Leinster Soccer Team

[Fireworks]

There are sports franchises that extend beyond the core sport and I wounder if Leinster could do this. Is there room to build a soccer team under the Leinster brand. If you sell shares to the fans and include them in some level of decision making like a coop it could be financed. Build an academy and get the right team together and you could have a product. In Scotland you had two big clubs sharing european football and most of the revenue between them. Here we could have one big team qualifying for Europe every year and building something worthwhile. Marketed correctly I could see this attracting a much bigger following than any of the clubs out there now. There are lots of soccer fans here who support english teams but could be attracted to a quality Irish product.

[paddyor]

There are sports franchises that extend beyond the core sport and I wounder if Leinster could do this. Is there room to build a soccer team under the Leinster brand. If you sell shares to the fans and include them in some level of decision making like a coop it could be financed. Build an academy and get the right team together and you could have a product. In Scotland you had two big clubs sharing european football and most of the revenue between them. Here we could have one big team qualifying for Europe every year and building something worthwhile. Marketed correctly I could see this attracting a much bigger following than any of the clubs out there now. There are lots of soccer fans here who support english teams but could be attracted to a quality Irish product.

There's the problem there. The reason most league of Ireland teams can't attract support has to do with the quality of the matches. You have the same problem they have from the off. Most of the talent is in the EPL

[Broken Wing]

Most of the talent is in the EPL

Looking at Trap's latest squad most of the Irish talent is in the Championship.

This sounds very like the Sporting Fingal project. The idea there was to develop soccer in Fingal with local clubs feeding players into Sporting Fingal. Fingal County Council were to build a sports centre with Sporting as the key tenant but until then they played in Morton stadium. Unfortunately, despite finishing 4th in the premier division in just their 3rd year and even playing some European football, the club was wound up in 2011 due to a lack of funding.

Really there's no reason to believe something like that couldn't succeed. It would require entry to the 1st division (which would need another club to collapse probably) and earning promotion to the Premier division in order to eventually earn European football and it's bound to come under fire from existing clubs and their supporters but that's not to say it wouldn't be worth doing. Finances would have to be controlled and European football would have to be the main goal (much like Shamrock Rovers under Dunphy and Giles) in order to draw supporters. That would take time. There would be no point at all in expecting to have 18,000 in the RDS to watch Leinster V Shelbourne in a midtable Premier Division clash because that just wouldn't happen. Realistically the team would have to hit the latter stages of Champions or Europa league qualifying and hopefully the group stages in order to be pared with a marquee side and draw the crowds. But sure anything's possible if you wish hard enough.

[Fireworks]

All good points. This would not be easy but i cannot believe it would be impossible. I just thought it was worth a discussion. The focus would have to be european football or some league outside of Ireland as I would agree that you are unlikely to attract the necessary crowds to games against any of the current teams. How about a soccer team in each of the provinces. Would we get crowds to games between them.

Not sure it would happen if we just wish hard enough. I think we would actually have to do something. Anyway it is just a thought and if it worked and made money it could help to finance the real Leinster team.

[nopeare]

Not quit the same thing but I all ways though there would be a huge market for a Dublin based team in the English League. Could be done some way like Rangers were supposedly going to buy some club in the 2nd division that was about to wrap up and move it to Glasgow. I know that Swansea and Cardiff are in the English set up for a long time and both Glasgow clubs have struggled to get into it but if there was some way for it to be done it could be very successful.

After a few years if it got to the Premiership or even the Championship it could have huge fan base (even people just going to see teams they support). It would also be a team that could crack into an American fan base as well.

Never know could see Leinster lift the Champions League and Heineken in the one year

[neilinboston]

Didn't Wimbledon talk about moving to Dublin in the 80s? When they were a first division club.
Don't remember details of why it didn't go through, was it nixed by the league or deemed not financially viable? Obviously the market has changed hugely in the intervening 30 years.

[MelbourneRebel]

The "Dublin Dons" proposals were in the mid-90s when they were an established Premiership club. Thank God it was blocked.

This is all grossly unfair to the League of Ireland and supporters of decent big clubs like Bohemians and Cork.

[Broken Wing]

It's not really unfair to anyone as it's just a what if conversation. I'm sure there were people who thought (and still think) it was unfair on the AIL clubs to have the provinces going professional.

