Ireland v. England

[All Blacks nil]

Another missed opportunity
With the future in mind surely McFadden's selection is a missed opportunity to introduce one of our younger players to the volume of work and detail and small margins and workons and systems and etc that needs to be absorbed in order to contribute effectively in Joe's camp.

[Ruckedtobits]

Can't see how this announcement can do any good whatsoever.

[Xanthippe]

Heaslip puts in one poor performance and suddenly he has to be dropped. He's been excellent for months, how quickly this has been forgotten. I understand that people don't like him much, but seriously. It's worth pointing out that Stander, one run when given plenty of space aside, didn't exactly light up proceedings on Friday night either..

Heaslip didn't actually put in a poor performance, at least not within the context of the general Irish performance. That doesn't suit the developing narrative though.

Thank you Dave - I was really beginning to worry that i needed much stronger glasses. From what I saw Jamie's performance was very much hampered by SOB's lack of performance. It's much harder to look good at your job when you're having to do someone else's job too.

[Oldschool]

Can't see how this announcement can do any good whatsoever.

Well it's got everyone talking about something else other than Heaslip et al
Liked POM's positive take on Ireland's motivation to win.

[Oldschool]

Heaslip puts in one poor performance and suddenly he has to be dropped. He's been excellent for months, how quickly this has been forgotten. I understand that people don't like him much, but seriously. It's worth pointing out that Stander, one run when given plenty of space aside, didn't exactly light up proceedings on Friday night either..

Heaslip didn't actually put in a poor performance, at least not within the context of the general Irish performance. That doesn't suit the developing narrative though.

Thank you Dave - I was really beginning to worry that i needed much stronger glasses. From what I saw Jamie's performance was very much hampered by SOB's lack of performance. It's much harder to look good at your job when you're having to do someone else's job too.

If you start with the basic premise that Heaslip always plays well, you won't go far wrong - It works for me anyway!

[neiliog93]

Yeah, I think the fact that Schmidt's methods demand the players having so much knowledge and understanding disincentivises him to bring in new, young players, especially as injury replacements/with short timeframes.

[munster#1]

The selection of McFadden optimises what is wrong with the current coaching ticket. The conservative nature of everything Ireland are doing right now is what is holding Ireland back.

The worst thing is that we all know that Joe can coach a style of rugby that any rugby fan would relish. The current crop of players is littered with players who are capable of playing a much better brand of rugby than we are currently playing, but we look set to see yet another game of kick chase.

I don't what to see Joe given the boot, but failure to beat England can only be seen as a massive failure if he picks what he believes is the best 23 and Ireland still lose.

[Golf Man]

Not sure if Iosing to England is ever a massive but If he does believe that bowe and mcfadden are in the top 7 wingers atm then you have to question the judgement. I'm not buying the whole experience of systems- sure for the 23 but 5th choice winger for one game???

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[neiliog93]

Not sure if Iosing to England is ever a massive but If he does believe that bowe and mcfadden are in the top 7 wingers atm then you have to question the judgement. I'm not buying the whole experience of systems- sure for the 23 but 5th choice winger for one game???

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It's the only explanation though. McFadden has been injured for much of the season and has only one recent start to his name. Adam Byrne, Conway, Adeleokun etc are younger and in better form, but certainly less familiar with the huge volume of information Schmidt requires players to assimilate in a short space of time. Schmidt is obviously thinking in a worst-case scenario vein, where there is a small chance with more training ground injuries that he might be required to put McFadden directly into the matchday XXIII.

[munster#1]

Not sure if Iosing to England is ever a massive but If he does believe that bowe and mcfadden are in the top 7 wingers atm then you have to question the judgement. I'm not buying the whole experience of systems- sure for the 23 but 5th choice winger for one game???

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It's the only explanation though. McFadden has been injured for much of the season and has only one recent start to his name. Adam Byrne, Conway, Adeleokun etc are younger and in better form, but certainly less familiar with the huge volume of information Schmidt requires players to assimilate in a short space of time. Schmidt is obviously thinking in a worst-case scenario vein, where there is a small chance with more training ground injuries that he might be required to put McFadden directly into the matchday XXIII.

This raises the question, that if your systems are so complicated that you are forced to pick inferior/unfit players such as Bowe and McFadden, are your systems worth while?

