European Champions Cup [Most Improved]

[neill_m]

Next week's tv listings for the Quarter Finals in both Euro competitions:

Friday 30th March

5:30pm Scarlets v La Rochelle BT Sport
8pm Pau v Stade Francais BT Sport
8pm Newcastle v Brive Sky Sports

Saturday 31st March

1pm Connacht v Gloucester BT Sport
3:15pm Munster v Toulon Sky Sports
5:45pm Edinburgh v Cardiff Sky Sports

Sunday 1st April

1pm Clermont Auvergne v Racing 92 Sky Sports
3:30pm Leinster v Saracens BT Sport

TG4 have highlights on the Saturday (8:50pm) and Sunday (7:30pm).

[neill_m]

Next week's tv listings for the Quarter Finals in both Euro competitions:

Friday 30th March

5:30pm Scarlets v La Rochelle BT Sport
8pm Pau v Stade Francais BT Sport
8pm Newcastle v Brive Sky Sports

Saturday 31st March

1pm Connacht v Gloucester BT Sport
3:15pm Munster v Toulon Sky Sports
5:45pm Edinburgh v Cardiff Sky Sports

Sunday 1st April

1pm Clermont Auvergne v Racing 92 Sky Sports
3:30pm Leinster v Saracens BT Sport

TG4 have highlights on the Saturday (8:50pm) and Sunday (7:30pm).

Bump

[paddyor]

Apparently Heidelberg who qualified for the Challenge cup have been disqualified by EPRC because the owner Hans Peter Bild also owns Stade Francais. They also barred Altrad(Montpellier) from taking over Gloucester. Lots of people asking why aren't the SRU and IRFU similarly restricted.

[neill_m]

Apparently Heidelberg who qualified for the Challenge cup have been disqualified by EPRC because the owner Hans Peter Bild also owns Stade Francais. They also barred Altrad(Montpellier) from taking over Gloucester. Lots of people asking why aren't the SRU and IRFU similarly restricted.

Crazy situation. Herr Wild doesn’t own Heidelberg but is their primary financial backer.

My question is why did the EPCR only act now? By March it was pretty clear Stade would at best be in the Challenge Cup with Heidelberg in the last 4 of the Shield. Almost like they didn’t expect this situation to happen.

Don’t buy the argument. The Cup is a distraction to Stade next season and they will play the 2s. Heidelberg could gain great experience.

[jimbobjoe]

The Guardian understands there is a desire in certain influential quarters to reduce the number of competing sides in the Champions Cup from 20 to 16. Only the top five sides each year from the respective three European-based leagues, plus the winners of the previous season’s Challenge Cup, would earn entry. The idea is to make the competition more cut-throat and, theoretically, attractive by ensuring more big matches rather than as opposed to flooding European weekends with wall-to-wall, occasionally mediocre fixtures.

Sweet Jebus - please tell me this isn't about to kick off again

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/ ... g-cvc-275m

[Laighin Break]

The Guardian understands there is a desire in certain influential quarters to reduce the number of competing sides in the Champions Cup from 20 to 16. Only the top five sides each year from the respective three European-based leagues, plus the winners of the previous season’s Challenge Cup, would earn entry. The idea is to make the competition more cut-throat and, theoretically, attractive by ensuring more big matches rather than as opposed to flooding European weekends with wall-to-wall, occasionally mediocre fixtures.

Sweet Jebus - please tell me this isn't about to kick off again

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/ ... g-cvc-275m

Sure it's the english clubs that are providing the mediocre opposition

[Blue not red blood]

Think the warm summer must have got to them.
just when you think they couldnt be more deluded

[BlueBlue]

The Guardian understands there is a desire in certain influential quarters to reduce the number of competing sides in the Champions Cup from 20 to 16. Only the top five sides each year from the respective three European-based leagues, plus the winners of the previous season’s Challenge Cup, would earn entry. The idea is to make the competition more cut-throat and, theoretically, attractive by ensuring more big matches rather than as opposed to flooding European weekends with wall-to-wall, occasionally mediocre fixtures.

