Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

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Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby paddyor » February 27th, 2018, 2:11 am

From the Wales Thread

Show Spoiler:
Rucktobits wrote:Saturday passed in a blur of anxiety, mixed with dread (for Jonny's lost kicking boots) but topped with exhilaration at the denoument, as Stockdale scampered under the posts (and didn't risk a dive) and then relief, that Gatty's game plan and tactics hadn't deprived us again.

So WHAT did we do and HOW did we do it? Can we do it AGAIN against Scotland? SHOULD we do it again against Scotland?

Quite simply, it appears that our game plan was to deprive Wales of possession and get points by attacking their mid-field defence with hard carrying forwards and our ability to retain possession for multiple phases without mistakes. Yes, we attempted some attacking kick passes and some short-side triangles, but our primary attack mode was to drive them backwards by the volume and power of our ball carrying.

Stockdale's first try was a piece of sublime skill from JS, set up by Farrell and the forwards disconnecting their backline defence. The next three tries were the product of multi-phase effective attacking that few can match or defend. Stockdale's last try was caused more by the clock than any other factor.

Wales, or at least Anscombe, didn't have the confidence that his team could retain possession for the necessary time (and phases) to create a try scoring opportunity and he somewhat panicking by throwing a Hail Mary pass over Farrell in the hope that Shindler and / or Navidi could carry it 50m between them to score the winning try.

Our line-out was pretty good, as was our scrum. Our re-starts were a nice mixture of possession and position. Our breakdown work was almost exemplary. We didn't throw loose offloads. Our kicking was smart and opportune and generally very accurate. We screwed up for their first try but not tackling Shindler cleanly and thereby allowing them to make a line break. Did Bundee's knock-on, or knockdown, cause our defence to freeze? It certainly looked like it, but Davies took his try well and only a miracle tackle from Stockdale might have stopped him.

Their other two tries were the product of real pace on their left wing. In both instances Evans was put round the outside of our defence and had the pace to get a fatal line-break, where our cover defence mis-read the numbers in support and the correct defensive line. Partially lack of experience and partially lack of confidence in a team-mate that they could make a one-on-one tackle.

So, IMO, no screaming flaw in our defensive system was evident. Just individual errors from fatigued players.

Could we play the same way against Scotland? Probably we could. And if we did, it might perhaps surprise Townsend more than any other Game Plan. However, I don't believe we SHOULD play like that against this Scottish team, because of their particulat skill at the breakdown / tackle area. Barclay, Wilson, Watson, Gilchrist and McNally each have real skills in that area and will challenge any team trying to play possession attack. So multi-phase ball carrying attack against this pack is not recommended - certainly not as the primary mode of attacking play.

This could cause Joe Schmidt a dilemma in selection. The Squad selected on Saturday are possibly limited in one particular attribute - that of acceleration. Earls and Cronin and possibly Conor Murray, are the only players with real acceleration over 5-10 metres. Stockdale appears genuinely quick at full pace but he needs 10-15m to reack top-gear. Likewise Farrell and Sexton. None of our back-rows are dynamic in acceleration (JVdF is, but not available). The consequence of this shortcoming is that line-breaks beyond about 25m from the opposition line are unlikely to be supported and those line-breaks, unless by Earls or Stockdale, are unlikely to be try scoring in their own right.

So there is the challenge for the Irish Coach(es). Play the same fundamental game plan and take the risk of turnovers at breakdowns or find more pace or specifically more acceleration to enable Ireland to score from further out by creating line-breaking opportunities that can be finished off before the covering tackles arrive. Players like Ringrose, Conway and / or Larmour may appear to be real candidates if this thinking is mirrored in Carton House.

One thing is fairly certain. The presence of Sammy Arnold would suggest that the Irish Squad teaining will have a player with the acceleration and general physique of Huw Jones, to practice against over the next few days. Keep Jones quite and let Sexton plan for Finn Russell and you nullify two of the major Scottisk threats.

Lots to think about in Carton House and certainly not as straightforward as the Gatty Challenge


Scots are likely to be missing Ryan Wilson.

https://twitter.com/theblitzdefence/status/967751720444026880

Can't remember if he got done for this.

https://www.balls.ie/rugby/gif-the-unnecessary-incident-that-saw-glasgow-flanker-ryan-wilson-cited-for-testicle-grabbing-321922

I think Denton is the next cab off the rank so it's likely to be a more orthodox back row selection. Mind you Barclay has "played 8" for Scarlets in the Pro12 a few times.

