"Opposition players who hold the ball carrier and do not go to ground are not tacklers."
leinsterforever wrote: hugonaut wrote:
Dave Cahill wrote:Most people involved in Rugby don't know the laws
The laws are bloody complicated and full of contradictions and inconsistencies in the first place. Referees interpreting them differently makes them even more confusing.
How many times do you see a collapsed maul from a lineout penalised? Quite frequently. How many times do you see a collapsed maul from a choke tackle penalised? Quite infrequently. They're both collapsed mauls.
Can you tackle the ball carrier in a maul?
If a maul can only take place in the field of play, does it mean that if one person in a maul puts his foot on the touchline, then it's no longer a maul? Why/why not?
How many people realise that you only need three people to form a maul? "A maul begins when a player carrying the ball is held by one or more opponents, and one or more of the ball carrier’s team mates bind on the ball carrier. A maul therefore consists, when it begins, of at least three players, all on their feet; the ball carrier and one player from each team. All the players involved must be caught in or bound to the maul and must be on their feet and moving towards a goal line. Open play has ended."
So if a supporting player latches on to the ball carrier who is being held by an opposition player, that is, by definition, a maul. Why do we see mauls with five or six players involved being called [and refereed] as 'tackle only'?
Because the ball-carrier has managed to touch the ground with a knee?
If there are no tacklers, how can there be a tackle? Somebody from the opposite team has to tackle the player in possession and go to ground themselves
in order for there to be a tackle.
If the upright 'tackler' makes full contact with the ball carrier while a player from the ball carrier's team is bound to him, he's instantly in a maul [as above, you only need the right three people - two from the attacking team and one from the defending team - to form a maul]. Just because the ball carrier puts his knee on the ground, it doesn't mean he is tackled – he needs the player from the opposite team to go to ground too for there to be a tackle. You can't have a tackle without a tackler [as Law 15 above states].
But "a player must not intentionally collapse a maul. This is dangerous play."
]. The 'tackler' is already in a maul once he is in full contact with the ball-carrier and the leach. He can't collapse a maul, otherwise he gives away a penalty.
Or can you always tackle the ball carrier in a maul, even if there are 16 men in it and the whole thing subsequently collapses?