Sweet Jebus - please tell me this isn't about to kick off again

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/ ... g-cvc-275m

That's one crack pot article. But yes, this will kick off again. When your in bed with the English and to some extent the French there will always be tension. Based on them thinking might is right, you should shut up because we know best and arrogance of proportions and magnitude hard to imagine. And also, because they are simply on a different system. We the Pro14 are unions, they are club owners. Steel and clay pretending to mix. The English and French have an agenda to expand there own leagues, to maximise their money, they lose 30m a year sometimes more. They will look to expand their league by reducing Europe or even the 6N's. We the Pro14 on the other hand have expanded our league but have moved to a conference system to contain it time wise, but to ensure its future we will need for the SA teams to be allowed, on merit qualify for Europe through the Pro14. This time we are ready for the fight however, because with our expanded league we can survive / fill a season of fixtures without the European cup. We don't want this, and it would be a set back, but it is possible. Last time it was not. Last time the Welsh clubs also wagged the Welsh dog. This time it is the welsh union who have control of the players through combined contracts. Also the South African union will become a full board member of Pro14 in early 2019. Following that the remaining 2 SA franchises, will join the Pro16 for the start of 2019 / 20 season. We are coming into being in a very very strong position in terms of our league being the vested interest of 5 tier-1 nation Unions.

[blockhead]

There is growing pressure from the players to have their gametime reduced. The club owners want more of a return from the game they invested in, so reducing the number of league games is a no no as far as they are concerned. Hence the constant pressure from them to reduce the international windows, as seen in their attempt to reduce the 6N window. Reducing the Heino even further would facilitate the player gametime reduction without affecting their league. Hey Presto.
European rugby is being controlled by the english club owners and their desire for a return on their investments.
The last change had the desired affect, Pro12 teams went back to being what Prem teams expected them to be, also rans.
Of course it didn't last long, 3 out of 4 semi-finalists and the Challenge cup winners to boot last season. Leinster got E900,000 for the semi and final win, and of course a big QF payday. That money would have taken a nice chunk out of any of the prem clubs deficits recently published.
Yes, here we go again.
CVCs offer will be rejected, the offer will be increased and then accepted. CVC will want a return on their investment.

[blockhead]

Offer rejected.

[ronk]

Cut throat isn’t supposed to be cut your own throat

[Oldschool]

So let's reduce the number of teams in the HC to reduce the number of games teams have to play in a season.
Seems reasonable given the wear and tear on players.
Wait a minute didn't they already reduce the number of teams from 24 to 20.
What happened to those 4 teams.
Ah yes they ended up in the Challenge where guess what they played the same number of games as they would have, had they competed in the HC.
There might be a few differences around the edges but not too much.
Talk of reducing the number of competing teams is financial suicide.
Growing the competition should be the goal.
In reality the club owners (English in particular) want to take over the 6Ns and pocket the profits.
They just haven't figured out how to do it.

[paddyor]

It's all a bit desperate isn't it? Going back to what Dave Cahill said about the 51% equity stake, once that's gone they lose control. There musn't be a debt option available to them, IIRC Wasps got in a bit trouble with their bondholders recently(the coupon is nearly 7%) plus the reporting requirements are a bit more stringent. But even thinking about the equity deal, it'd probably leave them with a shorfall of 1.5-2m a year in TV and spnsorship revenue for c17m up front. They'd need to increase matchday revenue by that much (3-6k increased attendances per team) to cover the shortfall as they're already locked into their current main TV deals for the foreseeable future.

I wonder how much of this is spurred by the P14 upping it's TV money to c30m a year.

[Oldschool]

Cut throat isn’t supposed to be cut your own throat

Bite your own nose etc is probably the proverb you're looking for but with PRL you're never sure.

[rooster]

Their TV revenue could well fall at the next renewal unless Sky try and outbid BT Sports. The AP is unsustainable with present losses for most yet Exeter can manage so why not others ?

[johng]

They go easy on the "marquee signings"

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Yeah the marquee signings thing is a joke. The whole thing is so badly run. It's Trumpesque in the way that they don't care how much money is going out as long as there appears to be lots coming in.

[Dave Cahill]

[BlueBlue]

Red white and blue, just like the British and French flags.

[blockhead]

Red white and blue, just like the British and French flags.

Throw a bit of yeller in there for good measure