Tour to Japan

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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby leinsterforever » April 17th, 2017, 11:35 pm

ronk wrote:Ross Byrnes dropgoal last week looks all the better with Paddy Jackson missing in Limerick.

He might be a good bet.

We'll know a lot more about the touring party on Wednesday


Not sure there'll be enough space in the squad for Byrne. I'd say they'll take two 10s, and then someone like Olding or Scannell will cover if necessary from 12. He has done well to put himself in the frame, though.

I think Hanrahan should be considered as well, now that he's committed to coming back to Ireland
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby fourthirtythree » April 18th, 2017, 2:03 pm

For 12? Why? Let's see if he makes the Munster squad, which I don't think he will for big games, rather than parachuting him in ahead of guys playing regular first team football. 10 not an option, that ship has sailed for Munster and for Ireland. Lots of players ahead of him right now.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby Laighin Break » April 18th, 2017, 2:59 pm

fourthirtythree wrote:For 12? Why? Let's see if he makes the Munster squad, which I don't think he will for big games, rather than parachuting him in ahead of guys playing regular first team football. 10 not an option, that ship has sailed for Munster and for Ireland. Lots of players ahead of him right now.


I wouldn't write Hanrahan off yet. He's still only 24, younger than Bleyendaal.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby fourthirtythree » April 18th, 2017, 5:22 pm

Sure, but Bleyendaal is a test quality player with a mature game. I wouldn't be worried about him starting a match for Ireland next week.

Hanrahan? Well he'd be behind sexton and Jackson (and Tyler) obviously, but he also has some catching up to do on Byrne and Carberry. Which he will struggle to do in Munster's bench. Him getting a shot will depend on TB getting Ireland call ups and being less available for Munster.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby ronk » April 18th, 2017, 7:00 pm

JJ would also have to get ahead of Keatley.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby simonokeeffe » April 18th, 2017, 9:16 pm

ronk wrote:JJ would also have to get ahead of Keatley.


hes off (to France)
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby Laighin Break » April 19th, 2017, 8:37 am

fourthirtythree wrote:Sure, but Bleyendaal is a test quality player with a mature game. I wouldn't be worried about him starting a match for Ireland next week.

Hanrahan? Well he'd be behind sexton and Jackson (and Tyler) obviously, but he also has some catching up to do on Byrne and Carberry. Which he will struggle to do in Munster's bench. Him getting a shot will depend on TB getting Ireland call ups and being less available for Munster.


Yeah fair enough. I was talking in general about JJ, but obviously in a topic about the tour to Japan it's his chances on travelling we're talking about. My bad.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby Fan with smartphone » April 19th, 2017, 1:29 pm

What are we looking at now?
1. Kilcoyne, Cronin, Buckley/Porter/Bent. Give Healy a pre-season.
2. Scannell, Tracy, Cronin
3. Ryan, Bealham.
4. Treadwell, Molony
5. Roux, probably Toner (though I'd like him rested).
6. Leavy, O'Brien/Ruddock.
7. JVDF, O'Donnell.
8. Conan, O'Donoghue.
9. Marmion, McGrath.
10. Jackson, Byrne/Carbery. Would like to see all 3, especially given Carbery can slot in 15 and at a push 9
11. Zebo, Gilroy. Let Earls get his groin in good order for next season. Might not take Stockdale after a dodgy display v Munster.
12. McCloskey, Scannell. Olding's form is really not good either, is exciting at times playing 10 for Ulster, but dropping easy ball and easily blocked
13. Marshall, Ringrose.
14. Byrne, Sweetnam.
15. O'Halloran, Conway.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby Munsterboy » April 19th, 2017, 4:12 pm

Fan with smartphone wrote:What are we looking at now?
1. Kilcoyne, Cronin, Buckley/Porter/Bent. Give Healy a pre-season.
2. Scannell, Tracy, Cronin
3. Ryan, Bealham.
4. Treadwell, Molony
5. Roux, probably Toner (though I'd like him rested).
6. Leavy, O'Brien/Ruddock.
7. JVDF, O'Donnell.
8. Conan, O'Donoghue.
9. Marmion, McGrath.
10. Jackson, Byrne/Carbery. Would like to see all 3, especially given Carbery can slot in 15 and at a push 9
11. Zebo, Gilroy. Let Earls get his groin in good order for next season. Might not take Stockdale after a dodgy display v Munster.
12. McCloskey, Scannell. Olding's form is really not good either, is exciting at times playing 10 for Ulster, but dropping easy ball and easily blocked
13. Marshall, Ringrose.
14. Byrne, Sweetnam.
15. O'Halloran, Conway.


Reidy might go.

Will Jordi and Dillane be fit?

