Scrap the Lions?

[Donny B.]

Hey a disasterous Anglo Welsh dominated tour could destabilise our biggest rivals for the 6n

All good, baby, all good. Let them at it.

[simonokeeffe]

Hey a disasterous Anglo Welsh dominated tour could destabilise our biggest rivals for the 6n

All good, baby, all good. Let them at it.

I'd include Vern Cotter as coach but that would just be cruel

[LeRouxIsPHat]

I've heard that Gatland has got it.

[simonokeeffe]

I've heard that Gatland has got it.

Ourselves alone attitude in me says good

Plus Joe leaving would support that and vice versa

[domhnallj]

I've heard that Gatland has got it.

I believe that there's a course of medication available for that sort of thing.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

[Ruckedtobits]

Posted elsewhere a quote from NZ media that Lions Tour will bankroll NZ rugby for foreseeable future. Here's why!

"Ticket prices for Lions Tour games have just been announced by NZ Rugby. Prices will run from NZ$149 to NZ$449 (that's approx €100 - €300)." It is expected that Lions supporters will purchase a minimum of 40% of all tickets.

So not only do the NZ Union depend on Lions Tours sales for their financial security and pick up a highly lucrative TV Rights deal from Sky and Fox TV, they also sell in excwss of 40% of the match day tickets, at inflated prices, to NH supporters. What a scam!

[simonokeeffe]

This is the last tour under existing agreement so theyre milking it for all its worth

[leinsterlover73]

I for one would be deeply disappointed if the Lions were ever scrapped.

+1

Well I for one would be happy to see the Lions scrapped. Players are playing too much rugby already and the itinerary for the NZ tour is absolutely shocking - playing every super rugby team, maoris and NZ barbarians and then three tests - at the end of a long season of internationals, Pro12 and ERCC for the irish, Scots and Welsh and internationals, Prem and ERCC for the English. These tours are simply cash cows for hard-up rugby nations - and NZ for all its success on the field is not in great shape financially.

I'd be perfectly happy to see no Irish players chosen, but sadly that won't happen even if Gatty stacks the team with Welsh and English.

And if I ever hear another Irish player go on about being picked for the Lions as the "ultimate accolade" I''ll tear the remains of my hair out. The ultimate accolade for any Irish players is the green jersey with the shamrock.

+1

[LENSTA]

Hey a disasterous Anglo Welsh dominated tour could destabilise our biggest rivals for the 6n

All good, baby, all good. Let them at it.

The above is only good for us in the short term fellas. One of the issues I have with the Lions is just the above. The 6Ns post Lions is always a very weak tournament, as evidenced by France winning so many Grand Slams after a lions tour when they used to take their national team seriously. A weak championship weakens us all and lowers the standard when we need to raise the standard to complete with the SH.

Ireland could be the NH equivalent of Aus. Wedged btwn two behemoths and exposed to a high class of rugby and consequently being very competitive at RWCs. The Lions plays its part in this low standard in NH rugby.

The main issue for NH rugby though is... that the 2 countries with the biggest population of players and the biggest budgets in world rugby, Eng & Fra, hamstring their national teams by not having a pyramid system controlled by their union, unlike every other country North & South. Rugby is the only sport I know of where countries with the most money and player resources suck the hind tit.

Imagine in football, if Germany & Italy, had one world cup between them and mostly lost to Mexico and Uruguay.

[offshorerules]

Well I for one would be happy to see the Lions scrapped. Players are playing too much rugby already and the itinerary for the NZ tour is absolutely shocking - playing every super rugby team, maoris and NZ barbarians and then three tests - at the end of a long season of internationals, Pro12 and ERCC for the irish, Scots and Welsh and internationals, Prem and ERCC for the English. These tours are simply cash cows for hard-up rugby nations - and NZ for all its success on the field is not in great shape financially.

I'd be perfectly happy to see no Irish players chosen, but sadly that won't happen even if Gatty stacks the team with Welsh and English.

And if I ever hear another Irish player go on about being picked for the Lions as the "ultimate accolade" I''ll tear the remains of my hair out. The ultimate accolade for any Irish players is the green jersey with the shamrock.[/quote]
+1[/quote]
Burn everything British except for the coal? Only the best of the best get to go on lions tours so therefore it is a perfectly reasonable sentiment for a player to have.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Unrelated to the Lions talk but I think we're touring Japan next summer, could be a great tour given that we'll be missing players and they've developed so much over the last few years.

[paddyor]

Burn everything British except for the coal? Only the best of the best and Tom Court and a retired Shane Williams get to go on lions tours so therefore it is a perfectly reasonable sentiment for a player to have.

