Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby Blueberry » March 17th, 2019, 10:30 am

brenno wrote:Everybody can have bad games and I can forgive them for those. But we really have to look at Sexton - not just because he's playing badly but because of his attitude. Nothing ever seems to be his fault, mouthing to his own team mates, generally behaving a spoiled bollix. That said you don't just go from world player of the year to muck just like that and maybe things will change - I hope to God they do. Right now in the NH, Anscombe, Biggar, Russell, Farrell (even after his sh1te display today v Scotland) are way ahead.


Will be very interesting to see Sexton back at Leinster in the coming weeks. He seems to be incredibly frustrated ATM in the Ireland setup and it's either frustration at the way he is playing, at selection policy and certain players performance levels or broader tactical and coaching decisions. He has always worn his heart on his sleeve and assuming he is not just frustrated at his own performance levels something is amiss. If he slots back in at Leinster and plays his socks off v Ulster and beyond as I believe he will it points to issues within the Ireland camp. Time will tell.
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby outcast eddie » March 17th, 2019, 10:34 am

Blueberry wrote:
brenno wrote:Everybody can have bad games and I can forgive them for those. But we really have to look at Sexton - not just because he's playing badly but because of his attitude. Nothing ever seems to be his fault, mouthing to his own team mates, generally behaving a spoiled bollix. That said you don't just go from world player of the year to muck just like that and maybe things will change - I hope to God they do. Right now in the NH, Anscombe, Biggar, Russell, Farrell (even after his sh1te display today v Scotland) are way ahead.


Will be very interesting to see Sexton back at Leinster in the coming weeks. He seems to be incredibly frustrated ATM in the Ireland setup and it's either frustration at the way he is playing, at selection policy and certain players performance levels or broader tactical and coaching decisions. He has always worn his heart on his sleeve and assuming he is not just frustrated at his own performance levels something is amiss. If he slots back in at Leinster and plays his socks off v Ulster and beyond as I believe he will it points to issues within the Ireland camp. Time will tell.


Sexton's malaise was evident with Leinster before the 6N.

I hope he shakes it off or we will see no trophy's this season.
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby ronk » March 17th, 2019, 10:48 am

outcast eddie wrote:
Sexton's malaise was evident with Leinster before the 6N.

I hope he shakes it off or we will see no trophy's this season.


Were there any games this is based on other than the one he was injured in?

Sexton has only played in the HC since September and that one unnecessary interpro that he normally skips.
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby Blueberry » March 17th, 2019, 11:19 am

Let's just wait and see......he is the best outhalf Ireland has ever produced, if he plays his socks off and leads us past Ulster and possibly to a fifth star I for one won't be surprised. Time will tell.
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby CiaranIrl » March 17th, 2019, 11:54 am

http://stats.espnscrum.com/scrum/rugby/ ... 95111.html

O'Mahony made one tackle all match?!
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby Oldschool » March 17th, 2019, 12:26 pm

A theory.
About 18 months ago we changed our defencive formation.
We did away with our sweeper.
We're Ireland and nobody paid that attention.
Allied to that Joe was at pains to mention that we defended narrowly and that was the policy.
A little white lie perhaps.
We won the GS beating a weakened England team and in a post Lions tour season, it happens ask the French.
Then we beat NZ.
Suddenly the world takes note.
Teams really start to analyse us.
Eddie spots the fact that we've no sweeper.
Ditto Gattie.
Park's try was as a result of not having a sweeper.
Murray got the flak but maybe.......
Joe must have realised that it was only a matter of time before the good coaches figured us out.
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby Oldschool » March 17th, 2019, 12:28 pm

CiaranIrl wrote:http://stats.espnscrum.com/scrum/rugby/match/295111.html

O'Mahony made one tackle all match?!

TBF it was two tackles.
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby LeRouxIsPHat » March 17th, 2019, 12:58 pm

CiaranIrl wrote:http://stats.espnscrum.com/scrum/rugby/match/295111.html

O'Mahony made one tackle all match?!


Not saying that's a good thing obviously but he got a couple of tunrovers and I don't think defence was our issue. It was the poor discipline and not being able to break Wales down that cost us. Apparently Wales only carried for 100m so to zero in on the number of tackles people made would be wrong IMO.

