Junior Cup 2008/2009

[thecoolfreak]

Donnybrook, 03/02/09
Terenure College
v
Belvedere College

Athy/Ashbourne, 02/02/09
Pres Bray
v
Qualifier 1

Tullow/Coolmine, 02/02/09
Qualifier 3
v
Newbridge College

Stradbrook, 02/02/09
Blackrock College
v
Qualifier 4

Donnybrook, 05/02/09
CBC Monkstown
v
St. Michael's

North Kildare/Naas 02/02/09
Clongowes Wood
v
Qualifier 2

Barnhall, 02/02/09
St. Mary's
v
Castleknock College

Ballycorus, 02/02/09
C.U.S.
v
Gonzaga College


CUS for the Junior Cup!!!!! You heard it here first folks.

[combatlogo]

That game v Gonzaga will be a real grudge match, lot of history between these two sides going back to U-13, with Gonzaga winning the U-13 league final in last minute and CUS getting revenge last year...think Gonzaga won in the league this year, was fairly close.

[thecoolfreak]

That game v Gonzaga will be a real grudge match, lot of history between these two sides going back to U-13, with Gonzaga winning the U-13 league final in last minute and CUS getting revenge last year...think Gonzaga won in the league this year, was fairly close.

Was there when they played Gonzaga towards the start of the season and i think Gonzaga won by 2 tries or so. As you say it should be a good game. Wish i was there for it

[Munki]

Find it hard to see past Clongowes and Marys in the bottom half, and Rock with Nure or Belvo in the top, although the pecking-order at JCT level was never as easy to read as it is for the Seniors.
Haven't heard enough of the results from the start of the season to make any realistic predictions though.

[thebigcheese]

The Junior draw has a Rock Clongowes final written all over it. Clongowes won the friendly between the 2 sides earlier. From what I have seen this year, Pres Bray look like the danger to rock in the top half, and CUS and Gonzaga could both give Clongowes a run fo their money. Mary's aren't up to much and although I haven't seen Nure or Belvo I have heard that neither has a vintage side this season. CBC were unluck in that they may scrape by Michaels but will run into Clongowes in the quarters. Junior rugby is far more open than Senior. Gonzaga, Pres Bray, Newbridge and Castleknock have all contested finals in recent years.

[bunty85]

How have CWC got so good at Juniors in the last 2 years? I mean when i was in school they were never considered potential winners of the junior cup. In fact we used to rank a lot of league schools ahead of them-Zaga, Pres, Roscrea, Newbridge, CBC. I find it mad that in the last 2 years they have become this incredible force at that level. They always had the whole boarding school thing but that didn;t usually come good till Senior level. I think its mad that when you look at the size of pupils in Rock, about 180 per year to CWC who have less than 80

[true blue 06]

The Junior draw has a Rock Clongowes final written all over it. Clongowes won the friendly between the 2 sides earlier. From what I have seen this year, Pres Bray look like the danger to rock in the top half, and CUS and Gonzaga could both give Clongowes a run fo their money. Mary's aren't up to much and although I haven't seen Nure or Belvo I have heard that neither has a vintage side this season. CBC were unluck in that they may scrape by Michaels but will run into Clongowes in the quarters. Junior rugby is far more open than Senior. Gonzaga, Pres Bray, Newbridge and Castleknock have all contested finals in recent years.

not likely.

cwc are stronger than rock, winner of cwc v michaels will win cup. belvo are weak this year as are marys. cwc are the strongest team in the competition but there not as good as last year

[thebigcheese]

The Junior draw has a Rock Clongowes final written all over it. Clongowes won the friendly between the 2 sides earlier. From what I have seen this year, Pres Bray look like the danger to rock in the top half, and CUS and Gonzaga could both give Clongowes a run fo their money. Mary's aren't up to much and although I haven't seen Nure or Belvo I have heard that neither has a vintage side this season. CBC were unluck in that they may scrape by Michaels but will run into Clongowes in the quarters. Junior rugby is far more open than Senior. Gonzaga, Pres Bray, Newbridge and Castleknock have all contested finals in recent years.

not likely.

cwc are stronger than rock, winner of cwc v michaels will win cup. belvo are weak this year as are marys. cwc are the strongest team in the competition but there not as good as last year

CBC only lost to Michaels by 2 points earlier on in the season. They have improved greatly based on the league final performance, where they might consider themselves unlucky to draw with Pres Bray, who seem to be one of this years big guns at junior level. CBC looked more composed than a clearly more talented Pres team (the same composure that led them to an unlikely win over the brilliant CUS!!!!!) I don't think they will be allowed a 2nd bite of the cherry by Pres but may well have enough to find an extra score to get over Michaels by February

[bunty85]

Well CBC clearly have the better of Michaels in the Cup going by the last 2 occasions we met in the cup Usually Michaels are excellent at Junior level so i would expect them to win this encounter but ya never know i guess. Apparently Pres are good this year so they did well to hold them i guess(a nil nil cracker!) so its encouraging.

