Rooney

[Donny B.]

Told ya!!!

[jrc]

Glad that's all over! Fingers crossed he's been promised that we'll spend big on players. Can't see our season picking up (although we should win the League Cup) but in terms of the League and the Champions League I doubt we'll be contenders.

It always baffles me how Irish people can refer to English teams as 'we'.

(if you're from Manchester, then my point still stands, in relation to plenty of other people!)

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Glad that's all over! Fingers crossed he's been promised that we'll spend big on players. Can't see our season picking up (although we should win the League Cup) but in terms of the League and the Champions League I doubt we'll be contenders.

It always baffles me how Irish people can refer to English teams as 'we'.

(if you're from Manchester, then my point still stands, in relation to plenty of other people!)

I'm not but I don't see your point anyway. There's far more to supporting a team than nationality. I've supported United since I was 7/8, how should I refer to them in your opinion?

[jrc]

I can refer to Leinster as 'we' or the Dublin GAA teams, or Shamrock Rovers/St Pats/Shels, because they're all from the area I'm from/live in. You can refer to Man Utd as whatever you like, I can't stop you, but the fact is they're an American-owned PLC based in NorthWest England and the real fans (the ones who go to all the games) laugh at people in Ireland/Scandinavia/Asia who think they're real Man Utd fans.

[jrc]

I should add, there's no reason you shouldn't like an English/Scottish/Spanish football team, I just think it's a bit cringey when people who don't go to a team's games (i don't know if you do or not but i know plenty who don't) then refer to the team as 'we' and think they're a real fan.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

I can refer to Leinster as 'we' or the Dublin GAA teams, or Shamrock Rovers/St Pats/Shels, because they're all from the area I'm from/live in. You can refer to Man Utd as whatever you like, I can't stop you, but the fact is they're an American-owned PLC based in NorthWest England and the real fans (the ones who go to all the games) laugh at people in Ireland/Scandinavia/Asia who think they're real Man Utd fans.

But do you hate Nacewa, Hines and Van der Merve playing for Leinster? I mean what right have they got? Does one have to go to all the games to be a real fan? I've actually heard a couple of stories from friends who were slagged off as "effin daytrippers" at Old Trafford before but that group is certainly in the minority and I couldn't care less what they think.

[jrc]

I can refer to Leinster as 'we' or the Dublin GAA teams, or Shamrock Rovers/St Pats/Shels, because they're all from the area I'm from/live in. You can refer to Man Utd as whatever you like, I can't stop you, but the fact is they're an American-owned PLC based in NorthWest England and the real fans (the ones who go to all the games) laugh at people in Ireland/Scandinavia/Asia who think they're real Man Utd fans.

But do you hate Nacewa, Hines and Van der Merve playing for Leinster? I mean what right have they got? Does one have to go to all the games to be a real fan? I've actually heard a couple of stories from friends who were slagged off as "effin daytrippers" at Old Trafford before but that group is certainly in the minority and I couldn't care less what they think.

I never mentioned hating anyone. And I'm delighted to have the players you mentioned playing for Leinster, I'm not talking about players, I'm talking about supporters referring to a team that they watch from a barstool every couple of weeks, as 'we', and thinking they're real fans.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

I can refer to Leinster as 'we' or the Dublin GAA teams, or Shamrock Rovers/St Pats/Shels, because they're all from the area I'm from/live in. You can refer to Man Utd as whatever you like, I can't stop you, but the fact is they're an American-owned PLC based in NorthWest England and the real fans (the ones who go to all the games) laugh at people in Ireland/Scandinavia/Asia who think they're real Man Utd fans.

But do you hate Nacewa, Hines and Van der Merve playing for Leinster? I mean what right have they got? Does one have to go to all the games to be a real fan? I've actually heard a couple of stories from friends who were slagged off as "effin daytrippers" at Old Trafford before but that group is certainly in the minority and I couldn't care less what they think.

I never mentioned hating anyone. And I'm delighted to have the players you mentioned playing for Leinster, I'm not talking about players, I'm talking about supporters referring to a team that they watch from a barstool every couple of weeks, as 'we', and thinking they're real fans.