Think I disagree with you RTB, I'd be inclined to double down on the aggressive possession game. Benchin' 350 bitches!

Image

Though we might be overestimating our ability to retain ball.

Show Spoiler:
Hint: Hill.
Image


Last year our backrow + Henshaw made c180m off over 70 carries and they were the guts of 3 tries. We've more bulk in the centres now and AFAIK they're also missing Dunbar(McHensahw). Our centres pose a much different threat tot Horne and Jones than Farrell and Joseph and it has to be said are more (individually) solid than Farrell who has turned into a turnstyle. Granted we lost but that was more in part to a slow start and wasted opportunities. Keep the ball away from them and make them commit to a peno. We can keep the score board ticking over or squeeze them off the maul.

I think one of the mistakes England made was not picking and driving enough in the 22. They seemed to move it away too quick for their own back row but goldilocks for the 3 Scottish flankers. I also think our pack has better carriers. We'll make yards from pick and gos. We still need the same blend of passing that got us the linebreaks vs Wales.

I think, like Wales, we'll be better able to deal with Russell & Laidlaw/Price. We know the things he has in his locker. If you watch that pass to Jones, it's like they were waiting for Joseph to step right.



I think our advantage over them is 1-10(assuming all fit) and we should seek to press that advantage as much as possible. It'd be great if the make shift centres could fashion more but I doubt it.

Balance of the backrow is a little different this year without SOB and Heaslip( :( ) but we do have the option of a Henderson Ryan 2nd row. I think I'd start Toner on account of what he brings at the maul and also because he's just a better lineout forward than Henderson/Ryan(we were so limted against France and hendo made no catches vs England last year - this could be because it was wet but Toner is proven in this regard IMO). On top of the 2nd row options, Healy is back to his best and we now have Porter off the bench.
Ruddock's tackle stats consistently too low for me to be taken seriously as a Six Nations blindside..... Ruddock's defensive stats don't stack up. - All Blacks Nil, Jan 15th, 2014
England A 8 - 14 Ireland A, 25th Jan 2014
Ruddock(c) 19/2 Tackles
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby sunshiner1 » February 27th, 2018, 2:20 am

Good post. Looking at the way the Scots partied after the England game there could be an element of mental switch off from them. Kind of like we've won our World Cup final so anything after this is a bonus.
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby suisse » February 27th, 2018, 7:35 am

I'm less worried about this game than I was before Wales, but I expect Scotland to score tries. A few tries, even without much ball. 6 in 2 games v 2 teams with little ball or territory is very worrying. Scotland exposed us last season. This could be a pretty high-scoring game.

Finn Russell gave two glorious, high risk passes for their second try v England. He's gonna look to get around our centres the same way. There's always the possibility of a pick off there, too.
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby simonokeeffe » February 27th, 2018, 8:54 am

Horne is a second five eighth rather than an inside centre albeit not the smallest one ever.

Agree on their lack of carriers though, Watson, and Barclay a bit, never die easy and use footwork/exploit space but theyve no one who will roadkill anyone or force a few yards out of nowhere like Furlong or Henderson
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby Peg Leg » February 27th, 2018, 9:04 am

I f%~king hate Barclay, he is such a nuisance at the breakdown and he has singlehandedly taken apart both Leinsters and Ireland's lineout in the past.
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby simonokeeffe » February 27th, 2018, 1:02 pm

Peg Leg wrote:I f%~king hate Barclay, he is such a nuisance at the breakdown and he has singlehandedly taken apart both Leinsters and Ireland's lineout in the past.
Great player.


Same here

There's also a lot of begrudging respect but look out for Johnny Gray doing a few no arms chop tackles
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby paddyor » February 27th, 2018, 5:24 pm

F***!!!
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Chris Farrell is likely to miss the remainder of the Six Nations after twisting his knee in training today.

