Climate - Practical Things to Do.

for general chat about stuff

Moderator: moderators

Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby Oldschool » November 15th, 2019, 11:31 am

Any energy/co2 saving suggestions would be welcome.
Here's a few of my own.

Many years ago I fitted what is called a 2KW bypass immersion heater to my hot water tank.
At the same time and more importantly I also fitted a three stage push button run back timer.
Press the button once for 15mins, twice for 30mins and thrice for an hour.
Reckon it has saved me a fortune.

About ten years ago the house was fitted with a water heating solar panel.
Cost about €4k which was cheap.
It has probably just about paid for itself now.
So it saves money, helps to reduce CO2 emissions and improves the value of your property.

Composters are another way to save a few bob, help CO2 emissions and make some compost, I have two of them but I don't put food waste other than vegetables into it.

Finally I have two rain water butts.
They don't save me any money but taking the big picture view they are good for the economy.
If everyone fitted a water butt, the demand for utility supplied water would go down, etc.

One person won't make a difference but get enough individuals doing the right thing and who knows.
The alternative is do nothing and watch your taxes go up as we get fined for missing targets.
Mirror, Mirror on the Wall who's the greatest player of them all? It is Drico your majesty.
User avatar
Oldschool
Shane Horgan
 
Posts: 12188
Joined: March 27th, 2008, 2:10 pm

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby jimbobjoe » November 15th, 2019, 11:45 am

Good thread OS - always keen to find out what others are doing to save and reduce.

As a renter of an old Edinburgh flat with single glazed sash windows and high ceilings there's very little I can do at present. I did, however, invest in some smart plugs a while ago so I could schedule heating and control remotely if needed (electric rads only). Doing this and switching away from the awful storage heaters in place meant that my heating bill was halved over a winter and I was actually warmer than before.

Looking to buy in the next year or so and plan to (gradually) add what you've mentioned as and when I can. I know the first port of call will be sufficient insulation and draft exclusion, this is something thats overlooked by so many (especially in Scotland it seems), but can save a fortune and keep you more comfortable for little upfront cost. So simple, so effective.
I'll die before I surrender, Tim.
jimbobjoe
Mullet
 
Posts: 1157
Joined: September 16th, 2009, 9:23 pm

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby Laighin Break » November 15th, 2019, 11:57 am

jimbobjoe wrote:Looking to buy in the next year or so and plan to (gradually) add what you've mentioned as and when I can. I know the first port of call will be sufficient insulation and draft exclusion, this is something thats overlooked by so many (especially in Scotland it seems), but can save a fortune and keep you more comfortable for little upfront cost. So simple, so effective.


I think insulation and draft exclusion is overlooked because it's just what we grew up with, and didn't know any better. My missus would always complain about how cold houses are in Ireland but I didn't get her point till we moved to Sweden. Out apartment block was built in the 50's and it's never cold. The heating (and hot water) is managed throughout the building (depending on outside temperature) so the heaters never get particularly hot, but even still we sometimes have the windows open in winter as the apartment is so warm/ well insulated.
On the flip side, we need a fan for the summer months, as the apartment is too hot, but that's manageable.
User avatar
Laighin Break
Enlightened
 
Posts: 971
Joined: May 3rd, 2012, 9:35 am
Location: Scandinavia

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby blockhead » November 15th, 2019, 12:10 pm

I've change from medium to rare with my Porterhouse steaks. Less gas used.
You know I'm going to lose,
And gambling's for fools,
But that's the way I like it baby, I don't want to live FOREVER!
User avatar
blockhead
Rob Kearney
 
Posts: 5479
Joined: December 14th, 2011, 2:20 pm
Location: Bastardstown, Co. Wexford

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby Xanthippe » November 15th, 2019, 12:39 pm

blockhead wrote:I've change from medium to rare with my Porterhouse steaks. Less gas used.


