Italy V Ireland (Rome 6Nations 2015)

[TerenureJim]

New thread to start over on team selection, weather, where you're sitting if travelling and tactics etc. etc.

[jezzer]

Yeah.

OK, so now what?

[Armchair]

Hering Heaslip is definetly out so who starts at 8 if this is the case? What backrow would you have without Heaslip at 8. I would love to see a 6,7,8 of O'Mahony, Jordi Murphy & Sean O'Brien at 8 but O'Brien might not be risked as a starter. honourable mention for Ruddock but this game probably comes to early for him?

[johng]

Radio this morning said POM at 8 and SOB at 6

[jezzer]

I'd start Moore over Ross. I'd lean towards TOD over Murphy or SOB - I personally would keep Seanie in a fair degree of cotton wool for the RWC and if it means he gets limited hit-outs in the 6N, so be it. If we head over to England minus SOB and Heaslip (plus whatever inevitable injuries we get in the pack during the 6N) things are really not starting well.

At the moment the team rucking opponents off the ball best is Munster and you need that playing the Italian back row. You want to blow them out of it. Even though he's not the biggest guy, I fancy TOD to be more effective there and to be better at beating Zanni to the ball than the other options. I don't think Joe will go this way, but it's what I'd do. Interesting to see what mark Simon Easterby makes on the shape of the pack.

10-11-12-13 is a bit of a lottery, depending on injuries and tactics. I'd play 10. Keatley 11. Zebo 12. Henshaw 13. Payne. It's far from ideal, but it's what I'd want going away to Rome in the opener against a side you don't want to make errors against and hand over momentum. You just want to be smart and solid and let your better technique/prep/gameplan be the difference.

I'd prefer Earls on the bench, I think, to Fitz or Gilroy, but I'd be very happy with Fitz. Given the positional flexibility of Payne, Henshaw, Zebo, Madigan it's a luxury we can afford to pick Earls and see if he can build off the good work since he came back. Fitz missing the Wolfhounds game is hard to ignore.

15. Kearney 14. Bowe 13. Payne 12. Henshaw 11. Zebo 10. Keatley 9. Murray (if fit) 1. McGrath 2. Best 3. Moore 4. Toner 5. POC 6. POM 7. TOD 8. Heaslip (if fit)

16. Cronin
17. Cronin
18. Ross
19. Henderson
20. SOB/Murphy
21. Marmion
22. Madigan
23. Earls

With that bench, you have a lot of flexibility to go for Plan B.

OK - if Heaslip is out then POM at 8, Henderson at 6, TOD at 7 with McCarthy & SOB/Murph on bench. Hmmmm, not sure about that....

[Xanthippe]

If Heaslip is missing it will only be the second time (since his 6 Nations debut against Italy in 2008) that he'll have missed a 6 Nations match

[paddyor]

If Heaslip is missing it will only be the second time (since his 6 Nations debut against Italy in 2008) that he'll have missed a 6 Nations match

Mocker gods not pleased about the "wolverine blood" comments.

[Golf Man]

I'd start Moore over Ross. I'd lean towards TOD over Murphy or SOB - I personally would keep Seanie in a fair degree of cotton wool for the RWC and if it means he gets limited hit-outs in the 6N, so be it. If we head over to England minus SOB and Heaslip (plus whatever inevitable injuries we get in the pack during the 6N) things are really not starting well.

At the moment the team rucking opponents off the ball best is Munster and you need that playing the Italian back row. You want to blow them out of it. Even though he's not the biggest guy, I fancy TOD to be more effective there and to be better at beating Zanni to the ball than the other options. I don't think Joe will go this way, but it's what I'd do. Interesting to see what mark Simon Easterby makes on the shape of the pack.

10-11-12-13 is a bit of a lottery, depending on injuries and tactics. I'd play 10. Keatley 11. Zebo 12. Henshaw 13. Payne. It's far from ideal, but it's what I'd want going away to Rome in the opener against a side you don't want to make errors against and hand over momentum. You just want to be smart and solid and let your better technique/prep/gameplan be the difference.