I didn't say that you hate them, I was questioning if you hate the fact that they have no connection with Leinster but play for your team. I really take issue with you saying I'm not a real fan. I don't go over to OT every week and haven't been for years but that's because it's impractical and being a 23 year old student I can't afford to. That doesn't prevent me being passionate about how we get on and watching every game we're involved. I follow the results of the U-18s and the reserves and keep an eye on who's out on loan too, yet I'm not a real fan because I don't go every week? Gimme a break.

I also don't go to Leinster games every week for similar reasons to the above. I go when I can which is probably only about 5 games a year. That's not by choice and when I've graduated and working I intend on being a season ticket holder but for now that'll have to do. Would you like me to stop saying I'm a Leinster fan too?

[jrc]

If I start following Inter Milan, and watch them on tv, and look out for their reserve team results, and do that for a couple of years, will I then be a real Inter Milan fan?

In my opinion, you can be a supporter of a team if a)they represent the area you're from/live in or b) you actually go to most of their games. If you just pick a team in a foreign country when you're a child and watch them on sky sports without ever going to see them, then you're not a real fan.
By all means, support them and shout for them when you're watching them on tv, but in my opinion, it's a bit pathetic referring to them as 'we' or thinking you're a real fan.

Re Nacewa/Hines/etc, it's not about nationality. These guys all live in Dublin and play for Leinster every week, I'm delighted to have them. Maybe if you move to Manchester for work, or if you get a great job that enables you to travel over every couple of weeks, then I might start to believe that you're a real fan.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

If I start following Inter Milan, and watch them on tv, and look out for their reserve team results, and do that for a couple of years, will I then be a real Inter Milan fan?

In my opinion, you can be a supporter of a team if a)they represent the area you're from/live in or b) you actually go to most of their games. If you just pick a team in a foreign country when you're a child and watch them on sky sports without ever going to see them, then you're not a real fan.
By all means, support them and shout for them when you're watching them on tv, but in my opinion, it's a bit pathetic referring to them as 'we' or thinking you're a real fan.

Re Nacewa/Hines/etc, it's not about nationality. These guys all live in Dublin and play for Leinster every week, I'm delighted to have them. Maybe if you move to Manchester for work, or if you get a great job that enables you to travel over every couple of weeks, then I might start to believe that you're a real fan.

They live in Dublin because they were offered money to play for us, it's not like they already lived here and forged a connection with Leinster first.

I really think that saying I'm not a real fan because I don't go to games is a pathetic argument. To answer your question about Inter Milan, yeah I do. As long as you feel passionately about them as well then why not? Well you've already said why not but I just can't agree. I'd actually consider myself a plastic Ireland fan (in football terms) because I don't particularly follow them or care unless it's in a big game or ,by some miracle, a major tournament. Yet I'm Irish through and through, so how does that work? When Ireland lost to Russia I was disappointed but it didn't particularly weigh on my mind but the idea of Rooney leaving and the club going into meltdown left me devastated. But by your logic I can still claim to be an Ireland fan but only a plastic United supporter. Again, gimme a break. We obviously won't agree so probably no point in continuing this because I'll only be repeating myself.

[jrc]

Being from somewhere doesn't automatically make you a real fan. I'm from Ireland, but I don't particularly care for the Irish hockey team, or the Irish badminton team, or the Irish tennis team.... If I wanted to become a real fan though, I could.
Also, I think it's really sad that you care more about a bunch of overpaid whingers playing for an English PLC, than you do for a group of fellow Irishmen representing your country in the same sport. It's the equivalent of me supporting Saracens (just because I picked them when I was a child) far more than I support the Irish rugby team.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Being from somewhere doesn't automatically make you a real fan. I'm from Ireland, but I don't particularly care for the Irish hockey team, or the Irish badminton team, or the Irish tennis team.... If I wanted to become a real fan though, I could.
Also, I think it's really sad that you care more about a bunch of overpaid whingers playing for an English PLC, than you do for a group of fellow Irishmen representing your country in the same sport. It's the equivalent of me supporting Saracens (just because I picked them when I was a child) far more than I support the Irish rugby team.

