France V Ireland 6Ns 2016

[fourthirtythree]

That is pretty disappointing. It's also got to be dispiriting for Dave Kearney to know that he can expect no protection from foul play.

[WarPoodle]

What that game missed was a bit of argy bargy. Once France realised they weren't getting pinged for late hits / shoulder barges and high tackles they started throwing them in at will.

Needed a Peter O'Mahony to stand up, grab a collar and generally get in the face of any of the French culprits. Donnacha O'Callaghan, BOD and even ROG were great at it too.

We played as if we were neutered. Very little passion and no one seemingly willing to back up each other or protect each other. Remember Rob Kearney getting close-lined against Italy a few years back after only about 1 minute of play? That nearly kicked off a massive brawl. Kearney Jnr. was at the end of of something just as bad against France and no one stood up.

[simonokeeffe]

we start retaliating then theres even more commotion and our players get banned too

how on the pitch would they know the citing officer was asllep at the wheel?

[All Blacks nil]

we start retaliating then theres even more commotion and our players get banned too

how on the pitch would they know the citing officer was asllep at the wheel?

See warpoodles example above and tell me how many were cited and/or suspended or even penAlised. While people are rightly criticising the match official for not protecting Kearney, I feel that the his teammates were also culpable in not having their teammates back.
I will wager that this issue will be addressed in camp and if such an in ident were to occur next time out the team will react in a more active manner.
You can have tactical and inspirational leadership but the leadership team and others within the team let Kearney down. Ye Frebch hooker should have been brought to task by kearney's teammates there and then.

[fourthirtythree]

Play had moved on and was continuing. Are they supposed to keep their anger boiling until the next break in play and then grab the opposition and start screaming at them?

[simonokeeffe]

we start retaliating then theres even more commotion and our players get banned too

how on the pitch would they know the citing officer was asllep at the wheel?

See warpoodles example above and tell me how many were cited and/or suspended or even penAlised. While people are rightly criticising the match official for not protecting Kearney, I feel that the his teammates were also culpable in not having their teammates back.
I will wager that this issue will be addressed in camp and if such an in ident were to occur next time out the team will react in a more active manner.
You can have tactical and inspirational leadership but the leadership team and others within the team let Kearney down. Ye Frebch hooker should have been brought to task by kearney's teammates there and then.

but guys on the pitch arent going to know this

what happens then if 2 French players and 2 Irish players had been cited and we go to Twickenham without McGrath and Stander say?

[All Blacks nil]

Fighting talk Simon!!!!
Front up or lay down.
We lay down
As I said I wager it won't happen again.

[simonokeeffe]

Fighting talk Simon!!!!
Front up or lay down.
We lay down
As I said I wager it won't happen again.

well if we're not going to start melees with all these Munster boys in the team then when are we?

we're low on dirty players though, dont have any Etzebeths, B Davies, Maestris, Burgers

[WarPoodle]

but guys on the pitch arent going to know this

what happens then if 2 French players and 2 Irish players had been cited and we go to Twickenham without McGrath and Stander say?

I'm not talking about headbutts and punches. I'm talking about a *reaction*.. A reaction such as a push, or a grapple or a grab of a collar of a jersey. I've yet (I think), to see anybody cited for anything like that. This probably sounds yobbish, but we just lay down and got walked on. Bullied physically off the park and no one stood up to it. There was no passion.

By the end of the match I was hoping that someone in the Irish crowd would go for a French player with a Cuisine de France baguette. It seemed more likely at that point that any of the Irish players standing up...

[Dave Cahill]

I remember many moons ago in a different sport, it was felt that schools from Cork were getting better treatment from officials than schools from Dublin and Belfast. The captains of the the (then) three big schools in Dublin met over a few milky coffees in the Pierrot Club and decided that in the forthcoming national competition, in which all three were drawn against schools from Cork, that their players would (and this is the phrase used) "go full Kelvin Troy" to lay down a marker. That year the competiton was nicknamed the Black and Blue Giant. Ho, ho, ho.

[simonokeeffe]

but guys on the pitch arent going to know this

what happens then if 2 French players and 2 Irish players had been cited and we go to Twickenham without McGrath and Stander say?

I'm not talking about headbutts and punches. I'm talking about a *reaction*.. A reaction such as a push, or a grapple or a grab of a collar of a jersey. I've yet (I think), to see anybody cited for anything like that. This probably sounds yobbish, but we just lay down and got walked on. Bullied physically off the park and no one stood up to it. There was no passion.

By the end of the match I was hoping that someone in the Irish crowd would go for a French player with a Cuisine de France baguette. It seemed more likely at that point that any of the Irish players standing up...

