Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to terminate?

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Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to terminate their contracts?

Right
32
55%
Wrong
25
43%
Don't know/No opinion
1
2%
 
Total votes : 58

Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to terminate?

Postby El Diablo » April 17th, 2018, 6:56 pm

Obviously this is a very simplistic poll but I am curious.......
Last edited by El Diablo on April 17th, 2018, 7:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby Xanthippe » April 17th, 2018, 6:58 pm

Ah come on El Diablo - if you ask a double sided question you make it very difficult to answer
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby Oldschool » April 17th, 2018, 7:09 pm

At this point it's done and dusted and it's only going to generate more negativity so I won't be voting.
The Ulster fans and STH are the ones that are going to do the real voting in any event.
BTW being pedantic a 'yes' vote means they were both right and wrong.
A 'no' means they were both wrong and right.
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby tomthefan » April 17th, 2018, 7:14 pm

They've been run out of the country for scandalising the moral majority.
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby El Diablo » April 17th, 2018, 7:14 pm

Xanthippe wrote:Ah come on El Diablo - if you ask a double sided question you make it very difficult to answer

:oops:
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby RAILWAY1 » April 17th, 2018, 7:19 pm

The termination of the contracts was a necessary but very unfortunate consequence of the fallout from the court case and it's publicity. I am not saying the IRFU was right morally to revoke the contracts but in the professional era they have to be seen to act in order to placate sponsors who are vital to our game unfortunately.
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby leinsterforever » April 17th, 2018, 8:40 pm

Sold down the river based on perception rather than reality would be my view on the overall situation.

It's hard to have a definitive opinion on how the IRFU acted because we don't know precisely what sponsors said behind closed doors, but I would hope they fought the players' corner strongly
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Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to terminate?

Postby artaneboy » April 17th, 2018, 9:42 pm

leinsterforever wrote:Sold down the river based on perception rather than reality would be my view on the overall situation.

It's hard to have a definitive opinion on how the IRFU acted because we don't know precisely what sponsors said behind closed doors, but I would hope they fought the players' corner strongly


Not voting either- for the same reason as Old School.

But just one question- do you really believe that IRFU “fought the player’s corner strongly”? The departure may have been inevitable based on the realpolitik- but unfair as I think it was, the Unions could have facilitated that without the implication of guilt being radiated out...


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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby leinsterforever » April 17th, 2018, 10:00 pm

artaneboy wrote:
leinsterforever wrote:Sold down the river based on perception rather than reality would be my view on the overall situation.

It's hard to have a definitive opinion on how the IRFU acted because we don't know precisely what sponsors said behind closed doors, but I would hope they fought the players' corner strongly


Not voting either- for the same reason as Old School.

But just one question- do you really believe that IRFU “fought the player’s corner strongly”? The departure may have been inevitable based on the realpolitik- but unfair as I think it was, the Unions could have facilitated that without the implication of guilt being radiated out...


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I have no reason to believe that the IRFU did all they could to retain the two players
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby olaf the fat » April 18th, 2018, 7:16 am

artaneboy wrote:
leinsterforever wrote:Sold down the river based on perception rather than reality would be my view on the overall situation.

It's hard to have a definitive opinion on how the IRFU acted because we don't know precisely what sponsors said behind closed doors, but I would hope they fought the players' corner strongly


Not voting either- for the same reason as Old School.

But just one question- do you really believe that IRFU “fought the player’s corner strongly”? The departure may have been inevitable based on the realpolitik- but unfair as I think it was, the Unions could have facilitated that without the implication of guilt being radiated out...


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Very good point there, the irfu actions do (and wrongly so) implicate guilt. This could of been handled a lot better to give fairness for all.
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby Ruckedtobits » April 18th, 2018, 8:08 am

Very difficult to vote on this stark question.

IRFU almost certainly would have suffered sponsor loss and a very pressured environment with media and protesters for a 6-12 month period if players were retained. Players would also have had a very difficult time if they had stayed.

Key question for me is how long the exile will last. I would support their return to Ireland AND the green jersey, say after 3 years. Anything else would be extreme and wrong
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby blockhead » April 18th, 2018, 8:31 am

Ruckedtobits wrote:Very difficult to vote on this stark question.

IRFU almost certainly would have suffered sponsor loss and a very pressured environment with media and protesters for a 6-12 month period if players were retained. Players would also have had a very difficult time if they had stayed.

Key question for me is how long the exile will last. I would support their return to Ireland AND the green jersey, say after 3 years. Anything else would be extreme and wrong


Logan (The War Hero), implied it was for good. I assume that when the IRFU, pressurised by BOI, insisted on them being fired they had to agree that it was for Ireland too.
We will never see them back.
Think about that, Bank of Ireland, a company without morals, passing judgement on someone else. When you here of the testimony's of people who had money and home's stolen by that organisation. Could we not associate ourselves with someone better.
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby tomthefan » April 18th, 2018, 8:47 am

blockhead wrote:
Ruckedtobits wrote:Very difficult to vote on this stark question.

