The Ireland 23 for RWC

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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby dropkick » November 19th, 2018, 5:01 pm

Might be a blessing for SOB to get that broken arm. I always thought he needed a sabbatical.
I think he should be used as an impact sub during the world cup. Imagine having his impact off the bench for the last 30 minutes. It would also lengthen his career.
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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby neiliog93 » November 19th, 2018, 8:58 pm

artaneboy wrote:
RAILWAY1 wrote:One of the big questions will have to be can Joe Schmidt take a chance on Sean O'Brien being healthy and match fit for the World Cup. Personally I think he may HAVE TO go with Leavy and VdF to cover 7 given the attritional nature of the world cup


Seanie broke his arm. It’s not a recurrence of an old injury. There absolutely no reason to think that his arm won’t be fine in a few months.

Now whether he’s in good enough form to get the nod from Joe is another thing. My guess is that he will give him every chance. Among other reasons- Sean has the advantage of being able to play at a high level in all three back row positions. That’s a very useful attribute in a tour squad.

+1. Much, much better for a guy with a history of muscular/ligament injuries to get a clean break to a bone. It isn't the type of injury that recurs and was a bit of a freak moment, his arm at a weird angle colliding with an opponent's head at speed. He'll be fine and I have a feeling he's going to have a huge RWC next year.

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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby sunshiner1 » November 20th, 2018, 2:49 am

It may sound like Blasphemy but SOB isn't the tied down starter that he used to be. Leavy and JVDF are just as good. I can't see Joe leaving SOB at home but it's nowhere near the end of the world if he can't make it.
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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby Laighin Break » November 20th, 2018, 8:57 am

dropkick wrote:Might be a blessing for SOB to get that broken arm. I always thought he needed a sabbatical.
I think he should be used as an impact sub during the world cup. Imagine having his impact off the bench for the last 30 minutes. It would also lengthen his career.

He pretty much had a sabbatical last year.
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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby locho » November 21st, 2018, 10:40 pm

dropkick wrote:Might be a blessing for SOB to get that broken arm. I always thought he needed a sabbatical.
I think he should be used as an impact sub during the world cup. Imagine having his impact off the bench for the last 30 minutes. It would also lengthen his career.


Really?? SOB has played SFA rugby over the last 4 years, if ever there was a player who needed a consistent run of unbroken games its him.
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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby RAILWAY1 » November 22nd, 2018, 12:58 am

I am a huge fan of Sean O'Brien but would have to agree that he is not a nailed down starter these days, in fact with the depth of back row talent available I don't think any player could be considered nailed down in the current crop.
While the arm break is a fairly simple injury compared to a lot of these muscular and ligament injuries Sean O'Brien's injury history over recent years make him a fairly high risk pick with the limited numbers allowed for the tournament. Anybody picked for the final world cup squad will have to be 100% fit and fully match fit
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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby outcast eddie » November 22nd, 2018, 6:49 am

RAILWAY1 wrote:I am a huge fan of Sean O'Brien but would have to agree that he is not a nailed down starter these days, in fact with the depth of back row talent available I don't think any player could be considered nailed down in the current crop.
While the arm break is a fairly simple injury compared to a lot of these muscular and ligament injuries Sean O'Brien's injury history over recent years make him a fairly high risk pick with the limited numbers allowed for the tournament. Anybody picked for the final world cup squad will have to be 100% fit and fully match fit


D'arce and, to a lesser extent, Isa might feel otherwise
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The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby artaneboy » November 22nd, 2018, 11:39 am

outcast eddie wrote:
RAILWAY1 wrote:I am a huge fan of Sean O'Brien but would have to agree that he is not a nailed down starter these days, in fact with the depth of back row talent available I don't think any player could be considered nailed down in the current crop.
While the arm break is a fairly simple injury compared to a lot of these muscular and ligament injuries Sean O'Brien's injury history over recent years make him a fairly high risk pick with the limited numbers allowed for the tournament. Anybody picked for the final world cup squad will have to be 100% fit and fully match fit


D'arce and, to a lesser extent, Isa might feel otherwise


The point is, it’s not a recurrence of a previous injury. That is always ominous. There’s nothing to indicate he has something that he will be hampered long term... by this one anyone.

Seanie is far too good at his best to be written off without due consideration at the point in time. He stays in the frame.


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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby CiaranIrl » November 23rd, 2018, 6:40 pm

It's unbelievable how hard it will be to get into the 31 man squad. It looks to me that there are few auditions going on this weekend.

Assuming the usual 18 forwards and 13 backs, we're looking at:

Props x5. Healy, Furlong, McGrath, Porter. Bunch of players auditioning against USA are probably just scrapping for 1 place. If Porter can cover LH, then they all have a chance. If not, it probably has to be Bealham.

Hooker x3. Seems to be a hunger games situation between Cronin, Scannell & Herring. My guess it's that order of preference right now, but it's fluctuated a bit in recent years.

Locks x4. Obvious top 4 right now, with Roux next in line. Can't imagine 5 will travel even if Beirne is seen as back row cover.

Backrow x6: O'Mahony, Stander, Leavy & VDF simply have to travel. It's just two from O'Brien, Jordi, Conan & Ruddock. I'd guess that order just because of less need for a 6.

