England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

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England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby IanD » March 10th, 2018, 8:12 pm

Sorry nothing to say but wanted to get the subject title.
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby domhnallj » March 10th, 2018, 10:22 pm

Well we could say ‘there’s no show like a Joe show’ but we’d just be repeating ourselves. Best to say nothing ....
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby blockhead » March 10th, 2018, 10:35 pm

Whatever happens we will be lifting the trophy in twickers after the game. :clap: :clap: :green clap: :happy clapper:
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby olaf the fat » March 11th, 2018, 12:21 am

England v the team ranked 2nd in the world.

Plus Eddie Jones mind games will now be about Eddie Jones
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby Twist » March 11th, 2018, 8:30 am

There's been something up with England this season. Anyone can lose in Edinburgh and Paris but they've looked weirdly haunted. They didn't score for the last hour at home to Wales, were way too slow to react to what was happening in Scotland and didn't look like they had any belief in France.

I know those aren't really measurable criticisms but at least the commentators on TV were saying the same! They were trudging around the Stade with no urgency. I'm sure theyll be in full-on backlash mode on Saturday but this hasn't been an acceptable tournament by their standards. If it hadn't been for Farrell it could've been disastrous


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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby Ruckedtobits » March 11th, 2018, 11:44 am

Twist wrote:There's been something up with England this season. Anyone can lose in Edinburgh and Paris but they've looked weirdly haunted. They didn't score for the last hour at home to Wales, were way too slow to react to what was happening in Scotland and didn't look like they had any belief in France.

I know those aren't really measurable criticisms but at least the commentators on TV were saying the same! They were trudging around the Stade with no urgency. I'm sure theyll be in full-on backlash mode on Saturday but this hasn't been an acceptable tournament by their standards. If it hadn't been for Farrell it could've been disastrous


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The English team look in full post-something mode. The obvious candidate is post-Lions mood and older users on this forum understand the impact that can have -remember 2010 after Grand Slam 2009 and immediate Lions Tour? The emotional well of desire is empty and they (England) are playing only from pride and memory. Probably not enough to beat this Team of Joe.

The same factor may be impacting on Sexton and Murray, who have both been excellent but, marginally below their brilliant best. OTOH, I thought POM had one of his best Championships, so there's no common thread for all involved in the Lions last summer. JJV Davies, Rob Henshaw, Liam Williams, Elliot Daley, Sean O' Brien, Faleteau, are a few who spring to mind who have had sub-par years. Farrell and Watson haven't sparkled for England and Vunipola M and Itoje have not dominated like last season.

There is no proof that a downturn in form is inevitable post a Lions Tour but the evidence is available that it causes some impact.
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby simonokeeffe » March 11th, 2018, 11:48 am

The ebb and flow of psychic energy is in a waning phase for them

Would love to see it again but theres a blog/article about how Jones generally has a big impact and then fades off horribly

They had a bullyboy mentality and now their psyche has cracked.
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby RoboProp » March 11th, 2018, 1:01 pm

I said to my friends before the tournaments started that England would look very ordinary without Billy Vunipola
They scoffed. 2 losses and a lucky win against Wales, I am starting to feel vindcated. Vunipola freed up other players for them, destroyed defensive systems by sucking in defenders. They lost part of their edge without him. I hope we put them to the sword.
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby LeRouxIsPHat » March 11th, 2018, 1:40 pm

I was very surprised that England didn't have a reaction to the Scotland game last night. There are enough winners and experience there for them to have performed better. They just look under powered and flat. That's not to say that they can't improve next week, but it does seem like we can't wait for next Saturday whereas they can't wait for the tournament to be over.

Lawes has been in good form for a while now, but doesn't look like a 6. Itoje has been very disappointing (wonder if he was rushed back from injury), Launchbury has been invisible, and Billy V was obviously a huge loss. Youngs was a loss too and has the double whammy of meaning that they didn't have Care's impact off the bench. Farrell is the only guy who's still stepping up and he's so influential that he could still spark a good performance.

It can come down to such small margins though so it wont be easy. If our lineout misfires like it did in the first half yesterday then we'll be up against it.

I think I'd start Henderson for Toner and possibly McGrath for Healy. I'd like to see us use Stockdale more than we did yesterday, felt like he wasn't involved too much outside of the tries.
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby Dave Cahill » March 11th, 2018, 2:17 pm

I have the sense, based on not much more than gut feeling, that all is not well in that England camp. There doesn't seem to be that unity of purpose that was there before, some of the selections are a bit unusual and some of the trademark 'Jonesisms' seem to have been dispensed with this year.
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby wixfjord » March 11th, 2018, 2:22 pm

Itoje has been very quiet this year, hopefully that form continues into the QF.

