All Ireland League - Thread

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Re: All Ireland League - Thread

Postby ormond lad » September 13th, 2018, 11:20 pm

Ruckedtobits wrote:John O'Sullivan's piece in the Thursday 13th Sept edition of the IT on the same topic gives a more balanced viewpoint. The Leinster Senior (AIL) Clubs and their 35+ Executive Committee, who represent all rugby sections & opinions of the game in Leinster, have twice overwhelmingly questioned the wisdom of the expansion of the number of Professional players now eligible to play against totally amateur teams in Divs 1A and 1B.

It is truly ironic that in the week when current and former Pro players and pundits alike are talking of the "honesty" of Dippy Ryan's revelations of how professional players can sometimes treat, or even ignore, their own safety, that the IRFU chiefs, notably David Nucifora, are trying to convince the amateur, but hugely competent, administrators of Club Rugby in Leinster to forget their concerns about the Health & Safety of their amateur players and allow them to play against teams comprising of perhaps 10 players who are paid to play rugby professionally and train full-time to do so.

Yes, it could indeed be as many as 10 professionals on a few teams within Divs 1A & 1B. The regulation change would allow SIX Contracted Players PLUS any Academy or Development Contracted players already registered to that Club. Having trawled the Provincial Rosters, we count at least 5 Clubs with 6 Contracted players and four of these have at least four Academy or Development contracted players also.

This position could well be compounded because with the demise of the B&I Cup, players outside their Provincial Senior Squad will, quite literally, have no other rugby to play and no other stage upon which to impress their Provincial Coaches.

So, step up the Club stooges who will now face a hard-core of experienced professional players who train full-time, have already logged more S&C hours and collision experience than their amateur opponents will ever accumulate. How can this not be considered a substantial increase in Player Risk

A fair contest? Hardly. A sensible contest? Definitely not, without some sort of evidence that the "risk assessment" of player's Health & Safety has been carried out on something more convincing than the back of an envelope. That is, if any such assessment has been carried out at all.

One might have expected that the Ben Robinson case forewarned the IRFU to the inherent risks to players' safety in our game. To find that they are, once again, allowing amateur players to be exposed to needless additional risk, is almost beyond belief.
So what do we do then?
The provinces/IRFU need the contracted players playing rugby. We have clubs complaining about british and irish cup. Its gone and this celtic cup replaces it and clubs complain about that.
What would you propose if provincially contracted players are not to play club rugby then what do they play?
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Re: All Ireland League - Thread

Postby Ruckedtobits » September 14th, 2018, 7:50 am

ormond lad wrote:
Ruckedtobits wrote:John O'Sullivan's piece in the Thursday 13th Sept edition of the IT on the same topic gives a more balanced viewpoint. The Leinster Senior (AIL) Clubs and their 35+ Executive Committee, who represent all rugby sections & opinions of the game in Leinster, have twice overwhelmingly questioned the wisdom of the expansion of the number of Professional players now eligible to play against totally amateur teams in Divs 1A and 1B.

It is truly ironic that in the week when current and former Pro players and pundits alike are talking of the "honesty" of Dippy Ryan's revelations of how professional players can sometimes treat, or even ignore, their own safety, that the IRFU chiefs, notably David Nucifora, are trying to convince the amateur, but hugely competent, administrators of Club Rugby in Leinster to forget their concerns about the Health & Safety of their amateur players and allow them to play against teams comprising of perhaps 10 players who are paid to play rugby professionally and train full-time to do so.

Yes, it could indeed be as many as 10 professionals on a few teams within Divs 1A & 1B. The regulation change would allow SIX Contracted Players PLUS any Academy or Development Contracted players already registered to that Club. Having trawled the Provincial Rosters, we count at least 5 Clubs with 6 Contracted players and four of these have at least four Academy or Development contracted players also.

This position could well be compounded because with the demise of the B&I Cup, players outside their Provincial Senior Squad will, quite literally, have no other rugby to play and no other stage upon which to impress their Provincial Coaches.

So, step up the Club stooges who will now face a hard-core of experienced professional players who train full-time, have already logged more S&C hours and collision experience than their amateur opponents will ever accumulate. How can this not be considered a substantial increase in Player Risk

A fair contest? Hardly. A sensible contest? Definitely not, without some sort of evidence that the "risk assessment" of player's Health & Safety has been carried out on something more convincing than the back of an envelope. That is, if any such assessment has been carried out at all.

One might have expected that the Ben Robinson case forewarned the IRFU to the inherent risks to players' safety in our game. To find that they are, once again, allowing amateur players to be exposed to needless additional risk, is almost beyond belief.
So what do we do then?
The provinces/IRFU need the contracted players playing rugby. We have clubs complaining about british and irish cup. Its gone and this celtic cup replaces it and clubs complain about that.
What would you propose if provincially contracted players are not to play club rugby then what do they play?