IRFU almost certainly would have suffered sponsor loss and a very pressured environment with media and protesters for a 6-12 month period if players were retained. Players would also have had a very difficult time if they had stayed.

Key question for me is how long the exile will last. I would support their return to Ireland AND the green jersey, say after 3 years. Anything else would be extreme and wrong


Logan (The War Hero), implied it was for good. I assume that when the IRFU, pressurised by BOI, insisted on them being fired they had to agree that it was for Ireland too.
We will never see them back.
Think about that, Bank of Ireland, a company without morals, passing judgement on someone else. When you here of the testimony's of people who had money and home's stolen by that organisation. Could we not associate ourselves with someone better.


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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby Lar » April 18th, 2018, 11:17 am

olaf the fat wrote:
Very good point there, the irfu actions do (and wrongly so) implicate guilt. This could of been handled a lot better to give fairness for all.


Guilty of what? Not the crimes they were charged with as a Court found the players (rightly to my mind) not guilty. But that does not mean that the players were not guilty of bringing the name of Ulster and Irish Rugby into disrepute. Or at the very least that on a subjective view that is not an unreasonable position to take. Look at the manner in which opinion is divided here on a Rugby forum. Clearly opinion is very divided in Belfast with protests outside Ravenhill on the one hand and threats of season ticket boycotts as a result of the contract revocations on the other. And regardless of the morals (or lack thereof) of the team sponsor it is still the team sponsor, someone any sporting organisation ignores at its peril.

I have no firm view on whether the IRFU/UR were right or wrong but I think they had little option but to take the decision they did.

Aside from a few lawyers who were presumably well compensated for their time there are no winners from the whole saga. Including Irish Rugby which has had to deal with this issue at a time when the sport should be at its most popular in the wake of an incredibly successful international season and one where at least two of its provincial sides are performing at a very high level and may also end the season on another high. The fact that I highlight Irish Rugby does not mean that I feel it is most damaged by the whole thing, that would be plainly wrong. But I think the IRFU and Ulster Rugby were left with little choice, and to that extent they were right to end the players' contracts.
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby Peg Leg » April 18th, 2018, 11:29 am

It's like having one of Osama Bin Laden's 53 brothers or sisters (22 wives, before you ask) as your head of PR. She/He might be cool, great at her/his job etc. But you just don't want him or her representing your company.
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby Oldschool » April 18th, 2018, 1:35 pm

Peg Leg wrote:It's like having one of Osama Bin Laden's 53 brothers or sisters (22 wives, before you ask) as your head of PR. She/He might be cool, great at her/his job etc. But you just don't want him or her representing your company.

Would they be IQ tho'?
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby LeRouxIsPHat » April 18th, 2018, 2:06 pm

I'd be more worried about her being AQ.
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby rooster » May 9th, 2018, 8:37 pm

All I know for sure is there was not actually a hearing in the end but they just were offered to take their wages and go or sit it out under contract and not play for a year then their contracts not renewed
As far as BOI is concerned they may not renew sponsorship anyway in line with their corporate decisions to cut back on sports affiliated sponsorship anyway.
On the protests at Ravenhill there were between 50 and 100 there for 30 minutes, they had roughly the same number of reporters and photographers there as well and vast majority of the crowd was in the ground before they appeared.
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby janeymac08 » May 10th, 2018, 8:55 am

Bank of Ireland has fairly recently extended their jersey sponsorship of both Leinster & Munster to 2023, so I don't see that as cutting back on sports sponsorship. They recruited David Wallace as well as some sort of a Business Development Manager for the Munster region.

Kingspan also had some concerns (according to PA anyway), but let Bank of Ireland do the public running. It was reported initially that Bank of Ireland was going to pull out of all rugby sponsorship, not just Ulster and that is probably why the IRFU/Ulster needed to get rid of the two lads and quick.
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Re: Jackson & Olding: were UR/IRFU right or wrong to termina

Postby Ruckedtobits » May 10th, 2018, 11:20 pm

janeymac08 wrote:Bank of Ireland has fairly recently extended their jersey sponsorship of both Leinster & Munster to 2023, so I don't see that as cutting back on sports sponsorship. They recruited David Wallace as well as some sort of a Business Development Manager for the Munster region.

Kingspan also had some concerns (according to PA anyway), but let Bank of Ireland do the public running. It was reported initially that Bank of Ireland was going to pull out of all rugby sponsorship, not just Ulster and that is probably why the IRFU/Ulster needed to get rid of the two lads and quick.


Heard strong indication that 6N main sponsor made their views clear to IRFU indirectly, prior to the final Court Verdict. Sacrifical lambs were required, one way or the other, because of content of undisputed evidence. These were the opinions offered by media advisers / brands managers & crisis consultants.
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