I thought some of those penalties were bad calls but jesus what were we doing with the stupid ones? It's not like there was pressure on us.
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby LeRouxIsPHat » March 17th, 2019, 1:09 pm

Joe mentioned people not having a lot of game time (think he was talking about Murray and Sexton) and think about that a bit more gives me a bit of hope going forward.

It sounds like an excuse but when you actually go through the whole team...

IIRC Best was injured at the start of the season and then again after November.

Dev was injured at the start of the year and seemed to be carrying it against England when he had to go off and then had surgery. Henderson injured before the tournament and only back in for the French game when he promptly got injured again. Tadgh Beirne in great form before the tournament but then picked up a knee injury that put him out for a few rounds, so not the best circumstances to make his first 6N appearance yesterday even though he did get some game time with Munster. Lots of chopping and changing in the second row because of the injuries which would obviously affect cohesion.

Leavy was our best player in the last 6N IMO but he was out injured. Stander broke his face early on against England and was then missing until last week. SOB had barely played for Leinster. Conan was in and then out again because of his injury.

Murray has had lots of games but clearly isn't as sharp as he needs to be and it's going to take time. Marmion and Luke had been the understudies before this tournament but were both injured until yesterday. Marmion obviously hasn't had much game time yet and would have only just been back in camp.

Johnny was out for 5/6 weeks before the tournament started. Joey was out injured after the Scotland game.

Henshaw was missing. Ringrose was injured in the England game and not back until last week.

Rob was injured just before the tournament so didn't have great prep going into it and then got injured again before the French game.

That's an awful of players who won't be as sharp as they could be and a lot of injuries that led to a lack of cohesion.
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby blaker » March 17th, 2019, 1:11 pm

I think the non replacements of the two halfbacks when both were so abject rests on who was on the bench rather than the pitch. Carberry is second choice outhalf while Marmion and McGrath are second and 3rd scrumhalves. Joe probably looked at it and said I’m better off sticking and hoping with these two because there’s no point putting game time into Carty or Cooney. I reckon if Marmion was there all tournament or Carberry you’d have seen both replaced very early or even dropped.

I think the backrow could well end up being Beirne 6 Leavy 7 and Conan 8. I can see keeping POM but just not sure stnder has anything beyond 101% commitment and carry while SOB looks like he’s run out of road.

Some lads have had great tournaments by not being there - Henshaw and Toner.
Some lads have had decent tournaments overall - Healy, Ryan, Kilcoyne, Stockdale, Kearney, Earls, Roux, Dillane
Some have had bad tournaments, either down to them, coaches or alternatives - Jack McG, Cronin, Ross Byrne

I could argue for Larmour over either Kearney or Earl’s - both played OK but aren’t exactly world class are they?
Dillane and Roux did Ok but again - element of the journeyman about both

We’ve a lot more questions now but ultimately if the 2 halfbacks play like this for another month or two we have a huge problem!’
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby outcast eddie » March 17th, 2019, 1:33 pm

ronk wrote:
outcast eddie wrote:
Sexton's malaise was evident with Leinster before the 6N.

I hope he shakes it off or we will see no trophy's this season.


Were there any games this is based on other than the one he was injured in?

Sexton has only played in the HC since September and that one unnecessary interpro that he normally skips.


It's the 'one unnecessary interpro' I'm talking about.
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby ribs » March 17th, 2019, 6:08 pm

Just a question- twice yesterday the ref reversed decisions after a replay on the screen. Neither were for foul play or try scoring nor pushed by assistants or tmo , and both were in Wales’ favour. I thought this was not allowed - the ref decision should stand? Should we replay everything like American football?
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby No23 » March 17th, 2019, 6:10 pm

It is interesting reading the criticism of Murray and to a lersser extent of Sexton on the site. In the majority of games it is the forwards who determine the advantage.
Unfortunately the Irish pack were very much 2nd best yesterday.Healy was a penalty machine. Best was worse than Cronin v Italy.Furlong is going through a bad spell.Beirne was poor and the the back row were anonymous.
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby Experimental » March 17th, 2019, 6:37 pm