Sad or not, the point is that I do. I can't help how I feel no more than I can help who I fall in love with. I disagree that you can become a real fan if you want to, there has to be an emotional attachment to the team and there's an intangible thing that does that. The Irish football team didn't capture my imagination as a child whereas United did. I'm not a fan of international football in general because it tends to be of poor quality and quite dull aside from the really big games. My point wasn't exactly that you have to be from somewhere to be a real fan but that in your opinion I'm more entitled to call myself a real fan of an Irish team that I don't particularly care about than a United team that I do.

I'm not sure how you can be so dismissive of the bond formed with a team when you're young.

[suisse]

Being from somewhere doesn't automatically make you a real fan. I'm from Ireland, but I don't particularly care for the Irish hockey team, or the Irish badminton team, or the Irish tennis team.... If I wanted to become a real fan though, I could.
Also, I think it's really sad that you care more about a bunch of overpaid whingers playing for an English PLC, than you do for a group of fellow Irishmen representing your country in the same sport. It's the equivalent of me supporting Saracens (just because I picked them when I was a child) far more than I support the Irish rugby team.

This is an interesting debate you ladies are having. I'm with jrc on this one, if you allow me an opinion? I support Leinster because this is the province I am from and my dad took me to a few games as a young knacker before it went pro. It's only right to support this team. I could have jumped on the same bandwagon that a lot of people in my county, Meath, did at the turn of the century but I feared I would be disowned before I left school. I support Ireland rugby team because they are the national side of the game I love, and have played myself since I was 6 in Coolmine. Seeing Leinster win the Heineken Cup with 40,000 people from the province in Murryfield was what made it special. The majority of the players were also born in the province and the ones who weren't (Nacewa, Whits, Fogs etc) obviously bought into whatever it means to play for this team as an outsider.

I could never feel the same way about Liverpool winning the 2005 Champions League. Screaming and shouting in Istambul with 40,000 from all corners of the globe watching an English team with an international mix. For me, a large part is representation. Who the fock are these people I'm wearing this red jersey with?

JRC, I wouldn't even support the irish national soccer team. I don't wish them any ill-will, and would like to see them progress because it makes many people I know happy. But them losing to Russia had no impact on me. In reality, I really couldn't care.

No one way is better than another, but I only support one club team and one international team, across all the sports. I think that's enough. The fact that they are from where I am from makes it so much better.

I do, however, support anyone playing AGAINST Dublin GAA

[LeRouxIsPHat]

I wouldn't take issue with anything you've said Suisse because that's how you feel and that's fair enough. I would have a problem if you had a go at my feeling towards a team or said I wasn't a real fan because I didn't go to matches. I can absolutely understand that some people will only have an affinity with their local team(s) but that doesn't mean that you can't feel passionate about a team that isn't local.

EDIT: Suisse I'm not saying that you did say there's a problem with that whether that's your belief or not!

[Avenger]

Fair play to the lad. He played them like a fiddle.

[suisse]

I wouldn't take issue with anything you've said Suisse because that's how you feel and that's fair enough. I would have a problem if you had a go at my feeling towards a team or said I wasn't a real fan because I didn't go to matches. I can absolutely understand that some people will only have an affinity with their local team(s) but that doesn't mean that you can't feel passionate about a team that isn't local.

EDIT: Suisse I'm not saying that you did say there's a problem with that whether that's your belief or not!

Ah yeah, I know what you mean. I wouldn't piss all over your loyalties to a club. You make a personal decision that this is your club, and you stick to it. I wouldn't say to you "hey, why are you supporting Liverpool when the League of Ireland is dying on it's knees." Could you care about St. Pat's because they are local? Or Shels, Bohs, whoever it is?

I hate when people change clubs though. There is no loyalty there. I had a buddy growing up who was a Liverpool fan until Blacbburn won the League. He then converted back to Liverpool when Rovers were relegated. I guess at that age though you shouldn't expect too much from kids but if you were in your 20's and did that it would be rather odd.

I do, however, question your loyalties to a team/club like Liverpool Give up! The LOI is going to a 'nailbiting' final day.