Eating the porterhouse in the first place is good for the environment - think of all the methane you saved from being released into the atmosphere :twisted:
#LiveLifeLoveLeinster

#BeSeenBeHeardBeBlueBELIEVE



I'm a Book Mark and damn proud of it. Storm 1:08 forever
User avatar
Xanthippe
Malcolm O'Kelly
 
Posts: 3663
Joined: September 5th, 2008, 6:48 pm

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby Hornet » November 15th, 2019, 4:21 pm

Don't have kids.
"The one thing we learn from History, is that we never learn from History".
Hornet
Mullet
 
Posts: 1991
Joined: January 21st, 2007, 8:48 pm
Location: 32,000 feet over Liverpool

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby FLIP » November 15th, 2019, 5:07 pm

Support Nuclear power generation.
Anyone But New Zealand
FLIP
Mullet
 
Posts: 1728
Joined: May 22nd, 2009, 1:00 am

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby John23 » November 15th, 2019, 5:19 pm

FLIP wrote:Support Nuclear power generation.
I imagine any nuclear facility in this country would be run with same level of incompetence as Irish Water.
“Somedays you're the pigeon, somedays you're the statue.”
User avatar
John23
Enlightened
 
Posts: 769
Joined: January 15th, 2008, 3:05 pm

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby The Doc » November 15th, 2019, 5:44 pm

Oldschool wrote:About ten years ago the house was fitted with a water heating solar panel.
Cost about €4k which was cheap.
It has probably just about paid for itself now.
So it saves money, helps to reduce CO2 emissions and improves the value of your property.


I've been toying with the idea of having PV cells put all over the roof with a battery storage system. I'm sure it isn't really cost effective yet but you have to assume energy pricing is only going to go up.

It's a shame they stopped the ability to send electricity back into the grid - wouldn't need a storage system (I'm pretty sure the battery pack's are horrible environmentally)

If anyone had any experience of this I'd be interested to hear
I like your right leg. A lovely leg for the role.
I've got nothing against your right leg.
The trouble is ... neither have you
The Doc
Mullet
 
Posts: 1773
Joined: August 11th, 2006, 2:59 pm
Location: Location Location

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby johng » November 16th, 2019, 10:06 am

Been toying with it too. There is a grant of up to 3800 but from what i have seen the registered companies mostly overcharge by this amount and you can do it as cheap or more likely cheaper by sourcing the kit and getting your own installer.

It is a couple of years at least before a feed in tarrif (fit) will be available here. Meaning you can't sell back to the grid until then.

The catch is that no fit means a battery is crucial. Otherwise all your unused electricity will just flow back into the grid for free.

However the battery technology is where the huge improvement is set to come over the next few years.

So 2021 or later looks like the time to do it.
User avatar
johng
Jamie Heaslip
 
Posts: 18047
Joined: March 23rd, 2009, 11:37 pm
Location: Behind You!!

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby Peg Leg » November 16th, 2019, 2:44 pm

Great thread OS.
My tip, Recycling is the worst of the 3 R's.
Reduce, Re-use, Recycle.

Shop sustainably, buy local where possible and give entamophagy a go (I haven't yet).

Don't forget though, that about 100 companies are responsible for 70%+ of all GHG output on the planet. That's why Ireland is over 30% over the EU avg. We have a corporate footprint here with a huge data centre infrastructure (Amazon's Tallaght centre is used for a district water heating system, which is positive, but a fig leaf), the top 10 pharma companies all manufacture here and we are a nation dedicated to farming meat.
Real change won't happen until we make systemic change3 to how we regulate these industries and change current practices.

Changing light bulbs, using renewable energy and being more efficient with your waste production will all help, but in reality activism and voting with your conscience be the things that effect real change.
"It was Mrs O'Leary's cow"
Daniel Sullivan
User avatar
Peg Leg
Devin Toner
 
Posts: 9156
Joined: February 1st, 2010, 6:08 pm
Location: Procrastinasia

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby TerenureJim » November 29th, 2019, 2:43 am

Try to stop Brexit. Country which grows own food or sources majority from near neighbours in Europe who run expensive but generally ecologically sound farming operations based on small holdings (in an international scale) about to begin massive dramatic increase in imports of meat and other food stuffs from other continents huge distances away and from ecologically damaging vast factory farm operations.

Seems an odd one that it rarely gets a look in amongst all the debate.
User avatar
TerenureJim
Rob Kearney
 
Posts: 5257
Joined: May 5th, 2009, 10:09 am

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby Mickado » November 29th, 2019, 10:32 am

Would switching to a green energy supplier make much difference?

I mean practically speaking does it matter that one company says they sell 100% renewable energy, can they really guarantee that?
Can I raise a practical question at this point? Are we gonna do "Stonehenge" tomorrow?
User avatar
Mickado
Knowledgeable
 
Posts: 487
Joined: May 10th, 2009, 5:30 pm

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby The Doc » November 29th, 2019, 10:47 am

Mickado wrote:Would switching to a green energy supplier make much difference?