Think Joe will bring Healy, Trimble and Earls too. I would prefer he didn't but he's not one to leave fit players at home.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby paddyor » April 19th, 2017, 4:21 pm

Munsterboy wrote:
Fan with smartphone wrote:What are we looking at now?
1. Kilcoyne, Cronin, Buckley/Porter/Bent. Give Healy a pre-season.
2. Scannell, Tracy, Cronin
3. Ryan, Bealham.
4. Treadwell, Molony
5. Roux, probably Toner (though I'd like him rested).
6. Leavy, O'Brien/Ruddock.
7. JVDF, O'Donnell.
8. Conan, O'Donoghue.
9. Marmion, McGrath.
10. Jackson, Byrne/Carbery. Would like to see all 3, especially given Carbery can slot in 15 and at a push 9
11. Zebo, Gilroy. Let Earls get his groin in good order for next season. Might not take Stockdale after a dodgy display v Munster.
12. McCloskey, Scannell. Olding's form is really not good either, is exciting at times playing 10 for Ulster, but dropping easy ball and easily blocked
13. Marshall, Ringrose.
14. Byrne, Sweetnam.
15. O'Halloran, Conway.


Reidy might go.

Will Jordi and Dillane be fit?

Think Joe will bring Healy, Trimble and Earls too. I would prefer he didn't but he's not one to leave fit players at home.

Except for that time he did when we went to Argentina.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby sunshiner1 » April 19th, 2017, 4:52 pm

Don't think Dillane will be fit and even if he is his lack of gametime makes it pointless. Same with Jordi, let the guy have a pre-season and come back fit and raring to go. I'd definitely bring Bent as much as he can cover both sides but also for his good form and perseverance over the last few seasons. You have to bring Buckley just to see if he can cut it at international standard.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby leinsterforever » April 19th, 2017, 5:53 pm

Fan with smartphone wrote:What are we looking at now?
1. Kilcoyne, Cronin, Buckley/Porter/Bent. Give Healy a pre-season.
2. Scannell, Tracy, Cronin
3. Ryan, Bealham.
4. Treadwell, Molony
5. Roux, probably Toner (though I'd like him rested).
6. Leavy, O'Brien/Ruddock.
7. JVDF, O'Donnell.
8. Conan, O'Donoghue.
9. Marmion, McGrath.
10. Jackson, Byrne/Carbery. Would like to see all 3, especially given Carbery can slot in 15 and at a push 9
11. Zebo, Gilroy. Let Earls get his groin in good order for next season. Might not take Stockdale after a dodgy display v Munster.
12. McCloskey, Scannell. Olding's form is really not good either, is exciting at times playing 10 for Ulster, but dropping easy ball and easily blocked
13. Marshall, Ringrose.
14. Byrne, Sweetnam.
15. O'Halloran, Conway.


My thoughts:

loosehead prop:
Healy plus one of Kilcoyne, Cronin, Buckley and Dooley. Personally, I'd prefer to see Buckley or Dooley get the second spot, but maybe Kilcoyne is the most likely

hooker:
Scannell, Cronin and Tracy would be my guess based on selections since last Autumn. Strauss might be able to muscle his way past Tracy by performing well for Leinster

tighthead prop:
With Ross seemingly having been phased out, it looks as if it'll be Ryan, Bealham and Bent. Maybe Conor Carey can challenge.

second row:
If they take four, it could be Toner, Holland, Roux and Treadwell. Ryan would probably bump somebody out if it turns out he'll be staying with Munster. James Cannon and Andrew Browne look like interesting options, but might not get a chance

blindside:
Rhys Ruddock seems the obvious pick, although he misses quite a lot of time with injury. If Ruddock is unavailable, it might open the door for McKeon, O'Brien or O'Callaghan, or Dan Leavy might be played at 6

openside:
Leavy and van der Flier look like the best options here to me. Reidy and O'Donnell would also be in the frame, although I don't rate O'Donnell particularly highly myself

no. 8:
Heaslip, Conan. Given the 'dry run for World Cup' nature of this tour, I think Heaslip will and should go if he recovers in time. If he doesn't make it back in time, Jack O'Donoghue is probably best-placed to benefit

scrumhalf:
Marmion, McGrath, Cooney/Blade

outhalf:
Jackson, Carbery. Ross Byrne, Jack Carty, Ian Keatley and JJ Hanrahan are other options if one of Jackson or Carbery gets injured or called away

inside centre:
I'd say it'll be two from McCloskey, Olding and Scannell. Schmidt seems to have a few reservations about McCloskey, so he could be the one to miss out, although I think I prefer him as a 12 option to Olding. Reid and Ronaldson have had good seasons, but it's possibly unlikely that they'd get a look-in

outside centre:
Ringrose plus either Luke Marshall or Rory O'Loughlin. Think I prefer what ROL brings, but Marshall's greater international involvement to date might see him get the nod

wing:
If Trimble, Earls, McFadden and Gilroy are available, there might not be a whole lot of space to include the likes of Byrne, Sweetnam and Stockdale. I'd like to see Trimble, Stockdale and Sweetnam go, but the chances of a fit Earls not travelling are probably slim.

fullback:
O'Halloran, Zebo. A return for Kearney might complicate things, but he might be better of trying to get himself fully right over the Summer

Overall, Id say that nearly all the available front-liners will go because the experience will be valuable come World Cup time
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby RoboProp » April 19th, 2017, 6:47 pm

Oldschool wrote:
ronk wrote:It might make him choose between Ireland and his S15 career.