[nelly the elephant]

If I start following Inter Milan, and watch them on tv, and look out for their reserve team results, and do that for a couple of years, will I then be a real Inter Milan fan?

In my opinion, you can be a supporter of a team if a)they represent the area you're from/live in or b) you actually go to most of their games. If you just pick a team in a foreign country when you're a child and watch them on sky sports without ever going to see them, then you're not a real fan.
By all means, support them and shout for them when you're watching them on tv, but in my opinion, it's a bit pathetic referring to them as 'we' or thinking you're a real fan.

Re Nacewa/Hines/etc, it's not about nationality. These guys all live in Dublin and play for Leinster every week, I'm delighted to have them. Maybe if you move to Manchester for work, or if you get a great job that enables you to travel over every couple of weeks, then I might start to believe that you're a real fan.

I totally disagree......I'm a big NFL fan this past 25 years. I follow/support a highly unfashionable/unsuccessful team-the NEW YORK JETS. The reason I started supporting them was in the first few weeks I was watching them (Channel 4-mid 80's)they had a high scoring division game against Miami when we were throwing huge TD passes all over the shop. The QB was Ken O'BRIEN and the uniform was green and white...I was sold.

I've been to the States 4 times since(in the last 9 years)......twice at home in NJ/NYC and twice away Pittsburgh/Cleveland SPECIFICALLY to see the Jets play. That is a HUGE time and expense commitment from someone who is married with young Children. I get equally depressed with their poor results as compared to Leinster and rejoice in their wins just as much.
I appreciate I may appear as a freak but until you belong you will never know.......

I am Leinster fan through and through...just like I'm a Liverpool fan....a Dub....a Shels fan......Lancashire cricket.....New York Jets...AAAANNNNDDDDDDDDDD.............an England cricket fan(believe it or not!).....

[suisse]

I am Leinster fan through and through...just like I'm a Liverpool fan....a Dub....a Shels fan......Lancashire cricket.....New York Jets...AAAANNNNDDDDDDDDDD.............an England cricket fan(believe it or not!).....

Yes, but who would you support if the NY Jets played Lancashire CCC in an International Rules style game?

[ronk]

If I start following Inter Milan, and watch them on tv, and look out for their reserve team results, and do that for a couple of years, will I then be a real Inter Milan fan?

In my opinion, you can be a supporter of a team if a)they represent the area you're from/live in or b) you actually go to most of their games. If you just pick a team in a foreign country when you're a child and watch them on sky sports without ever going to see them, then you're not a real fan.
By all means, support them and shout for them when you're watching them on tv, but in my opinion, it's a bit pathetic referring to them as 'we' or thinking you're a real fan.

Re Nacewa/Hines/etc, it's not about nationality. These guys all live in Dublin and play for Leinster every week, I'm delighted to have them. Maybe if you move to Manchester for work, or if you get a great job that enables you to travel over every couple of weeks, then I might start to believe that you're a real fan.

I totally disagree......I'm a big NFL fan this past 25 years. I follow/support a highly unfashionable/unsuccessful team-the NEW YORK JETS. The reason I started supporting them was in the first few weeks I was watching them (Channel 4-mid 80's)they had a high scoring division game against Miami when we were throwing huge TD passes all over the shop. The QB was Ken O'BRIEN and the uniform was green and white...I was sold.

I've been to the States 4 times since(in the last 9 years)......twice at home in NJ/NYC and twice away Pittsburgh/Cleveland SPECIFICALLY to see the Jets play. That is a HUGE time and expense commitment from someone who is married with young Children. I get equally depressed with their poor results as compared to Leinster and rejoice in their wins just as much.
I appreciate I may appear as a freak but until you belong you will never know.......

I am Leinster fan through and through...just like I'm a Liverpool fan....a Dub....a Shels fan......Lancashire cricket.....New York Jets...AAAANNNNDDDDDDDDDD.............an England cricket fan(believe it or not!).....

I've supported the 49ers for over 20 years and will see them live for the first time next weekend, I can understand that attitude.

[waterboy]

No their not

You can refer to Man Utd as whatever you like, I can't stop you, but the fact is they're an American-owned PLC based in NorthWest England