I mean practically speaking does it matter that one company says they sell 100% renewable energy, can they really guarantee that?


Ha - I had exactly this question. I asked someone I know who used to work for Airtricity. So - as I understood his explanation - At a micro level, Airtricity essentially have a fixed amount of electricity production at any one time. Because they have had quite a lot of churn in their customer base over the last few years and lost customer numbers, they can essentially fulfil their entire customer base from their own "green" production. And are also able to state that they are 100% renewable (they may even supply excess to the general grid). But if tomorrow everyone moved over to them, they would have to tap into the general production to meet the demand and their next report would say 80% renewable (or whatever).

So it sort of has more to do with the total renewable production in the system and the movement of customers. Having said that, for Airtricity to increase their total production they will use renewables - they aren't going to build a coal fired station. So I guess that in the macro sense, more customers will give the impetus for greater production
I like your right leg. A lovely leg for the role.
I've got nothing against your right leg.
The trouble is ... neither have you
The Doc
Mullet
 
Posts: 1773
Joined: August 11th, 2006, 2:59 pm
Location: Location Location

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby jimbobjoe » November 29th, 2019, 10:52 am

Mickado wrote:Would switching to a green energy supplier make much difference?

I mean practically speaking does it matter that one company says they sell 100% renewable energy, can they really guarantee that?


It's always misleading when they say that. It simply means the supplier only has renewable generation assets (or possibly a mixture of renewable and battery storage). That might not always meet their demand though which means they'll need to purchase power from another source. This might balance out over time, as they'll also sell power to other suppliers but it's very hard to tell and can only be done retrospectively.

Ultimately, energy you consume comes from a range of sources which will vary based on price, weather, resource etc. Eirgrid manages this balance so your supplier can only try to set the right purchase price for the power they have the ability to generate. The only way to truly make an impact at your level is to reduce.
I'll die before I surrender, Tim.
jimbobjoe
Mullet
 
Posts: 1157
Joined: September 16th, 2009, 9:23 pm

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby Oldschool » November 29th, 2019, 10:55 am

jimbobjoe wrote:
Mickado wrote:Would switching to a green energy supplier make much difference?

I mean practically speaking does it matter that one company says they sell 100% renewable energy, can they really guarantee that?


It's always misleading when they say that. It simply means the supplier only has renewable generation assets (or possibly a mixture of renewable and battery storage). That might not always meet their demand though which means they'll need to purchase power from another source. This might balance out over time, as they'll also sell power to other suppliers but it's very hard to tell and can only be done retrospectively.

Ultimately, energy you consume comes from a range of sources which will vary based on price, weather, resource etc. Eirgrid manages this balance so your supplier can only try to set the right purchase price for the power they have the ability to generate. The only way to truly make an impact at your level is to reduce.

At the moment it's a case of robbing Peter to pay Paul.
Mirror, Mirror on the Wall who's the greatest player of them all? It is Drico your majesty.
User avatar
Oldschool
Shane Horgan
 
Posts: 12188
Joined: March 27th, 2008, 2:10 pm

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby Oldschool » November 29th, 2019, 11:03 am

The Doc wrote:
Oldschool wrote:About ten years ago the house was fitted with a water heating solar panel.
Cost about €4k which was cheap.
It has probably just about paid for itself now.
So it saves money, helps to reduce CO2 emissions and improves the value of your property.


I've been toying with the idea of having PV cells put all over the roof with a battery storage system. I'm sure it isn't really cost effective yet but you have to assume energy pricing is only going to go up.

It's a shame they stopped the ability to send electricity back into the grid - wouldn't need a storage system (I'm pretty sure the battery pack's are horrible environmentally)

If anyone had any experience of this I'd be interested to hear

You've touched on a lot of the issues.
PVs are expensive without the extra cost of very expensive storage, you'd wonder if it's even worth storing the excess.
It's a disgrace that excess energy isn't allowed to be exported, it is in other countries.
A water heating Solar Panel is still the most cost effective so it's worth installing one anyway.
Mirror, Mirror on the Wall who's the greatest player of them all? It is Drico your majesty.
User avatar
Oldschool
Shane Horgan
 
Posts: 12188
Joined: March 27th, 2008, 2:10 pm

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby Oldschoolsocks » November 29th, 2019, 12:11 pm

Oldschool wrote:
The Doc wrote:
Oldschool wrote:About ten years ago the house was fitted with a water heating solar panel.
Cost about €4k which was cheap.
It has probably just about paid for itself now.
So it saves money, helps to reduce CO2 emissions and improves the value of your property.


