Pro 12 - General Thread

[simonokeeffe]

Jackman new head coach of Dragons

Youd think theyd have learnt their lesson about Irish coaches

[Dave Cahill]

A lot of your figures though aren't really that accurate

Just as an example

all in all I doubt the impact would be much more than 1M per province per season

Leinster generate well over 6 million euro in revenue from the two Aviva games. So you're over 5 million out there for a start.

Corporate stuff is maybe another 50-100k. That's a guess but I doubt there's huge demand around these matches.

There is actually a very high demand around these matches from the SME sector. Reduced prices has increased demand from companies who can't afford to run a package for customers at one of the 'big' games but can afford to do so at a fixture like this - after all most of the 'corporate' attendees don't care about the game, just 'the do'.

I'm not sure what you're getting at when you talk about Leinster's revenue from Aviva games. The 1M was a bottom up rough estimate of the reduction in ticket, sponsorship/advertising, TV and corporate revenue of not having the Italians in the league. The Aviva matches wouldn't be affected in the slightest by dropping Treviso and Zebre.

I may have underestimated the corporate stuff but how high can it be for each of those games? There's only so many boxes etc.

I also didn't knock anything off to account for the savings so I don't think that, when everything is weighed up, 1M per province would be far off. 9M - 2.25 per province - looks like a massive overestimate. Where did you get that from?

Without Treviso and Zebre (or if the league lost any two teams) there would be no Aviva games - Leinster are committed to playing 12 home games per season in the RDS, Munster also have a minimum commitment to Irish Independent Park of four games per season.

So thats well over 6 million from the Aviva gone, plus the say, 900k in ticket revenue from TP for the games against those two teams, plus 1.2m from themmuns and 400k from the westies plus whatever revenues Munster, Ulster and Connacht generate on top of tickets.

Then you have to take out the two italian games from the RDS and add in two pretty high profile matches instead - Munster would sell out in the RDS and Wasps in the RDS last year got just over 16.5k, so 500k increase in total revenue there.

Surprisingly little of the corporate stuff happens in the Boxes, and its certainly not limited by their number - its pretty much limited only by how many people you can seat for a dinner - and for a ground like TP or the RDS with on-site dining and plenty of room to put up rigid marquee structures (nevermind neighbouring hotels), that number is huge

[rooster]

Ulster would lift around £1 million on the 2 matches, you would have to factor in sponsorship though as at present sponsors get their boards on BBC or Sky for every home match of that dropped by 2 then I assume some would factor that in at renewal

[simonokeeffe]

Going by more reliable sources of rumours something is definitely happening by way of expansion and or conferences this summer, no games same weekends as regular tests too

[blockhead]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/40251712

BBC report, not saying very much really.
Apart from the fact that the Pro12 is chyte compared to the "Prestige" of the English premiership.

[dropkick]

http://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/40251712

BBC report, not saying very much really.
Apart from the fact that the Pro12 is chyte compared to the "Prestige" of the English premiership.

The premiership is so prestigious that Saracens sacrificed it to win the champions cup.


As for the pro12, lots of South African news sites starting to talk about it now. They seem to think its a done deal.
http://www.rnews.co.za/article/14958/so ... nvolvement

[Dave Cahill]

None of the rugby correspondents in the national or big provincial papers or their sites are talking about it at all. Did you actually read the very poorly written piece you linked to? Reports about reports quoting the same single BBC Scotland piece as everyone else.

[Dave Cahill]

Newport Gwent Dragons are now officially, as of today, Dragons.

[simonokeeffe]

Newport Gwent Dragons are now officially, as of today, Dragons.

a pile of dung by any other name

[paddyor]

Zebre bankrupt. Being taken over by FIR....doesn't say where new Zebre will be

In relation to what has been published in recent days by the national press on the situation of Zebre Rugby, the Rugby Italian Federation intends to point out that the formation of a new company, which will retain the name Zebra, has already been resolved by the Federal Council and will be formalized in next days.

The new Company will be fully part of the Federation with the aim of respecting existing agreements and guaranteeing the participation of two Italian teams at the Guinness PRO12 until 2020.

It is also stated that, in order to ensure the smooth continuation of the relationship with athletes and staff currently active in the franchise, the contacts for the sale of the related contracts to the new entity, fully owned by the FIR, are in the process of being defined.

Therefore, the speculations about the recruitment by foreign companies of athletes under contracts with Zebre Rugby are devoid of any foundation.

[neiliog93]

What a mess. Throw them out. They and Treviso have cheapened the league and 'the development of Italian rugby' line is bull, it hasn't happened.

[ronk]

Meh, I'd see this as a positive development. They'll probably be stronger under the Federation and will have more incentive to develop players

[Dave Cahill]

Zebre bankrupt. Being taken over by FIR....doesn't say where new Zebre will be

In relation to what has been published in recent days by the national press on the situation of Zebre Rugby, the Rugby Italian Federation intends to point out that the formation of a new company, which will retain the name Zebra, has already been resolved by the Federal Council and will be formalized in next days.

The new Company will be fully part of the Federation with the aim of respecting existing agreements and guaranteeing the participation of two Italian teams at the Guinness PRO12 until 2020.

It is also stated that, in order to ensure the smooth continuation of the relationship with athletes and staff currently active in the franchise, the contacts for the sale of the related contracts to the new entity, fully owned by the FIR, are in the process of being defined.

Therefore, the speculations about the recruitment by foreign companies of athletes under contracts with Zebre Rugby are devoid of any foundation.

Zebre were already 100% owned by the FIR - had been from the outset. This is merely admin. I'd say they're looking to move the team from Parma.

[simonokeeffe]

Treviso were competitive (well good home record) until the chairman threatened to withdraw his funding and all their good players left

[rooster]

Treviso were competitive (well good home record) until the chairman threatened to withdraw his funding and all their good players left

That was a problem that the FIR were putting more resources and cash into Zebre and just expecting the Benetton family to pay all for Treviso, then the fee to participate added to their grievances so you could see his point, just unfortunately team was wrecked before it was resolved.
There was serious talk of a franchise in Rome with private funding so whether that has come on board or that is chucked out due to the wording of the FIR statement will determine where the franchise stays. At present I would put a small wager on Parma retaining it this year at least.

[rooster]

Zebre bankrupt. Being taken over by FIR....doesn't say where new Zebre will be

In relation to what has been published in recent days by the national press on the situation of Zebre Rugby, the Rugby Italian Federation intends to point out that the formation of a new company, which will retain the name Zebra, has already been resolved by the Federal Council and will be formalized in next days.

The new Company will be fully part of the Federation with the aim of respecting existing agreements and guaranteeing the participation of two Italian teams at the Guinness PRO12 until 2020.

It is also stated that, in order to ensure the smooth continuation of the relationship with athletes and staff currently active in the franchise, the contacts for the sale of the related contracts to the new entity, fully owned by the FIR, are in the process of being defined.

Therefore, the speculations about the recruitment by foreign companies of athletes under contracts with Zebre Rugby are devoid of any foundation.

Zebre were already 100% owned by the FIR - had been from the outset. This is merely admin. I'd say they're looking to move the team from Parma.

The chat was Rome with private finance but that statement tends to go against that bit like all things these days money talks and FIR will go where they see best financial gain.

[Dave Cahill]

They should move to Milan, biggest city in the region where rugby is at its most popular

[paddyor]

They should move to Milan, biggest city in the region where rugby is at its most popular

No were to facilitate them apparently, which seems mad.

[Dave Cahill]

They should move to Milan, biggest city in the region where rugby is at its most popular

No were to facilitate them apparently, which seems mad.

Considering that theres a civic multisports stadium and a velodrome with a pitch inside the track, both in Milan, it is a bit mad alright!

[rooster]

They should move to Milan, biggest city in the region where rugby is at its most popular

No were to facilitate them apparently, which seems mad.

Ulster played a Heineken cup match in Milan, it was near Monza and a soccer ground, I would rate Reggio Emilia a better spot than Milan and it was muted a few years ago, it's a big Rugby region but they struggle with fans as they still relate to their old clubs a bit like the Welsh.