simonokeeffe wrote: youd imagine Zebo was the prime candidate for a centralised back 3 contract,
You might, I don't think anyone else thought so - when everyone else is fit he's only ahead of Gilroy and Healy in the pecking order going on Joe's selection history of picking almost anybody else ahead of him every chance he gets.
I'm with Simon [O'Keefe, not Zebo] – I would have seen him as an important figure for Ireland over the next number of years. I think it's odd to say that the only people he'd be ahead of are Gilroy and Healy ... he was more or less a fixture in the team last season.
By my count, Zebo has started 12 of our last 15 Six Nations games - more than Rob Kearney [11], Andrew Trimble [10], or Keith Earls [9]. He started both games against the All Blacks and the game against Australia in November 2016, and all the games of the 2017 Six Nations.
simonokeeffe wrote: youd imagine Zebo was the prime candidate for a centralised back 3 contract,
You might, I don't think anyone else thought so - when everyone else is fit he's only ahead of Gilroy and Healy in the pecking order going on Joe's selection history of picking almost anybody else ahead of him every chance he gets.
I'm with Simon [O'Keefe, not Zebo] – I would have seen him as an important figure for Ireland over the next number of years. I think it's odd to say that the only people he'd be ahead of are Gilroy and Healy ... he was more or less a fixture in the team last season.
By my count, Zebo has started 12 of our last 15 Six Nations games - more than Rob Kearney [11], Andrew Trimble [10], or Keith Earls [9]. He started both games against the All Blacks and the game against Australia in November 2016, and all the games of the 2017 Six Nations.
When both Kearneys, Trimble, Earls and Bowe were all or mostly hors de combat I would suggest. In 2014 he played no 6 Nations rugby because those wing wizards, Dave Kearney, Andrew Trimble and Fergus McFadden were fit, in 2015 he played in all but the final match, when anybody else (luke in this case) returned to fitness. Finally, if he were considered an important figure for Ireland over the next number of years, he'd have been kept. Much as I'd love to add this departure as grist to my 'what does nucifora actually do' mill, i just don't think Joe Schmidt really cared all that much
I dunno Dave, his display against New Zealand in Chicago was very, very good. I can remember he and Schmidt celebrating and the mood music to me said Zebo had made a jump with Ireland. He has played most games since then when fit and Ireland have looked to use that pass of his a lot when attacking the left side of the pitch. He is a loss and definitely a surprise to me. I thought he would go, but not until after the World Cup. And I don’t think this has much to do with Nucifora at all in any case. I think Zebo wanted to do this at some point in his career and he has chosen now as the time. Fair enough, but that’s the surprising bit to me. Maybe more info will come out in the wash.
Zebo has definitely worked on his rucking
He has definitely risen in the pecking order
Plus Munster's influence on IRFU cant be ruled out
Munster statement said they and the IRFU did all they could to keep him so for me the implication is he was offered a central contract not a free set of steak knives
Connacht and Ulster have no one in back 3 in line for a new or fresh central. We have RK shakily and it was or is too early to say Carberry (same with Stockdale). So Earls and maybe RK definitely leaves a gap.
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It's a real pity for Ireland but I wouldn't begrudge any player the opportunity to pile up mountains of cash and make like a super villain in his lair. And while the perception is that he wasn't fancied by Schmidt I don't think the stats actually show that bar near the start of Schmidt's tenure. Dave Kearney and Trimble had moments of favour but Zebo way ahead of the likes of them and Rob Kearney hasn't played regularly in a long time. Can't see him regaining his Irish jersey.
It's good news for Andrew Conway though who has been in really strong form and increasingly unfortunate to only be on the bench.
It's a loss for Munster but looking at the big picture there are plenty of back 3 options with more coming through the academy so it's a position Munster can afford to lose a player.
As for Ireland, I'm not sure it's a great loss. Maybe it's the way Ireland play but Zebo has scored 9 tries but only 1 in a major tournament. Compare that to Earls' 16 in major tournaments, Bowe 18, Trimble 9 etc.
I think Stockdale will get a central contract when his contract runs out because there'll be a load of clubs after him.
To perform a demi volte face the Indo journalists are saying he wasnt offered a central but IRFU were going to contribute and there was private funding sourced too
Maybe Ringrose is getting the only new backline central deal next summer
Munster should target Larmour. We should bump him up to a full deal
Retired from babbling. Can be found on twittter @okeeffesimon
When both Kearneys, Trimble, Earls and Bowe were all or mostly hors de combat I would suggest. In 2014 he played no 6 Nations rugby because those wing wizards, Dave Kearney, Andrew Trimble and Fergus McFadden were fit, in 2015 he played in all but the final match, when anybody else (luke in this case) returned to fitness. Finally, if he were considered an important figure for Ireland over the next number of years, he'd have been kept. Much as I'd love to add this departure as grist to my 'what does nucifora actually do' mill, i just don't think Joe Schmidt really cared all that much
While I agree there is a bit of competition for the spot, the above is not really fair Dave.