I've been toying with the idea of having PV cells put all over the roof with a battery storage system. I'm sure it isn't really cost effective yet but you have to assume energy pricing is only going to go up.

It's a shame they stopped the ability to send electricity back into the grid - wouldn't need a storage system (I'm pretty sure the battery pack's are horrible environmentally)

If anyone had any experience of this I'd be interested to hear

You've touched on a lot of the issues.
PVs are expensive without the extra cost of very expensive storage, you'd wonder if it's even worth storing the excess.
It's a disgrace that excess energy isn't allowed to be exported, it is in other countries.
A water heating Solar Panel is still the most cost effective so it's worth installing one anyway.


From a environmental point I like the reduce principle. A proper insulation envelope to reduce use of fossil fuels I believe gives you the best bang for your buck.
I just wanted to see Gordon D'Arcy get a 'back, sack and crack wax'
User avatar
Oldschoolsocks
Cian Healy
 
Posts: 2102
Joined: January 4th, 2015, 11:36 am
Location: Stepping out of the Supernova

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby Mickado » November 29th, 2019, 12:21 pm

Thanks for the responses folks, I knew it wasn't as simple as they make it sound.

I've started with the reduce idea, in the last year i've got the attic insulated and wrapped the outside too. Gone from E2 to C1 on the BER already, next steps are to get heating zones installed so i can run the rads independent to the hot water (which apparently has a very big impact on the BER).

Long term I'd love to ditch the gas boiler for a heat pump, install solar hotwater and/or PV and upgrade the windows to triple glaze (they're ok for now), but the initial outlay for it is a barrier at the moment.

I did switch over to Iberdrola which claims 100% renewable energy, but I understand that realistically it's only going to be cheaper, not necessarily greener.

Edit - I'm using BER as a proxy for efficiency, I understand that some measurement is better than none, but can anyone in the know explain if it really is a good indicator?
Can I raise a practical question at this point? Are we gonna do "Stonehenge" tomorrow?
User avatar
Mickado
Knowledgeable
 
Posts: 487
Joined: May 10th, 2009, 5:30 pm

Re: Climate - Practical Things to Do.

Postby Oldschool » November 29th, 2019, 12:33 pm

OOS is right solar panels don't really give bang for buck like insulation does.
Others have posted the same.
It would need research but the type of thing that should be considered is reflective coatings on things like roofs of cars, flat roofs on houses/sheds/apartments, airplanes, trains etc.
The reflective material would have to be....
I've been told that a heat exchanger for the air in your house is a good idea.
Not sure what the retro cost might be but I suspect there is better bang for buck than installation PVs and probably better for the environment too.
Bottom line here is that there doesn't seem to be an independent source of information for all the options including approx costs.
Why is that.
As an aside, I have a a solid fuel cooker (range), it sprung a leak, thankfully I was able to get a welder to repair it.
However you're left wondering?
So tried to ring the Irish based manufacturer to ascertain how much it would cost to get a replacement boiler never mind the cost of doing the work.
Would not even give me a ballpark figure.
Said I'd have to contact an approved engineer.
That would cost me a few Euro only to be told it's not doable or whatever.
My simple thinking was replace my range with a much cheaper and more suitable (at my age) a wood burning stove etc etc, if the numbers looked right.
The DIY market in Ireland is being squeezed out of existence or severely limited deliberately by government as a source of job creation.
Simple example, why isn't the vat on insulation zero?
If you get it installed by an approved installer you can (or used to be able) get the vat back (obviously you have to jump through hoops). If you buy it yourself you get done for vat. It's still cheaper to do it yourself.
It's a load of bollocks, screw the punter again for the sake of micky mouse job creation at the punters expense.
The government are only serious about the green agenda if it raises tax revenue ir creates jobs.
Mirror, Mirror on the Wall who's the greatest player of them all? It is Drico your majesty.
User avatar
Oldschool
Shane Horgan
 
Posts: 12188
Joined: March 27th, 2008, 2:10 pm

Next

Return to General Chat

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest