession with him.
I'm not going to get into the whole Heaslip discussion, as it is likely to result in a provincial tit for tat, as is evident in previous posts.
Purely in relation to your comment in relation to silverware, i do think it is possible to win silverware playing like munster did. Ireland won a 6 nations only a few months ago playing the exact same simple rugby.
Now I do not believe munster have the team to win any silverware, well possibly a league, but not a European cup no matter what tactics are used.
Just because a post upsets you, that doesn’t mean that it is wrong. People have different views in all aspects of life, this is a key ingredient to an interesting conversation.
fourthirtythree wrote:I do enjoy how everyone seems to have forgotten the reaction of the entire Munster camp to last years loss in Lansdowne Rd: it was the ref's fault.
Yes and they were correct, he was quite simply ridicilous on the day, his best ever game for Leinster by some distance
munster#1 wrote:
Purely in relation to your comment in relation to silverware, i do think it is possible to win silverware playing like munster did. Ireland won a 6 nations only a few months ago playing the exact same simple rugby.
Haven't the time to go into all the ways you're wrong, but no they didn't.
Heaslipped wrote:
I found this quite whingey to be honest:
“Munster didn’t do anything extravagant whatsoever. Their first two tries were pick and gos, you see that in the AIL. I’m not taking away from them, but that’s all they did. It wasn’t an extravagant move, it wasn’t something really clever."
He sounds like a child, not like a captain.
Is he lying? Munster didn't do anything extravagant, it's was as simple as gameplan as you'd see in the modern game. In the last few years Leinster have stopped this thing at the source and Munster had nowhere else to go. This time Leinster were so passive in the breakdown and so weak in their fringe defence, that it worked for Munster but you're dreaming if you think this type of Kidney-ball will win you any silverware.
Again though you'll look for any stick to beat him with such is your obsession with him.
To be fair to Deccie, 'Kidney-ball' did win two Heineken Cups and a Grand Slam. If it was so simple a game-plan then how did they score two well-worked tries against us, and why did we not stop them? This Munster game-plan is subtly different from what McGahan and Penney coached. The attack is narrower, but Leinster stupidly spread out across the field. Were they expecting the wide-wide Penney game, or something? Look at Hurley's offloads and Cronin's good line. They were more intelligent than anything we came up with. It's not as if we're playing magicly or anything. Kicking the ball away vs 13 men? We're the ones who aren't up to standard
He who fights, and runs away... ...can run away another day
Heaslipped wrote:
I found this quite whingey to be honest:
“Munster didn’t do anything extravagant whatsoever. Their first two tries were pick and gos, you see that in the AIL. I’m not taking away from them, but that’s all they did. It wasn’t an extravagant move, it wasn’t something really clever."
He sounds like a child, not like a captain.
Is he lying? Munster didn't do anything extravagant, it's was as simple as gameplan as you'd see in the modern game. In the last few years Leinster have stopped this thing at the source and Munster had nowhere else to go. This time Leinster were so passive in the breakdown and so weak in their fringe defence, that it worked for Munster but you're dreaming if you think this type of Kidney-ball will win you any silverware.
Again though you'll look for any stick to beat him with such is your obsession with him.
To be fair to Deccie, 'Kidney-ball' did win two Heineken Cups and a Grand Slam. If it was so simple a game-plan then how did they score two well-worked tries against us, and why did we not stop them? This Munster game-plan is subtly different from what McGahan and Penney coached. The attack is narrower, but Leinster stupidly spread out across the field. Were they expecting the wide-wide Penney game, or something? Look at Hurley's offloads and Cronin's good line. They were more intelligent than anything we came up with. It's not as if we're playing magicly or anything. Kicking the ball away vs 13 men? We're the ones who aren't up to standard
It did but once the laws of the game changed where you couldn't just seal the ball off through endless phases, it became redundant as both Munster's and Ireland's subsequent form showed.
They scored two tries off us because 1, the ref was letting them go off their feet at every single ruck and 2, Leinster's fringe defence and breakdown work was pathetically weak, giving up soft yards on every single carry. For whatever reason, the Leinster pack simply weren't up for the battle on the day and they were bullied.
I agree that we were terrible, utterly clueless with the ball in hand as we often are with MOC's gameplan of "truck it up the middle/kick it to the wings". Munster executed their simple gameplan well and were deserved winners, I just can't see it working as easily against better teams than the shower we were that night.