I dont see how that is a deterrent, we take out their players off the ball and theyll push and shove us a bit and feel our collars

theres a difference between a visible and an effective reaction

Plus half the team probably didnt even see Maestri's

[All Blacks nil]

Fighting talk Simon!!!!
Front up or lay down.
We lay down
As I said I wager it won't happen again.

well if we're not going to start melees with all these Munster boys in the team then when are we?

we're low on dirty players though, dont have any Etzebeths, B Davies, Maestris, Burgers

Simon
You will notice that I referred to teammates as in Irisih (wearing green) teammates. My criticism is of the Irish team guilty of letting France away with such play.
Unfortunately you have missed the point, ratcheted up your provincial sensitivity and got your blue knickers in a twist.

[Oldschool]

Fighting talk Simon!!!!
Front up or lay down.
We lay down
As I said I wager it won't happen again.

well if we're not going to start melees with all these Munster boys in the team then when are we?

we're low on dirty players though, dont have any Etzebeths, B Davies, Maestris, Burgers

Simon
You will notice that I referred to teammates as in Irisih (wearing green) teammates. My criticism is of the Irish team guilty of letting France away with such play.
Unfortunately you have missed the point, ratcheted up your provincial sensitivity and got your blue knickers in a twist.

The coaching ticket surely addressed the violence at HT.
The view must have been that retaliation would be counter productive.
They would have done their homework on the ref and tmo.
What is a disgrace is there were no? citings subsequently.
That will simply encourage violence and serious injury which is surely the number one concern of right minded people.

[simonokeeffe]

Fighting talk Simon!!!!
Front up or lay down.
We lay down
As I said I wager it won't happen again.

well if we're not going to start melees with all these Munster boys in the team then when are we?

we're low on dirty players though, dont have any Etzebeths, B Davies, Maestris, Burgers

Simon
You will notice that I referred to teammates as in Irisih (wearing green) teammates. My criticism is of the Irish team guilty of letting France away with such play.
Unfortunately you have missed the point, ratcheted up your provincial sensitivity and got your blue knickers in a twist.

I'll try and write obvious jokes in crayon in future just to make them extra obvious

[Twist]

This is pretty good take on the matter, despite being written by Neil Francis

http://m.independent.ie/sport/rugby/six ... 63690.html

[FLIP]

This is pretty good take on the matter, despite being written by Neil Francis

http://m.independent.ie/sport/rugby/six ... 63690.html

All too little too late. There should have been concerted pressure for citings across all the media outlets and by fans. Do you think World Rugby give a toss about one article?

[Raydollard]

I said as much succinctly above and, indeed, before on this site.

Rugby has no future if it continues in the way foul play is dealt with on and off the field. Refs who refuse to take action should not be allowed to ref another match. Appellants should run the likely risk that penalties will be increased.

[Xanthippe]

The coaching ticket surely addressed the violence at HT.
The view must have been that retaliation would be counter productive.
They would have done their homework on the ref and tmo.
What is a disgrace is there were no? citings subsequently.
That will simply encourage violence and serious injury which is surely the number one concern of right minded people.

Dev commented on it in an interview after the match

Toner admitted Ireland were well aware of the rough-house tactics, but insisted there is no place for retaliation in the modern era.
"The temptation's always there but we do pride ourselves on our discipline and we pride ourselves on being able to rise above it," said Toner.
"The referees know us as a disciplined team. We're not that sort of team."

http://m.independent.ie/sport/rugby/six ... 55297.html

[Fireworks]

we start retaliating then theres even more commotion and our players get banned too

how on the pitch would they know the citing officer was asllep at the wheel?

There is a need to stand up to them without going over the line and retaliating. I do not think that enough was done on the pitch but it was difficult in the DK situation as play was continuing.

From Irelands 6n point of view citing is irrelevant. We want the french to be at full strength against the other teams so action after the event does not help. What is really needed is support for the TMO and the power to give a retrospective card. For example if the game had continued and one of the TMO's assistants had brought the DK tackle to his attention then he could havd minutes later notified the ref about it in a break in play and a card could have been given. If it was only a penalty then the time has passed and you get on with it.

There were at least two potential yellow card offences in that game which could have made a significant difference to the result. Dealing with it after the game is important for the game but of no help to us.

[FLIP]

we start retaliating then theres even more commotion and our players get banned too

how on the pitch would they know the citing officer was asllep at the wheel?

There is a need to stand up to them without going over the line and retaliating. I do not think that enough was done on the pitch but it was difficult in the DK situation as play was continuing.

From Irelands 6n point of view citing is irrelevant. We want the french to be at full strength against the other teams so action after the event does not help. What is really needed is support for the TMO and the power to give a retrospective card. For example if the game had continued and one of the TMO's assistants had brought the DK tackle to his attention then he could havd minutes later notified the ref about it in a break in play and a card could have been given. If it was only a penalty then the time has passed and you get on with it.

There were at least two potential yellow card offences in that game which could have made a significant difference to the result. Dealing with it after the game is important for the game but of no help to us.

If no justice is granted to our players on the field, the justice should be granted off the field. I do agree it's no help to us after the match but morally it would have been good to see a citing or two. No justice either way makes World Rugby at best look incompetent, and at worst corrupt.