For starters, a home and away Interprovincial series. Then why not try for A team fixtures argarinst the Scotst and Italian teams. Playing against their peers, not against amateurs is what develops players.
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Re: All Ireland League - Thread

Postby ormond lad » September 14th, 2018, 9:12 am

Ruckedtobits wrote:
ormond lad wrote:
Ruckedtobits wrote:John O'Sullivan's piece in the Thursday 13th Sept edition of the IT on the same topic gives a more balanced viewpoint. The Leinster Senior (AIL) Clubs and their 35+ Executive Committee, who represent all rugby sections & opinions of the game in Leinster, have twice overwhelmingly questioned the wisdom of the expansion of the number of Professional players now eligible to play against totally amateur teams in Divs 1A and 1B.

It is truly ironic that in the week when current and former Pro players and pundits alike are talking of the "honesty" of Dippy Ryan's revelations of how professional players can sometimes treat, or even ignore, their own safety, that the IRFU chiefs, notably David Nucifora, are trying to convince the amateur, but hugely competent, administrators of Club Rugby in Leinster to forget their concerns about the Health & Safety of their amateur players and allow them to play against teams comprising of perhaps 10 players who are paid to play rugby professionally and train full-time to do so.

Yes, it could indeed be as many as 10 professionals on a few teams within Divs 1A & 1B. The regulation change would allow SIX Contracted Players PLUS any Academy or Development Contracted players already registered to that Club. Having trawled the Provincial Rosters, we count at least 5 Clubs with 6 Contracted players and four of these have at least four Academy or Development contracted players also.

This position could well be compounded because with the demise of the B&I Cup, players outside their Provincial Senior Squad will, quite literally, have no other rugby to play and no other stage upon which to impress their Provincial Coaches.

So, step up the Club stooges who will now face a hard-core of experienced professional players who train full-time, have already logged more S&C hours and collision experience than their amateur opponents will ever accumulate. How can this not be considered a substantial increase in Player Risk

A fair contest? Hardly. A sensible contest? Definitely not, without some sort of evidence that the "risk assessment" of player's Health & Safety has been carried out on something more convincing than the back of an envelope. That is, if any such assessment has been carried out at all.

One might have expected that the Ben Robinson case forewarned the IRFU to the inherent risks to players' safety in our game. To find that they are, once again, allowing amateur players to be exposed to needless additional risk, is almost beyond belief.
So what do we do then?
The provinces/IRFU need the contracted players playing rugby. We have clubs complaining about british and irish cup. Its gone and this celtic cup replaces it and clubs complain about that.
What would you propose if provincially contracted players are not to play club rugby then what do they play?


For starters, a home and away Interprovincial series. Then why not try for A team fixtures argarinst the Scotst and Italian teams. Playing against their peers, not against amateurs is what develops players.
Will Scots/Italians fund A teams and players required for that. Any scottish sides provinces played in B&I cup were clubs in premiership and the scots pulled out of B&I a few years back and dont look like ever coming back.
The provinces will play 5 games and while they dont play one of the irish provinces in celtic cup that could/should be added and you then play 8 games.
For the most part it will be academy players and young pros playing in this competition playing in the AIL will aid their development considerably especially 19/20/21 year old forwards.
Yes AIL division 1 is amatuer but you'r being quite unfair to the standard of rugby on play there.
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Re: All Ireland League - Thread

Postby Ruckedtobits » October 4th, 2018, 6:53 pm

Irish rugby does not appear to be alone when it comes to the relationships between the Clubs and the Rugby Chiefs. This piece from the Sydney Morning Herald, particularly given the eminence of those involved, gives a strong indication of just how dislocated the grass-roots feel.

https://www.smh.com.au/sport/rugby-unio ... 507eh.html

Ireland is at nowhere near the same level of discontent but the IRFU must listen to what the Clubs and their members are saying and stop trying to bully them into working only for the future of the pro game.
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Re: All Ireland League - Thread

Postby ormond lad » October 4th, 2018, 7:31 pm

Ruckedtobits wrote:Irish rugby does not appear to be alone when it comes to the relationships between the Clubs and the Rugby Chiefs. This piece from the Sydney Morning Herald, particularly given the eminence of those involved, gives a strong indication of just how dislocated the grass-roots feel.

https://www.smh.com.au/sport/rugby-unio ... 507eh.html

Ireland is at nowhere near the same level of discontent but the IRFU must listen to what the Clubs and their members are saying and stop trying to bully them into working only for the future of the pro game.
What do you want for the clubs that IRFU are ignoring?
Game does need to change in parts though that is very clear.
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Re: All Ireland League - Thread

Postby Leoslovechild » October 6th, 2018, 12:00 am

So the league kicked off this evening an a really good and deserved win by Tart over Lansdowne at Castle Avenue.never seen 6 yellow cards before in a clean game!
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