Donny B, you are suggesting that Munster are incapable of playing any different style to what smashed Leinster in the Aviva. We're a month into the season under a new coaching ticket. Munster were tactically spot on in exploiting Leinster's weak underbelly around the fringe of the rucks, so why would they try and play expansively? I'm sure Foley is not planning on playing up the jumper for every single game. That would be retarded. It worked against Leinster; not every team will be so easy to bully at the breakdown.
Heaslipped wrote:Donny B, you are suggesting that Munster are incapable of playing any different style to what smashed Leinster in the Aviva. We're a month into the season under a new coaching ticket. Munster were tactically spot on in exploiting Leinster's weak underbelly around the fringe of the rucks, so why would they try and play expansively? I'm sure Foley is not planning on playing up the jumper for every single game. That would be retarded. It worked against Leinster; not every team will be so easy to bully at the breakdown.
Probably more so the fact that it's a style most suited to the Munster squad and that we played into your hands. Ie. We were cr@p, ergo Munster better than cr@p. Being better than cr@p won't cut it against good.
Heaslipped wrote:Donny B, you are suggesting that Munster are incapable of playing any different style to what smashed Leinster in the Aviva. We're a month into the season under a new coaching ticket. Munster were tactically spot on in exploiting Leinster's weak underbelly around the fringe of the rucks, so why would they try and play expansively? I'm sure Foley is not planning on playing up the jumper for every single game. That would be retarded. It worked against Leinster; not every team will be so easy to bully at the breakdown.
Probably more so the fact that it's a style most suited to the Munster squad and that we played into your hands. Ie. We were cr@p, ergo Munster better than cr@p. Being better than cr@p won't cut it against good.
Cheers Mystic Peg. You really dealt with what I said comprehensively.
Heaslipped wrote:Donny B, you are suggesting that Munster are incapable of playing any different style to what smashed Leinster in the Aviva. We're a month into the season under a new coaching ticket. Munster were tactically spot on in exploiting Leinster's weak underbelly around the fringe of the rucks, so why would they try and play expansively? I'm sure Foley is not planning on playing up the jumper for every single game. That would be retarded. It worked against Leinster; not every team will be so easy to bully at the breakdown.
Perhaps they are capable of a more expansive style, but we've yet to see evidence of it so far this season. But to put the original point to bed, you admit they played a rudimentary "up the jumper" style which is no more extravagant than what you'd see in the AIL. Which was Jamie's original point that you considered a "whinge", even though you basically agree with it.
Ruddock's tackle stats consistently too low for me to be taken seriously as a Six Nations blindside..... Ruddock's defensive stats don't stack up. - All Blacks Nil, Jan 15th, 2014
England A 8 - 14 Ireland A, 25th Jan 2014 Ruddock(c) 19/2 Tackles
Heaslipped wrote:Donny B, you are suggesting that Munster are incapable of playing any different style to what smashed Leinster in the Aviva. We're a month into the season under a new coaching ticket. Munster were tactically spot on in exploiting Leinster's weak underbelly around the fringe of the rucks, so why would they try and play expansively? I'm sure Foley is not planning on playing up the jumper for every single game. That would be retarded. It worked against Leinster; not every team will be so easy to bully at the breakdown.
Perhaps they are capable of a more expansive style, but we've yet to see evidence of it so far this season. But to put the original point to bed, you admit they played a rudimentary "up the jumper" style which is no more extravagant than what you'd see in the AIL. Which was Jamie's original point that you considered a "whinge", even though you basically agree with it.
My point is that he is whinging and trying to talk down what Munster did by comparing it to the standard you see in the AIL. I would love to see an AIL team try and play with the accuracy, strength and co-ordination that Munster demonstrated. As if what Munster did was that easy. Jamie having a little whinge because it's not extravagant or expansive and most importantly, Leinstertaining. He should stop whinging and gesticulating like he is in that photo and actually join the maul or ruck and be of some use to his team. It will be a long, sorry, short season for Leinster with him as captian.
Heaslipped wrote:
My point is that he is whinging and trying to talk down what Munster did by comparing it to the standard you see in the AIL. I would love to see an AIL team try and play with the accuracy, strength and co-ordination that Munster demonstrated. As if what Munster did was that easy. Jamie having a little whinge because it's not extravagant or expansive and most importantly, Leinstertaining. He should stop whinging and gesticulating like he is in that photo and actually join the maul or ruck and be of some use to his team. It will be a long, sorry, short season for Leinster with him as captian.
And you're taking his comments out of context (he never said it was AIL standard, now did he?) to have your own little whinge about a player you're obviously obsessed with and will never, ever see a good side to, even if he cured cancer tomorrow.