Another point I would like to make, is that from watching Ireland over the last few seasons I fail to see what the system is that is so complicated.
In offence, we are very predictable, and rely heavily on the kick chase.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

It's pretty obvious why Ferg was picked, he covers 11-14. People can disagree with it but there's sound logic to it.

[simonokeeffe]

It's pretty obvious why Ferg was picked, he covers 11-14. People can disagree with it but there's sound logic to it.

I think the logic is he knwos the playbook so will fit in in training/hold tackle bags in the right places

[Dave Cahill]

Every coach thats worked with him f%~king loves Ferg - works his arse off, is mindful of the big picture. Even pretty taciturn guys like Kiss and Schmidt have issued paens to him over the years

[neiliog93]

Yes, I agree that perhaps our very complicated systems (which brought success in 2014 and 2015) are a weakness now that strong opponents appear to have worked them out. If new, in-form players simply can't adapt quickly to the system because it's so complicated, it's certainly a weakness and arguably means you need to simplify your whole approach.

[Dave Cahill]

I'm afraid I must insist Joe. You see, my wife, she has been most vocal on the subject of McFadden. "Where's McFadden? "When is he going to pick McFadden" "Why isn't he picking McFadden now?" And so on. So please, McFadden.

[hugonaut]

Every coach thats worked with him f%~king loves Ferg - works his arse off, is mindful of the big picture. Even pretty taciturn guys like Kiss and Schmidt have issued paens to him over the years

Kiss on Ferg post Canada hat-trick in 2012:
"Fergus is just one of those players you want to have around your team. He is such a great character. What he brings to a team in terms of energy and enthusiasm is sensational," he said. "If he doesn't get selected he is still the same person. He has an uncanny ability to score tries at international level. Last week he shipped an injury in the game (against the US) and he toughed his way through it. He trained through a bit of injury this week and got a knock in the game again but just keeps powering on. I can't speak highly enough about him and the way he played."
[source: http://www.irishrugby.ie/rugby/fixtures ... /28467.php ]

With that said, this strikes me as a really strange call up, and Schmidt making a rod for his own back with regards to criticisms of favouritism and conservatism. Ferg has hardly played this season and there are some really talented young guys with loads of form [and pace] playing across the provinces – Adam Byrne, Jacob Stockdale and Darren 'Hurler' Sweetnam.

[paddyor]

The selection of McFadden optimises what is wrong with the current coaching ticket. The conservative nature of everything Ireland are doing right now is what is holding Ireland back.

The worst thing is that we all know that Joe can coach a style of rugby that any rugby fan would relish. The current crop of players is littered with players who are capable of playing a much better brand of rugby than we are currently playing, but we look set to see yet another game of kick chase.

I don't what to see Joe given the boot, but failure to beat England can only be seen as a massive failure if he picks what he believes is the best 23 and Ireland still lose.

Surely its the basic errors that are holding us back? If you cant eliminate them then youve shag all chance of developing a more elaborate style of play.

[munster#1]

The selection of McFadden optimises what is wrong with the current coaching ticket. The conservative nature of everything Ireland are doing right now is what is holding Ireland back.

The worst thing is that we all know that Joe can coach a style of rugby that any rugby fan would relish. The current crop of players is littered with players who are capable of playing a much better brand of rugby than we are currently playing, but we look set to see yet another game of kick chase.

I don't what to see Joe given the boot, but failure to beat England can only be seen as a massive failure if he picks what he believes is the best 23 and Ireland still lose.

Surely its the basic errors that are holding us back? If you cant eliminate them then youve shag all chance of developing a more elaborate style of play.

What you often see with teams that have poor systems in place, is that they fail with the basics, just look at Munster and Leinster last season.

When a team has solid systems in place, the basics tend to look after themselves. Just look at Munster this season, or Leinster under Joe, and again this season.

Confidence is nurtured in a team with solid and effective systems, confidence lends itself to making the basics, basic.

In 2014 and 2015 we didn't see Ireland make these errors, as the team fully believed in their systems, which allowed them to excel with the basics, and result in a remarkably low error count in nearly every game.
Teams have found us out over the last 2 years, and have found ways of forcing errors in our limited offensive system.
They have shut down our game, by shutting down our backrow, and targeting our once solid set piece.
This means that Ireland are panicking, and making poor decisions, such as SOB's pass to nobody, Henshaw joining a maul upfront of the ball, Sexton's attempt at a clearance kick that lead to Wales's last try, or even the poor attempt to set up a rolling maul from the 22.