[true blue 06]

The Junior draw has a Rock Clongowes final written all over it. Clongowes won the friendly between the 2 sides earlier. From what I have seen this year, Pres Bray look like the danger to rock in the top half, and CUS and Gonzaga could both give Clongowes a run fo their money. Mary's aren't up to much and although I haven't seen Nure or Belvo I have heard that neither has a vintage side this season. CBC were unluck in that they may scrape by Michaels but will run into Clongowes in the quarters. Junior rugby is far more open than Senior. Gonzaga, Pres Bray, Newbridge and Castleknock have all contested finals in recent years.

not likely.

cwc are stronger than rock, winner of cwc v michaels will win cup. belvo are weak this year as are marys. cwc are the strongest team in the competition but there not as good as last year

CBC only lost to Michaels by 2 points earlier on in the season. They have improved greatly based on the league final performance, where they might consider themselves unlucky to draw with Pres Bray, who seem to be one of this years big guns at junior level. CBC looked more composed than a clearly more talented Pres team (the same composure that led them to an unlikely win over the brilliant CUS!!!!!) I don't think they will be allowed a 2nd bite of the cherry by Pres but may well have enough to find an extra score to get over Michaels by February

what happens before the cup is irrelevant. gordan d'arcys winning sct team didn't win a match till christmas. i'm sure cbc are a decent enough team but playing in the cup against the likes of michaels completely different to playing cus or pres. i look forward to it though

[true blue 06]

Well CBC clearly have the better of Michaels in the Cup going by the last 2 occasions we met in the cup Usually Michaels are excellent at Junior level so i would expect them to win this encounter but ya never know i guess. Apparently Pres are good this year so they did well to hold them i guess(a nil nil cracker!) so its encouraging.

ha, you couldn't resist

we'll get you 3rd time lucky

[lebowski]

what happens before the cup is irrelevant. gordan d'arcys winning sct team didn't win a match till christmas. i'm sure cbc are a decent enough team but playing in the cup against the likes of michaels completely different to playing cus or pres. i look forward to it though[/quote

]

A small bit of reality. You can't lump CUS and Pres in the same boat. Pres are one of the most successful schools in terms of Junior Cup rugby. In fact it would be more realistic to put Michaels and CUS together!! Pres were top dog at JCT level from the mid 70s untill the early 90s and I might be wrong here but are probably only 2nd in terms of Junior Cup wins to Blackrock over the last 30 years. I went to Clongowes and the school we always wanted to avoid at Junior was Pres.

Every good school goes through a bad patch. Take Belvo from the 70's up untill 5 years ago as an example. Nobody wrote them off as a poor school. Michaels (and Clongowes too) have a long way to go before they can consider themselves in the same bracket as Pres or any of the other really big teams at Junior level. Clongowes will come through the bottom half but its no certainty that they will win the thing outright.

[true blue 06]

what happens before the cup is irrelevant. gordan d'arcys winning sct team didn't win a match till christmas. i'm sure cbc are a decent enough team but playing in the cup against the likes of michaels completely different to playing cus or pres. i look forward to it though[/quote

]

A small bit of reality. You can't lump CUS and Pres in the same boat. Pres are one of the most successful schools in terms of Junior Cup rugby. In fact it would be more realistic to put Michaels and CUS together!! Pres were top dog at JCT level from the mid 70s untill the early 90s and I might be wrong here but are probably only 2nd in terms of Junior Cup wins to Blackrock over the last 30 years. I went to Clongowes and the school we always wanted to avoid at Junior was Pres.

Every good school goes through a bad patch. Take Belvo from the 70's up untill 5 years ago as an example. Nobody wrote them off as a poor school. Michaels (and Clongowes too) have a long way to go before they can consider themselves in the same bracket as Pres or any of the other really big teams at Junior level. Clongowes will come through the bottom half but its no certainty that they will win the thing outright.

i'm not sure if i really understand your argument... what happened in the past is irrelevant. pres are still a relatively strong school but just because schools like pres,castleknock and de la salle were once far more successful doesn't mean they should still be considered part of the big schools.
and i don't mean to offend the cus fan club on here but i don't think its realistic putting cus and michaels together...4 leinster finals in 2 years

[lebowski]

What I was trying to get at is that nobody ever considered De La Salle or High School big schools in the 80s, and they won as much as Michaels did in this decade. Nobody considered Belvo a small school in the 80s and 90s and they won nothing. Most people with a really strong knowledge of Junior Rugby would consider Pres a much bigger school than most including my own Clongowes, Michaels and Belvo. I never really understood why they entered the league when it was first founded. It has probably led to this misconception of them being middle ranking.