Even a blind man can see Murray is playing really badly at the moment, Sexton acting like a spoilt child and blames eveyone but himself dissing your team mates in front of everyone just stinks tbh, does not have the cool head a captain needs and wont have the respect of his players if he keep going the way he is. O'Brien is sadly a shadow of his former self, never played well against wales, they always got the better of him over the years, I'd say gatland was delighted to see him on the team sheet ahead of the far far more dangerous and vital leavy. O'Mahony has been poor for some time and his once ina blue moon motm only papers over the cracks. Im convinced that stander is not an 8, he is a 6 at best and Conan should be our starting 8. I really do not understand why Murray got so much gametime over the other 9s in this tournament, Id be really pissed off if I was one of the other 9s. Bundee Aki has gotten very one dimensional and is showing nowhere near the skills hes shown for connacht in the past. Stockdale has gone missing, has anyone seen him? James Ryan is the only one who is allowed to hold his head high after this. The worst Ive ever seen from an Ireland team, shocking, truely shocking. Last week I read the french papers and they called it an utter humiliation, they scored two tries at the end and we could only manage one, so what does that say about us ...
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby tomthefan » March 17th, 2019, 6:57 pm

Hard to know what happened yesterday. I'd be inclined to put it down to the virus that was supposedly going around in the camp last week. No fear of over confidence at the world cup anyway. Hopefully the provinces can put this behind them in two weeks
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby tomthefan » March 17th, 2019, 7:02 pm

The world cup seems to really fcuk with Ireland. We have cr@p tournaments and the season after one we're usually poor and now it looks like we're poor the season before as well. I kind of wish it didn't exist
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby ronk » March 17th, 2019, 7:56 pm

outcast eddie wrote:
ronk wrote:
outcast eddie wrote:
Sexton's malaise was evident with Leinster before the 6N.

I hope he shakes it off or we will see no trophy's this season.


Were there any games this is based on other than the one he was injured in?

Sexton has only played in the HC since September and that one unnecessary interpro that he normally skips.


It's the 'one unnecessary interpro' I'm talking about.


That's a trend with 1 data point.
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby Ruckedtobits » March 17th, 2019, 11:49 pm

In September 2016 Anthony Buchanan, former Wales & Llanelli prop forward was appointed as Chairman of the World Rugby Referee Selection Committee in succession to Scotland's John Jeffries. He is joined on that Committee by such illustrious rugby personages as Nick Mallett and former referees Lyndon Brae & Joel Jutge. In reality however, Irishman Alain Rolland is the World Rugby Referee Supremo.

Between the Referee Tzar, Rolland, and his World Rugby Committee colleagues, this Season (2018-19) they have produced some of the most flawed and inconsistent refereeing displays seen since the 6 Nations Competition started.

Saturday's 2nd half performance by Australian Aungus Gardiner will be near the top of any Rap Sheet of incorrect decisions, but will not be the only one. Pepyer (S.A.), O'Keeffe (N.Z.) and Berry (Aus) have also disappointed hugely by the inconsistency of their decisions throughout this 6N.

The three top French refs have appeared far more comfortable with the intensity of forward-oriented European rugby whilst Wayne Barnes has been head and shoulders above the rest for consistency and use of the TMO. The world's former top whistler, Nigel Owens has become a parody as he creates law interpretation which sound logical, but are often not the current Laws of Rugby.

Gardiner's second-half display in Wales v Ireland bordered on the farcical as he largely ignored offside at the breakdowns, but insisted in instructing scrum-halves to use ball from mauls which were still moving forward or hadn't actually formed. There were 25 Welsh offside infringements at different breakdowns which were ignored or overlooked in 40 minutes, whilst clear knock-ons and interference with the scrum half went unpunished on six occasions within 40 minutes.

If even one significent RWC game suffers the same incompetence, the Tournament will be in danger of being brought into disrepute.

Ireland were inept in many respects against Wales. However, in a game of complex Laws, with very specific interpretations of those Laws laid down in writing, it behoves World Rugby to select Referees with the competence and experience to apply the Laws equitably. Whether Gardner was overawed by the (highly-charged) emotional atmosphere of the occasion, or whether he is just incompetent or inexperienced, matters not a jot. His display was flawed and marred the contest.