Also I don't think Ford is good enough or has enough about him for this level.

But the biggest loss by far is Billy V. He's an incredibly important part of that team.
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby Oldschool » March 11th, 2018, 3:14 pm

Next week will be mostly about two things.
Can Joe and his squad handle the tension that a shot at the GS brings. Hopefully all the programming and muscle memory that Joe has built into the team will overcome the pressure.
Will England react to two losses and come out all guns blazing?
To echo RTB's point France with one exception, I think it was Ireland, have won the 6Ns in the post lions tour season.
Ireland in 2017/18 are the exception again?
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby olaf the fat » March 11th, 2018, 4:43 pm

Big thing for England will be not letting another team have a grand slam a year out from the RWC. Changes the mind set from a doomed championship game to something else and is what that English team needs - and the last thing we need.
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby RoboProp » March 11th, 2018, 6:51 pm

Dave Cahill wrote:I have the sense, based on not much more than gut feeling, that all is not well in that England camp. There doesn't seem to be that unity of purpose that was there before, some of the selections are a bit unusual and some of the trademark 'Jonesisms' seem to have been dispensed with this year.


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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby paddyor » March 11th, 2018, 8:52 pm

Lawes and Hughes out. Simmonds and Haskell I'd say.
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby CiaranIrl » March 11th, 2018, 10:28 pm

paddyor wrote:Lawes and Hughes out. Simmonds and Haskell I'd say.


He might promote Armand. That would be the smart call anyway.
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby Ruckedtobits » March 12th, 2018, 12:17 am

English media having the power it does, is there any chance that Eddie is playing 'three and out' on Saturday?

The fall from grace has been sudden and sharp and his non-selection, or "no alteration in my backrow" outlook, which flies in the face of such icons as Delalglio and Moore, amongst others, suggests that stubborness only works with the English media when you're winning.

Were England to lose next Saturday, be certain that the story will be, not an Irish Grand Slam, but Eddie losing three in a row, facing into a three match Tour to S Africa in June.

The English media are incredibly powerful when it comes to National sports Coaches. Three weeks ago Eddie Jones was lording it over Football Manager Gareth Southgate (50% record from 14 games) & Cricket Coach Trevor Bayliss (just lost Ashes series in Australia and not staying beyond the summer). Despite 25 wins from 26 games prior to Murrayfield, would three straight losses lead to his departure from the role?.

There are many in the RFU who cast an envious eye at the calm and effective contribution that Lancaster has made on the coaching front in Leinster and wonder "Did we already have the right man, but we just had him doing the wrong job?"

Lots to happen yet before that question gets asked in public, but be sure it has been asked in private already this weekend. A week for lots of surmise in Red Tops and Broadsheets and every morning in Cheltenham for the rumour mills to churn and regurgitate.
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby RAILWAY1 » March 12th, 2018, 1:16 am

No doubt Joe Schmidt will have the players focus on their own game and let the English media rant on to their hearts content about Eddie.
Only hope some of the knocks our players picked up yesterday are not too serious and Joe can pick from a nearly full deck
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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby OTT » March 12th, 2018, 8:27 am

Are our media any better then the English?

They thought we should hockey France in Paris where we had previously only won three times in 46 years each of those by a score. They concentrated on the couple of trys Italy got at the end of the game after we had made loads of substitutions instead of acknowledging how we had been so clinical in the first 53minutes that we had got ourselves into a position of being 42-0 up.

They said we would struggle against Wales because we wouldn’t be able to break them down yet we scored 5 trys and left a few more behind so they switched the narrative to how we had dominated position but couldn’t put Wales away. We were excellent against Wales.

We beat Scotland with a bonus point win, a Scotland who were going to cut us open and be all over us at the breakdown and it turns to how we are a machine but a boring machine.

Next week if we get beaten by England in their fortress Twickenham (the team who were second in the world prior to Saturday) you can be sure the story will be we will have blown a Grand Slam ignoring the fact that England are an excellent side just as we are.


The English going after Eddie Jones is nearly as crazy as the passive aggressive way our print media go after Joe Schmidt the best coach we have ever had it’s ridiculous. Eddie Jones is a tosspot (opinion) but he’s done a brilliant job as England coach.

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Re: England v 6 Nations Champions 2018 Twickenham March 17

Postby RAILWAY1 » March 12th, 2018, 10:38 am

Our media are not much better than their English counterparts but they don't seem to have the same power over union's decision making when it comes to appointing or sacking coaches. This could be because the IRFU set the agenda here and the provinces have to toe the line but in England the RFU run the game in name only with the real power resting with the premiership clubs. When rugby decisions are made based primarily on commercial grounds to suit sponsors the media has more influence and this is not always the best for the game .
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