I'd prefer Earls on the bench, I think, to Fitz or Gilroy, but I'd be very happy with Fitz. Given the positional flexibility of Payne, Henshaw, Zebo, Madigan it's a luxury we can afford to pick Earls and see if he can build off the good work since he came back. Fitz missing the Wolfhounds game is hard to ignore.

15. Kearney 14. Bowe 13. Payne 12. Henshaw 11. Zebo 10. Keatley 9. Murray (if fit) 1. McGrath 2. Best 3. Moore 4. Toner 5. POC 6. POM 7. TOD 8. Heaslip (if fit)

16. Cronin
17. Cronin
18. Ross
19. Henderson
20. SOB/Murphy
21. Marmion
22. Madigan
23. Earls

With that bench, you have a lot of flexibility to go for Plan B.

OK - if Heaslip is out then POM at 8, Henderson at 6, TOD at 7 with McCarthy & SOB/Murph on bench. Hmmmm, not sure about that....

I would still probably back Madigan to start - he is falling into that too versatile trap (Fitz/Earls trap) which is ultimately going to work against him. If we see him as the bench 10, which pretty much everyone does, then we need to back him to start at 10 when Sexton isn't available

Agree with you on TOD - there really isn't that much difference in size between Murphy and himself btw. Murphy seems to have settled at 7 which is good to see - obviously though with SOB there its going to be an issue for him in the next couple of years. I think TOD is better than Murphy now - Murphy has more potential though (although I think he will get squeezed out a bit at Leinster in the next couple of years)

Completely agree that SOB shouldn't rush back in no matter who is fit - plan for 20/25 minutes of mayhem from the bench no matter the selection

Also agree that POM is most likely to go to 8 if Heaslip is out - has become a mainstay ion the team and a real leader - also will have a good understanding with Murray which helps. The ct that Conan was dropped from the large squad points towards this as well. I'd be inclined to go with Henderson if Heaslip and SOB both don't start. I thought McCarthy was out - not sure if he recovered from concussion last week - Diack actually could become a bench option - as he could cover lock as well

I'd like to see Marmion but it will almost certainly be REddan (although having 2 scrum halves just back from injury isn't great). I'd go Fitz over Earls on the bench by dint of greater playing time

[simonokeeffe]

I dont recognise this thread

[nc6000]

I'll be there in the Tribuna Tevere Parterre. Looking forward to the weekend as I've never been to Rome before.

[simonokeeffe]

Ok I read how the old one ended up

Murray Kinsella naming/leaking team (prediction) Thornley style today

Zebo, Payne, Keatley, Ross and Murphy starting, Murphy 7 if Heaslip fit, 8 if hes not and SOB at 7

cant see Ross lasting past 45 mins

no word on bench, Earls v Fitzgerald only non fitness related selection call left there

[Oldschool]

Radio this morning said POM at 8 and SOB at 6

It was always likely Heaslip was going to miss this one and now probably the France game too.
There are a number of combos, in no particular order.
POM, Ryan, Murphy.
Henderson, Murphy, POM.
POM, TOD, Murphy.

However it could easily be:-
POM, Murphy and Diack (A straight swop is always preferable).

[desperado]

I'd start Moore over Ross. I'd lean towards TOD over Murphy or SOB - I personally would keep Seanie in a fair degree of cotton wool for the RWC and if it means he gets limited hit-outs in the 6N, so be it. If we head over to England minus SOB and Heaslip (plus whatever inevitable injuries we get in the pack during the 6N) things are really not starting well.

At the moment the team rucking opponents off the ball best is Munster and you need that playing the Italian back row. You want to blow them out of it. Even though he's not the biggest guy, I fancy TOD to be more effective there and to be better at beating Zanni to the ball than the other options. I don't think Joe will go this way, but it's what I'd do. Interesting to see what mark Simon Easterby makes on the shape of the pack.