If you make him say no you make it harder to get him later.

No problem with that - if he's not good enough for NZ he's not good enough for us, given our FR talent.


We don't really have depth at TH like we do LH. I say do an Isa on him...eh?
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby dropkick » April 20th, 2017, 4:17 pm

Fan with smartphone wrote:What are we looking at now?
1. Kilcoyne, Cronin, Buckley/Porter/Bent. Give Healy a pre-season.
2. Scannell, Tracy, Cronin
3. Ryan, Bealham.
4. Treadwell, Molony
5. Roux, probably Toner (though I'd like him rested).
6. Leavy, O'Brien/Ruddock.
7. JVDF, O'Donnell.
8. Conan, O'Donoghue.
9. Marmion, McGrath.
10. Jackson, Byrne/Carbery. Would like to see all 3, especially given Carbery can slot in 15 and at a push 9
11. Zebo, Gilroy. Let Earls get his groin in good order for next season. Might not take Stockdale after a dodgy display v Munster.
12. McCloskey, Scannell. Olding's form is really not good either, is exciting at times playing 10 for Ulster, but dropping easy ball and easily blocked
13. Marshall, Ringrose.
14. Byrne, Sweetnam.
15. O'Halloran, Conway.


I think the highlighted players havn't had the best season. Its a bit of a paradox with the Munster lads because the team is flying but they've been fairly quiet. Having said that one or two of the highlighted players are likely to go.
I think Carbery will be a 10 long term so he should be given opportunities to build up the experience.
Too early for Porter IMO. He is transitioning to tighthead and will need time. Bent deserves to go and I'd like to see Healy rested though he might be on Lions standby. Porter and Conor Carey are ones to watch.
Another second row is needed and stocks are low at the moment. Its a shame James Ryan got injured because a few games for Leinster and he could have been a bolter. Toner will probably be needed. Dave O'Callaghan has been very good for Munster lately. Maybe he could squeeze in to the squad or Alan O'Connor or Andrew Brown.

I'd bring O'Loughlin, Olding, Dave OC, Noel Reid (If his defence is solid), Stockdale (big talent), Cian Kelleher and one other second row.

From your list I'd leave James Cronin, Porter, Healy, Molony, TOD, JOD, Gilroy, Zebo and Marshall off.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby sunshiner1 » April 21st, 2017, 11:05 am

Anyone know when the squad will be named?
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby CiaranIrl » April 21st, 2017, 11:45 am

There's no way players like Heaslip, Toner, Zebo, Earls, Healy, Kearney etc will be left behind. They will all be wanted as backups for the lions for when the inevitable injuries happen. They'll need to be match ready and sharp. Much as many of us might feel a bit disinterested in the Lions, it isn't separate from the IRFU. The 4 unions own it.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby LeRouxIsPHat » April 21st, 2017, 12:42 pm

CiaranIrl wrote:There's no way players like Heaslip, Toner, Zebo, Earls, Healy, Kearney etc will be left behind. They will all be wanted as backups for the lions for when the inevitable injuries happen. They'll need to be match ready and sharp. Much as many of us might feel a bit disinterested in the Lions, it isn't separate from the IRFU. The 4 unions own it.


I hope we see a mix, so maybe leave half the experienced guys behind. There are a few positions that we really need to develop players (back three, scrumhalf, tighthead, second row) so I'd try and experiment there and then go with experience elsewhere. Whatever about the US game I reckon the Japanese games will be very tough so would want experience against them regardless of any other reasons.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby cormac » April 21st, 2017, 2:06 pm

CiaranIrl wrote:There's no way players like Heaslip, Toner, Zebo, Earls, Healy, Kearney etc will be left behind. They will all be wanted as backups for the lions for when the inevitable injuries happen. They'll need to be match ready and sharp. Much as many of us might feel a bit disinterested in the Lions, it isn't separate from the IRFU. The 4 unions own it.


I'm not sure if all of them will go, but that will be down to their injury situation rather than Joe not wanting to pick them. Hopefully we'll see plenty of rotation amongs the squad for the three games.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby LeRouxIsPHat » April 30th, 2017, 12:25 pm

We really are very short on second rows for this. I'd actually take James Ryan on tour, wouldn't play him but would bring him for the experience anyway.
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Re: Tour to Japan

Postby Ruckedtobits » April 30th, 2017, 5:50 pm

Thought about that a while back but it would probably be "disrespecting" the second-tier nations. But, on the other hand, I think NZ have taken emerging players on European Tour without any announcement.

At the moment I have three of Treadwell, Molony, O'Shea and Roux pencilled in beside Ryan. IMO, no point in taking Holland and Toner needs a good rest.
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