He has gone up the pecking order since 2014 - most likely would have been the starter in 6N's 2018. Bowe, Trimble and at least half the Kearneys are past the their best now, and the next generation are a still a little bit away.
Money wise good move for him but I'd worry about the effect the somewhat lax strength, conditioning and diet regime will have on him. He'll make a good career over there but reckon he's done in green by the time he might come back he'll be another few years older and the next layer of talent will be coming through academies.
Zebo has averaged more than eight tries a season for them for the last six seasons in a row. I'm not saying this in a particularly snippy way , but he's been a bigger deal for Munster than Ireland ... because he has been an absolutely enormous deal for Munster. I'm pretty sure that he became their all-time leading try scorer when he was still 26 years old.
He also played a lot of games for them: 125 matches for his province to go along with his 35 tests for Ireland. That's about 20 more games than Murray has played and 30 more than O'Mahony has played, and they're both older than him.
According to Gerry Thornley in the Irish Times, the IRFU's contract offer was good, but the one from Racing was outstanding:
"It is understood that the substantially increased offer from Munster was in the region of €350,000 and along with match fees and bonuses with Ireland, this could have risen to about €400,000. The Irish Times has learned that the offer from Racing is in the region of €650,000 to €700,000, and quite probably with accommodation and a car."
olaf the fat wrote:
While I agree there is a bit of competition for the spot, the above is not really fair Dave.
He has gone up the pecking order since 2014 - most likely would have been the starter in 6N's 2018. Bowe, Trimble and at least half the Kearneys are past the their best now, and the next generation are a still a little bit away.
I would disagree with that, I would suggest that as things stand Earls, Stockdale and Carbery will be the starting back three
hugonaut wrote:
"It is understood that the substantially increased offer from Munster was in the region of €350,000 and along with match fees and bonuses with Ireland, this could have risen to about €400,000. The Irish Times has learned that the offer from Racing is in the region of €650,000 to €700,000, and quite probably with accommodation and a car."
That is a serious amount of cash if true, a couple of years there and he would earn twice as much as what he would earn in Ireland without the worry that an injury could see the next contract be withdrawn or severely diminished, the money would be banked. Good luck to the guy.
Before the 2017 six nations Zebo was on fire and I thought that tournament would finally bring him to another level for Ireland. He was fine but I was underwhelmed by him he looked slower then usual and unsure of himself. He finished out the season with Munster in similar fashion. Maybe a change in scenery will help him to get back to where he wants to be. This season it seems he is ahead of Conway at Munster because he is Simon Zebo not because he is a better player.
"Horrocks went one way, Taylor the other and I was left holding the bloody hyphen!"
dropkick wrote:It's a loss for Munster but looking at the big picture there are plenty of back 3 options with more coming through the academy so it's a position Munster can afford to lose a player.
As for Ireland, I'm not sure it's a great loss. Maybe it's the way Ireland play but Zebo has scored 9 tries but only 1 in a major tournament. Compare that to Earls' 16 in major tournaments, Bowe 18, Trimble 9 etc.
I think Stockdale will get a central contract when his contract runs out because there'll be a load of clubs after him.
Think you're about spot on here. Great loss to the Irish rugby watching community as there's no doubt he is great entertainment, but 1 try in the 6N's? Not good enough to be certain of selection if players like Stockdale continue to show improvement.
Rumour is that O'Holloran is moving south to replace him. To my mind he's a better fullback and with some of the talent Munster have coming through this might just work out for them .
"POC will not be going to Toulon" - All Blacks nil » May 27th, 2015, 12:18 am
hugonaut wrote:I'm pretty sure that he became their all-time leading try scorer when he was still 26 years old.
I think he's still 3 off Axel Foley, no?
“As you all know first prize is a Cadillac El Dorado. Anyone wanna see second prize? Second prize is a set of steak knives. Third prize is you're fired.”
OTT wrote:Before the 2017 six nations Zebo was on fire and I thought that tournament would finally bring him to another level for Ireland. He was fine but I was underwhelmed by him he looked slower then usual and unsure of himself.
Was he injured for the 2017 Six Nations? I thought he was injured but still played, I noticed in one or two of the games that he had some sort of strapping around his midriff.
700k a year for Zebo is crazy money and almost impossible to turn down
we can expect PRL to complain about it now
Gerry's latest love letter is positively gushing "Gerry Thornley: Zebo loss lessens Ireland's X factor"
Citing the behind his back pass to Earls; if he had passed normally the pass would have been easier to catch and may have then be a try scoring pass not fluff for a highlight reel
Retired from babbling. Can be found on twittter @okeeffesimon