10-11-12-13 is a bit of a lottery, depending on injuries and tactics. I'd play 10. Keatley 11. Zebo 12. Henshaw 13. Payne. It's far from ideal, but it's what I'd want going away to Rome in the opener against a side you don't want to make errors against and hand over momentum. You just want to be smart and solid and let your better technique/prep/gameplan be the difference.

I'd prefer Earls on the bench, I think, to Fitz or Gilroy, but I'd be very happy with Fitz. Given the positional flexibility of Payne, Henshaw, Zebo, Madigan it's a luxury we can afford to pick Earls and see if he can build off the good work since he came back. Fitz missing the Wolfhounds game is hard to ignore.

15. Kearney 14. Bowe 13. Payne 12. Henshaw 11. Zebo 10. Keatley 9. Murray (if fit) 1. McGrath 2. Best 3. Moore 4. Toner 5. POC 6. POM 7. TOD 8. Heaslip (if fit)

16. Cronin
17. Cronin
18. Ross
19. Henderson
20. SOB/Murphy
21. Marmion
22. Madigan
23. Earls

With that bench, you have a lot of flexibility to go for Plan B.

OK - if Heaslip is out then POM at 8, Henderson at 6, TOD at 7 with McCarthy & SOB/Murph on bench. Hmmmm, not sure about that....

I'd agree with most of that and I think you make a pretty good point on the best rucking combination. Where I'd differ is with SOB. I think (but very hard to know at 60k feet) he's ready - probably not for 80mins though in Rome. It looks like Heaslip will be out so I'd go with SOB at 8 and a 6,7, 8 of POM, TOD, SOB. Jordi just hasn't hit last years highs (yet) many due to injury and limited gametime. Keatley starts OH; Madigan just not good enough for the Wolfhounds. The other thing I'm not sure of is whether Madigan/Fitz or Madigan/Earls gives better cover options. Although Earls has looked sharp he doesn't have the same amount of gametime this season as Fitz. Then again; SOB has sweet FA gametime too. Was not impressed by Marmion v the Saxons; surprisingly so. Put it down to an off day as he certainly has a lot to offer.

[johng]

6 POM
7 SOB
8 Jordi

19 Hendy
20 TOD/Ryan. Possibly Ryan cause he can play all 3 spots.

If Joe picks Ryan and Murphy ahead of TOD, I predict that it will be possible to see the Munsterfans forum from space

[Oldschool]

6 POM
7 SOB
8 Jordi

19 Hendy
20 TOD/Ryan. Possibly Ryan cause he can play all 3 spots.

If Joe picks Ryan and Murphy ahead of TOD, I predict that it will be possible to see the Munsterfans forum from space

Are you sure one actually has to reach space before one goes ballistic?

[paddyor]

6 POM
7 SOB
8 Jordi

19 Hendy
20 TOD/Ryan. Possibly Ryan cause he can play all 3 spots.

If Joe picks Ryan and Murphy ahead of TOD, I predict that it will be possible to see the Munsterfans forum from space

Check out Irelands statistically strongest team according to the42.ies fantasyrugger.com preview.....

[JB1973]

when is the last time Ireland played a 6 nations game without BOD Darcy or Heaslip?

Youll win by 10 anyhow, can't see anyway Italy have enough to beat you

[Xanthippe]

when is the last time Ireland played a 6 nations game without BOD Darcy or Heaslip?

Assuming you mean the last time we played with NONE of the three then the answer is February 2005 v Scotland

[TerenureJim]

I dont recognise this thread

Well I guess you could see it as a real/provisional split on our hands with one thread being a bit more centrist and the other more volatile and populated by people with extreme views.

[simonokeeffe]

I dont recognise this thread

Well I guess you could see it as a real/provisional split on our hands with one thread being a bit more centrist and the other more volatile and populated by people with extreme views.

Its the Workers Party of threads

@Paddyor statistics showing only 1 Munster player, careful

IF SOB is back or good enough for 50 mins there is no argument at all for TOD to start