St Michaels as a rugby school are the result of brilliant marketing and fair play to them. They may end up being a really top school in the long term but for now we must except them as a fast improving school, but well down the Junior pecking order.

[true blue 06]

What I was trying to get at is that nobody ever considered De La Salle or High School big schools in the 80s, and they won as much as Michaels did in this decade. Nobody considered Belvo a small school in the 80s and 90s and they won nothing. Most people with a really strong knowledge of Junior Rugby would consider Pres a much bigger school than most including my own Clongowes, Michaels and Belvo. I never really understood why they entered the league when it was first founded. It has probably led to this misconception of them being middle ranking.

St Michaels as a rugby school are the result of brilliant marketing and fair play to them. They may end up being a really top school in the long term but for now we must except them as a fast improving school, but well down the Junior pecking order.

you are talking through your arse

[Racing Against Time]

What I was trying to get at is that nobody ever considered De La Salle or High School big schools in the 80s, and they won as much as Michaels did in this decade. Nobody considered Belvo a small school in the 80s and 90s and they won nothing. Most people with a really strong knowledge of Junior Rugby would consider Pres a much bigger school than most including my own Clongowes, Michaels and Belvo. I never really understood why they entered the league when it was first founded. It has probably led to this misconception of them being middle ranking.

St Michaels as a rugby school are the result of brilliant marketing and fair play to them. They may end up being a really top school in the long term but for now we must except them as a fast improving school, but well down the Junior pecking order.

Marketing - my friend there is noone that sells themselves better than CLongowes. Just look on here. McFadden pressure group - is there any other school which has stooped to such lows? I wouldn't be surprised the lengths you lads would go to stick your face in a camera or have your names mentioned. It's the biggest advertising c~*k up ever. It's fake and transparent and vulgar.

[bunty85]

Michaels are certaintly ahead of Pres at this stage, I would rank Michaels in the top 3 Junior Cup schools of the past decade and certaintly the last 5 years. Pres have definately slipped down the order imo, they do still produce good teams from time to time but relative to their size and past have gone downhill. Michaels are always good at Js, largely because they have a pretty big Junior school, same goes for Rock. Pres dont have such an advantage, they also have im afraid trouble holding onto players. Their last good team at cup level was in 2002 who got to the JCT final but once that team got to senior level their 3 best players had moved to private schools. Pres haven't won the Junior legue since its inception(although that could change soon), so to call them ahead of a lot of league schools is laughable. In fact there is no such thing as a 'big 6' at Junior level, Mary's wouldn't be as good as lot of league schools at Junior level most years this last decade-i would rank Gonzaga, Newbridge, Roscrea and CBC ahead of them. Up until last year CWC were generally poor at Junior level but seemingly have become a major force these past 2 years.

[Durkah Durkah]

Just to show my nerdish qualities......
Since 1975, when Pres Bray won the Junior Cup for the 1st time post WW2, there have been 7 winners.
1st Blackrock (16)
2nd Terenure (5)
=3rd Belvedere (4)
=3rd Pres Bray (4)
=5th St Mary's (2)
=5th St Michael's (2)
7th CWC (1)
All of this only goes to prove that stats are great!

[bunty85]

Just to show my nerdish qualities......
Since 1975, when Pres Bray won the Junior Cup for the 1st time post WW2, there have been 7 winners.
1st Blackrock (16)
2nd Terenure (5)
=3rd Belvedere (4)
=3rd Pres Bray (4)
=5th St Mary's (2)
=5th St Michael's (2)
7th CWC (1)
All of this only goes to prove that stats are great!

Last 10 years though of all the teams to fear in the Junior Cup, Michaels are well above Bray in terms of other Leinster schools. No doubt though that Bray have been a serious force in the 70s/80s at the level.

[Durkah Durkah]

I attended a first round match in the Father Godfrey Cup yesterday. There were approx. 20 people supporting in total, and we were all parents. I appreciate that this competition is meaningless to some schools, but for others it can be their only realistic chance of winning something or it just could be the start and end of a schools cup campaign. I felt incredibly sorry for the players on both sides.