He did look in real pain at the time. Another injury blow for Ireland.
Ruddock's tackle stats consistently too low for me to be taken seriously as a Six Nations blindside..... Ruddock's defensive stats don't stack up. - All Blacks Nil, Jan 15th, 2014
England A 8 - 14 Ireland A, 25th Jan 2014
Ruddock(c) 19/2 Tackles
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby jimbobjoe » February 27th, 2018, 5:36 pm

Ah here! Let's wrap Ringer in some cotton wool.

Gutted for Farrell.
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby fourthirtythree » February 27th, 2018, 6:43 pm

You've got to really feel for Chris Farrell there, a real breakthrough performance at international level and then that.
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby LeRouxIsPHat » February 27th, 2018, 8:05 pm

I did not expect to be disappointed that Chris Farrell wouldn't be starting for us but I am now, and absolutely gutted for the guy. He had a tough time reaching the top and then when he finally "arrives" like he did on Saturday he can't get to continue it. Really feel for him but hopefully he won't be out for too long.
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby simonokeeffe » February 27th, 2018, 8:14 pm

LeRouxIsPHat wrote:I did not expect to be disappointed that Chris Farrell wouldn't be starting for us but I am now, and absolutely gutted for the guy. He had a tough time reaching the top and then when he finally "arrives" like he did on Saturday he can't get to continue it. Really feel for him but hopefully he won't be out for too long.


Its a half empty half full approach to whether having such a stop start season is a good sign or not
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby TerenureJim » February 27th, 2018, 10:14 pm

paddyor wrote:F***!!!
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52s53 seconds ago

Chris Farrell is likely to miss the remainder of the Six Nations after twisting his knee in training today.

He did look in real pain at the time. Another injury blow for Ireland.


Hmm let's wait and see lots of iffy injury news doing the rounds of late
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby paddyor » February 27th, 2018, 10:47 pm

TerenureJim wrote:Hmm let's wait and see lots of iffy injury news doing the rounds of late

Another conspiracy from Schmidt to keep a Munster player out of the team?
Ruddock's tackle stats consistently too low for me to be taken seriously as a Six Nations blindside..... Ruddock's defensive stats don't stack up. - All Blacks Nil, Jan 15th, 2014
England A 8 - 14 Ireland A, 25th Jan 2014
Ruddock(c) 19/2 Tackles
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby Icarus » February 28th, 2018, 12:13 am

paddyor wrote:
TerenureJim wrote:Hmm let's wait and see lots of iffy injury news doing the rounds of late

Another conspiracy from Schmidt to keep a Munster player out of the team?

That appears to be a significant school of thought in the MF forum.
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby sunshiner1 » February 28th, 2018, 9:08 am

by Icarus » February 28th, 2018, 12:13 am

paddyor wrote:

TerenureJim wrote:
Hmm let's wait and see lots of iffy injury news doing the rounds of late


Another conspiracy from Schmidt to keep a Munster player out of the team?


That appears to be a significant school of thought in the MF forum.


It's all true. Joe had Les Kiss knee cap him with an extenable baton in the dressing room corridor. The Irish Independent have the exclusive.
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby simonokeeffe » February 28th, 2018, 10:10 am

well if we go by the Indo Joe lies about every lump and bump of an Ireland player every time so it has credence
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby fourthirtythree » February 28th, 2018, 10:36 am

Yeah he just has Farrell sit out an Ireland match to fit in with his lies, poor Jamie Heaslip had to retire. #omerta
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby simonokeeffe » February 28th, 2018, 11:25 am

these former vice principals are ruthless
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby paddyor » February 28th, 2018, 5:57 pm

http://the1014.com/tactics-scotland-v-england/

Interesting analysis of the Scotland vs England game.
Ruddock's tackle stats consistently too low for me to be taken seriously as a Six Nations blindside..... Ruddock's defensive stats don't stack up. - All Blacks Nil, Jan 15th, 2014
England A 8 - 14 Ireland A, 25th Jan 2014
Ruddock(c) 19/2 Tackles
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Re: Ireland vs Scotland 2018 6N

Postby paddyor » February 28th, 2018, 6:18 pm

Wilsons citing dismissed.
Ruddock's tackle stats consistently too low for me to be taken seriously as a Six Nations blindside..... Ruddock's defensive stats don't stack up. - All Blacks Nil, Jan 15th, 2014
England A 8 - 14 Ireland A, 25th Jan 2014
Ruddock(c) 19/2 Tackles
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