Half backs x5: Sexton, Carbery, Murray nailed on. Two from the rest is harsh to call. Marmion probably cemented his name on, so I'd say he could bring Cooney as a dual cover for the 5th spot. Ultra harsh on our two lads if so, but if he goes well this weekend, it seems very possible.

Center x3: Obvious top three here, with Chris Farrell having a chance if there's injury or if Henshaw gets a run at 15 during the 6N.

Back 3 x5: Stockdale, Earls, Kearney are definitely in. Then we're looking for two from Addison, Larmour, Conway, with versitility a key thing in the mix.
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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby Ruckedtobits » November 24th, 2018, 4:18 pm

CiaranIrl wrote:It's unbelievable how hard it will be to get into the 31 man squad. It looks to me that there are few auditions going on this weekend.

Assuming the usual 18 forwards and 13 backs, we're looking at:

Props x5. Healy, Furlong, McGrath, Porter. Bunch of players auditioning against USA are probably just scrapping for 1 place. If Porter can cover LH, then they all have a chance. If not, it probably has to be Bealham.

Hooker x3. Seems to be a hunger games situation between Cronin, Scannell & Herring. My guess it's that order of preference right now, but it's fluctuated a bit in recent years.

Locks x4. Obvious top 4 right now, with Roux next in line. Can't imagine 5 will travel even if Beirne is seen as back row cover.

Backrow x6: O'Mahony, Stander, Leavy & VDF simply have to travel. It's just two from O'Brien, Jordi, Conan & Ruddock. I'd guess that order just because of less need for a 6.

Half backs x5: Sexton, Carbery, Murray nailed on. Two from the rest is harsh to call. Marmion probably cemented his name on, so I'd say he could bring Cooney as a dual cover for the 5th spot. Ultra harsh on our two lads if so, but if he goes well this weekend, it seems very possible.

Center x3: Obvious top three here, with Chris Farrell having a chance if there's injury or if Henshaw gets a run at 15 during the 6N.

Back 3 x5: Stockdale, Earls, Kearney are definitely in. Then we're looking for two from Addison, Larmour, Conway, with versitility a key thing in the mix.


Good analysis @CiaranIrl. Getting into the Irish Squad is going to be very difficult.
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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby Oldschool » November 25th, 2018, 10:46 am

So JS is going after the RWC.
Discussion about his first choice 23 and RWC 31 is rife.
Obviously things can change between here and now but JS will already know what his 31 is if the RWC were kicking off tomorrow.
So that would be the starting point for figuring out what the squad will look like come RWC time.
However if JS looks at his 31 today the major question he will be asking himself is "where is the weakest link and what can be done about it between now and RWC"
For example Garry Ringrose and to only a slightly lesser extent Robert Kearney are JS' biggest headache.
Lose either before a big game and we will have a major problem.
What are JS' options and right now who are the likely replacements.
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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby outcast eddie » November 25th, 2018, 12:35 pm

Will Addison's performance over the AI's is cause for hope at 13 and 15.
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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby Fan with smartphone » November 25th, 2018, 1:54 pm

The depth chart will line out 3 players in each position, but in reality if we lose either, is the answer to both questions not: Robbie Henshaw?
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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby Dave Cahill » November 25th, 2018, 2:25 pm

Presuming Schmidt uses a similar positional selection pattern to the 2015 RWC (even accepting that load of bollix about Madigan playing scrumhalf at face value - at least this year he has an outhalf who played scrum half after his voice broke in the squad) injuries permitting and no-ones form falling off a cliff, I don't see too many changes from...

Rory Best
Sean Cronin
Niall Scannell
Tadhg Furlong
Cian Healy
Jack McGrath
Andrew Porter
Finlay Bealham
Iain Henderson
James Ryan
Tadhg Beirne
Devin Toner
CJ Stander
Dan Leavy
Seán O'Brien
Peter O'Mahony
Josh vd Flier
Conor Murray
Kieran Marmion
Ross Beirne
Joey Carbery
Jonathan Sexton
Gary Ringrose
Bundee Aki
Robbie Henshaw
Will Addison
Jacob Stockdale
Keith Earls
Andrew Conway
Jordan Larmour
Rob Kearney

He may decide to take a third scrum half, in which case I'd imagine one of the wingers will lose out as he has Addison - so McGrath in for either Conway or Larmour and I'd go out on a limb and say if he had to make that choice, Larmour would lose out.
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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby Twist » November 25th, 2018, 4:05 pm

On the locks, are Beirne and Henderson a little similar? I think there’s an argument for bringing a tighthead lock in the mould of Kleyn or Roux.

I’m not saying it’s necessarily a persuasive argument! But *if* all goes to plan we’ll find ourselves facing Etzebeth and Snyman. That’s a lot of grunt


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Re: The Ireland 23 for RWC

Postby Dave Cahill » November 25th, 2018, 6:01 pm

Twist wrote:On the locks, are Beirne and Henderson a little similar? I think there’s an argument for bringing a tighthead lock in the mould of Kleyn or Roux.

I’m not saying it’s necessarily a persuasive argument! But *if* all goes to plan we’ll find ourselves facing Etzebeth and Snyman. That’s a lot of grunt


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Its a good point, and I think Joe likes to have a guy like that in his squads when possible too - he really likes Roux as well. I just think that in terms of being limited numberswise Beirnes versitility will get him the nod over a Roux or a Kleyn
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