[paddyor]

Every coach thats worked with him f%~king loves Ferg - works his arse off, is mindful of the big picture. Even pretty taciturn guys like Kiss and Schmidt have issued paens to him over the years

Kiss on Ferg post Canada hat-trick in 2012:
"Fergus is just one of those players you want to have around your team. He is such a great character. What he brings to a team in terms of energy and enthusiasm is sensational," he said. "If he doesn't get selected he is still the same person. He has an uncanny ability to score tries at international level. Last week he shipped an injury in the game (against the US) and he toughed his way through it. He trained through a bit of injury this week and got a knock in the game again but just keeps powering on. I can't speak highly enough about him and the way he played."
[source: http://www.irishrugby.ie/rugby/fixtures ... /28467.php ]

With that said, this strikes me as a really strange call up, and Schmidt making a rod for his own back with regards to criticisms of favouritism and conservatism. Ferg has hardly played this season and there are some really talented young guys with loads of form [and pace] playing across the provinces – Adam Byrne, Jacob Stockdale and Darren 'Hurler' Sweetnam.

Stockdale hasnt been tested yet IMO. Most of his starts are against the bottom 4 of the pro 12 and also a sevwrly weakened Glasgow and Connacht. Other than that he has less than 80 minutes combined in high level games (clermont, exeter &l einster).

Similarly A Byrne played in 3 champions cup romps (twice against 14 men) and has had the benefit of playing behind a fairly rampant pack thats setting the team up for a try scoring record. Not to knock him bit again i dont think hes really been tested. How many teams have probed for a weakness and been competent enough to exploit it? That will change over the next 6 or more games im sure.

Sweetnam is i think tje furthest along but still have questions. Hes already in tbe squad isnt he?

Ripping it up in the international window and against weaker teams is great, but counts for nothing in international selection.

[Oldschool]

Every coach thats worked with him f%~king loves Ferg - works his arse off, is mindful of the big picture. Even pretty taciturn guys like Kiss and Schmidt have issued paens to him over the years

Kiss on Ferg post Canada hat-trick in 2012:
"Fergus is just one of those players you want to have around your team. He is such a great character. What he brings to a team in terms of energy and enthusiasm is sensational," he said. "If he doesn't get selected he is still the same person. He has an uncanny ability to score tries at international level. Last week he shipped an injury in the game (against the US) and he toughed his way through it. He trained through a bit of injury this week and got a knock in the game again but just keeps powering on. I can't speak highly enough about him and the way he played."
[source: http://www.irishrugby.ie/rugby/fixtures ... /28467.php ]

With that said, this strikes me as a really strange call up, and Schmidt making a rod for his own back with regards to criticisms of favouritism and conservatism. Ferg has hardly played this season and there are some really talented young guys with loads of form [and pace] playing across the provinces – Adam Byrne, Jacob Stockdale and Darren 'Hurler' Sweetnam.

Stockdale hasnt been tested yet IMO. Most of his starts are against the bottom 4 of the pro 12 and also a sevwrly weakened Glasgow and Connacht. Other than that he has less than 80 minutes combined in high level games (clermont, exeter &l einster).

Similarly A Byrne played in 3 champions cup romps (twice against 14 men) and has had the benefit of playing behind a fairly rampant pack thats setting the team up for a try scoring record. Not to knock him bit again i dont think hes really been tested. How many teams have probed for a weakness and been competent enough to exploit it? That will change over the next 6 or more games im sure.

Sweetnam is i think tje furthest along but still have questions. Hes already in tbe squad isnt he?

Ripping it up in the international window and against weaker teams is great, but counts for nothing in international selection.

Hard to argue with that assessment but at some stage the trade off between an out of form regular and a newbie moves in favour of the newbie.
The England game is not one for experiment.
At some stage tho Joe has to realise that something is broken and needs to be fixed.
Joe could do worse than examine his own approach.
He has to realise that coaching at international level probably means that he has to compromise his philosophy a bit and gamble with or trust his players a little more.
Obviously he's trying to get the provinces to play the way Ireland are playing so that he can shorten the learning curve.
But until that happens he's got to make and do with what he's got - he's got a lot of talent available to him.