Fixed

[simonokeeffe]

Burn everything British except for the coal? Only the best of the best and Tom Court and a retired Shane Williams get to go on lions tours so therefore it is a perfectly reasonable sentiment for a player to have.

Fixed

Dont forget Ollie Smith, Andy Titteral, Andy Powell, Daffyd James. There is some list even limited to pro era.

Unrelated to the Lions talk but I think we're touring Japan next summer, could be a great tour given that we'll be missing players and they've developed so much over the last few years.

Be good for finding out who can actually play a bit of second string

[Dave Cahill]

Daffyd James.

Daffyd James was the first player to score a quarter of a century of european tries. He did this whilst playing most of his career for welsh teams. He is still in the top five all time try scorers in the european cup. He was the most lethal broken field runner and elegant finisher of his generation - it is patently ridiculous to name him alongside the likes of Titterall

[simonokeeffe]

Daffyd James.

Daffyd James was the first player to score a quarter of a century of european tries. He did this whilst playing most of his career for welsh teams. He is still in the top five all time try scorers in the european cup. He was the most lethal broken field runner and elegant finisher of his generation - it is patently ridiculous to name him alongside the likes of Titterall

He played for Scarlets when they were good and got to Euro semi finals. Cohen shouldve started ahead of him and Hickie shouldve toured. Was picked on nationality like the unused Martin Williams on the bench.

Jason Robinson was the best runner and finisher of his generation

[Dave Cahill]

He played for Scarlets when they were good and got to Euro semi finals. Cohen shouldve started ahead of him and Hickie shouldve toured. Was picked on nationality like the unused Martin Williams on the bench.

Jason Robinson was the best runner and finisher of his generation

I think perhaps you should refrain from posting about the Welsh. Series winning three time Lions test starting dual code international Dai Young was a 'midweek lions tourist', European record try scorer was 'picked on nationality' and now Martin (sic) Williams!

[simonokeeffe]

He played for Scarlets when they were good and got to Euro semi finals. Cohen shouldve started ahead of him and Hickie shouldve toured. Was picked on nationality like the unused Martin Williams on the bench.

Jason Robinson was the best runner and finisher of his generation

I think perhaps you should refrain from posting about the Welsh. Series winning three time Lions test starting dual code international Dai Young was a 'midweek lions tourist', European record try scorer was 'picked on nationality' and now Martin (sic) Williams!

MartYn Williams aside from being overrated and demolished by every world class 7 he ever faced (McCaw, Smith, Gleeson, I could go on) was a largely unused sub in those tests IIRC and at the expense of a specialist lock (Malcolm O'Kelly)

D James was not better than Cohen or Hickie

Dai Young when he's not winning the hearts of our young props got 3 caps out of 3 tours

[simonokeeffe]

how did I forget Brent Cockbain from list of Lions scrubbers? And Lee Mears

[Dave Cahill]

MartYn Williams aside from being overrated and demolished by every world class 7 he ever faced (McCaw, Smith, Gleeson, I could go on) was a largely unused sub in those tests IIRC and at the expense of a specialist lock (Malcolm O'Kelly)

D James was not better than Cohen or Hickie

Dai Young when he's not winning the hearts of our young props got 3 caps out of 3 tours

Three Lions tours - One to each of the big three, two of them victorious, making 18 appearances for the Lions, including those three caps. Over the course of three decades - amateur and professional whilst fitting in a Rugby League career during which time he was the worlds most expensive player - it made for a funny joke, it was just bad luck that you unwittingly picked one of the greatest props in the history of the game, certainly the post war history mistakenly thinking he was a 'midweek tourist'

Its also wrong to assume that someone who doesn't win a cap during the tests hasn't made a telling contribution to the tour. Donal Lenihan (who was responsible for Hickie not being selected for the '01 tour, not Daffyd James or anyone else) never played in a test on tour but is regarded as one of the great Lions captains. The contribution of Young and Bentley to the '97 tour is widely recognised for being far more than their accumulated pitch time in tests.

Martyn Williams may well have been overrated (he wasn't IMO) but he was overrated by two world cup winning coaches, the lions greatest coach and the most successful coach in the six nations. Thats quite a provenance.

[Dave Cahill]

how did I forget Brent Cockbain from list of Lions scrubbers? And Lee Mears

Its also easy to put a name like Cockbain out there, but was he selected in the original squad? Nope, he wasn't even first rep, that was Shaw, he was basically the last man available after Grewcock was banned

Would he even have been called up if Dallaglio wasn't also injured?

Edit: Grewcock, Kay, POC, DOC and MOK were the selected locks, with Shaw first rep.