Chairman Buchanan, as a Welshman, may not agree with this overview, as his countrymen bask in their magnificent achievement. But if Gatland's men had been beaten by a team which infringed as much as Wales did on Saturday, he and many other of his Welsh colleagues would be up in arms seeking change.

Refereeing has become a task which very few individuals can discharge competently at competitive international games. World Rugby must consider two on-field officials for top games, or risk watching their game fall into disrepute and controversy.

As for Rolland, he should stop retiring referees whose style he doesn't like and retain those officials the players trust and who have demonstrated high competence and independence in front of large audiences of totally biased fans. Nobody said its easy so give the top Refs some real assistance on field. There were 9 officials involved in Saturday's game. At least one more of them should have been on-field, policing nothing but off-side of the team not in possession.
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby desperado » March 18th, 2019, 12:26 am

Agreed. I've said it before, several times that the lack of policing of offside is becoming a blight on the game. The ARs no 1 brief should be policing of same. They should be best placed to do so.
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Re: Wales v Ireland 2019 6N (The Match)

Postby neiliog93 » March 18th, 2019, 1:34 am

Ruckedtobits wrote:In September 2016 Anthony Buchanan, former Wales & Llanelli prop forward was appointed as Chairman of the World Rugby Referee Selection Committee in succession to Scotland's John Jeffries. He is joined on that Committee by such illustrious rugby personages as Nick Mallett and former referees Lyndon Brae & Joel Jutge. In reality however, Irishman Alain Rolland is the World Rugby Referee Supremo.

Between the Referee Tzar, Rolland, and his World Rugby Committee colleagues, this Season (2018-19) they have produced some of the most flawed and inconsistent refereeing displays seen since the 6 Nations Competition started.

Saturday's 2nd half performance by Australian Aungus Gardiner will be near the top of any Rap Sheet of incorrect decisions, but will not be the only one. Pepyer (S.A.), O'Keeffe (N.Z.) and Berry (Aus) have also disappointed hugely by the inconsistency of their decisions throughout this 6N.

The three top French refs have appeared far more comfortable with the intensity of forward-oriented European rugby whilst Wayne Barnes has been head and shoulders above the rest for consistency and use of the TMO. The world's former top whistler, Nigel Owens has become a parody as he creates law interpretation which sound logical, but are often not the current Laws of Rugby.

Gardiner's second-half display in Wales v Ireland bordered on the farcical as he largely ignored offside at the breakdowns, but insisted in instructing scrum-halves to use ball from mauls which were still moving forward or hadn't actually formed. There were 25 Welsh offside infringements at different breakdowns which were ignored or overlooked in 40 minutes, whilst clear knock-ons and interference with the scrum half went unpunished on six occasions within 40 minutes.

If even one significent RWC game suffers the same incompetence, the Tournament will be in danger of being brought into disrepute.

Ireland were inept in many respects against Wales. However, in a game of complex Laws, with very specific interpretations of those Laws laid down in writing, it behoves World Rugby to select Referees with the competence and experience to apply the Laws equitably. Whether Gardner was overawed by the (highly-charged) emotional atmosphere of the occasion, or whether he is just incompetent or inexperienced, matters not a jot. His display was flawed and marred the contest.

Chairman Buchanan, as a Welshman, may not agree with this overview, as his countrymen bask in their magnificent achievement. But if Gatland's men had been beaten by a team which infringed as much as Wales did on Saturday, he and many other of his Welsh colleagues would be up in arms seeking change.

Refereeing has become a task which very few individuals can discharge competently at competitive international games. World Rugby must consider two on-field officials for top games, or risk watching their game fall into disrepute and controversy.

As for Rolland, he should stop retiring referees whose style he doesn't like and retain those officials the players trust and who have demonstrated high competence and independence in front of large audiences of totally biased fans. Nobody said its easy so give the top Refs some real assistance on field. There were 9 officials involved in Saturday's game. At least one more of them should have been on-field, policing nothing but off-side of the team not in possession.


Very good post.
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