Cork and Bohemians are just two of the clubs that financial mismanagment crippled in the league. Cork went into examinership and out of existence before having the name bought by Cork City FORAS Co-op. Bohs ended 2011 owing €4m to Zurich. They're far from the only clubs to have problems with finances. Shels were relegated for their financial dealings and Drogheda went into examinership in 2008.

Attendances are poor for the league. Admittedly the weather wasn't the best but the attendances for last weekend were:
Cork City V Derry City: 2334
Sligo Rovers V Limerick: 2311
Shelbourne V Shamrock Rovers: 1704
Finn Harps V Longford Town: 723
Drogheda United V Bray Wanderers: 536
Waterford United V Mervue United: 410
Athlone Town V Cobh Ramblers: 311
UCD V Dundalk: 241
Salthill Devon V Wexford Youths: 126
TOTAL: 8696

Bohs' game was called off but their game with their biggest rivals, Shamrock Rovers, the week before was attended by 2,785.

Frankly I think that a well managed, well funded, well planned team would be welcomed by the FAI and I did say in my first post that such a club would be bound to come under fire from existing clubs and their supporters but I'm confident that there are more than 10,000 soccer fans in Ireland and there's no reason to believe such a club couldn't draw on them, especially if it was to make the breakthrough into European competition.

[Fireworks]

It's not really unfair to anyone as it's just a what if conversation. I'm sure there were people who thought (and still think) it was unfair on the AIL clubs to have the provinces going professional.

Cork and Bohemians are just two of the clubs that financial mismanagment crippled in the league. Cork went into examinership and out of existence before having the name bought by Cork City FORAS Co-op. Bohs ended 2011 owing €4m to Zurich. They're far from the only clubs to have problems with finances. Shels were relegated for their financial dealings and Drogheda went into examinership in 2008.

Attendances are poor for the league. Admittedly the weather wasn't the best but the attendances for last weekend were:
Cork City V Derry City: 2334
Sligo Rovers V Limerick: 2311
Shelbourne V Shamrock Rovers: 1704
Finn Harps V Longford Town: 723
Drogheda United V Bray Wanderers: 536
Waterford United V Mervue United: 410
Athlone Town V Cobh Ramblers: 311
UCD V Dundalk: 241
Salthill Devon V Wexford Youths: 126
TOTAL: 8696

Bohs' game was called off but their game with their biggest rivals, Shamrock Rovers, the week before was attended by 2,785.

Frankly I think that a well managed, well funded, well planned team would be welcomed by the FAI and I did say in my first post that such a club would be bound to come under fire from existing clubs and their supporters but I'm confident that there are more than 10,000 soccer fans in Ireland and there's no reason to believe such a club couldn't draw on them, especially if it was to make the breakthrough into European competition.

You are right this is just a what if. I do not think that any of the current teams would have much of a leg to stand on in complaining about a new team coming in with better structures and money. They have been around for years and from the figures above have pretty much failed.

Every sports team has a core support, a fair weather support and a group of wagon jumpers. There might be trouble from the core support but with a bit of success the others would not be long shifting allegiance. The real target however would be the fans following english teams. If you could get big teams coming here regularly to play competitive matches where you are not just a plucky little guy then you have a product.

[tackle-bag]

I really believe that the provincial model is the way forward for any Irish team sport in which we want to be competitive internationally. There just isn't sufficient interest beyond Gaelic Games to draw large crowds, funding etc. to local sides with small catchment areas.

For instance, if Irish cricket wants to make the step up to Test status, I think the way to do that is to have three Irish provincial sides (I don't think there's any interest in Connacht) playing in the English County Championship.

Although some of the League of Ireland clubs have had decent runs in Europe over the past few years, they're not going to make the step up to regular Europa League group phase qualification in their current form.

[Fireworks]

I really believe that the provincial model is the way forward for any Irish team sport in which we want to be competitive internationally. There just isn't sufficient interest beyond Gaelic Games to draw large crowds, funding etc. to local sides with small catchment areas.

For instance, if Irish cricket wants to make the step up to Test status, I think the way to do that is to have three Irish provincial sides (I don't think there's any interest in Connacht) playing in the English County Championship.

Although some of the League of Ireland clubs have had decent runs in Europe over the past few years, they're not going to make the step up to regular Europa League group phase qualification in their current form.

I would echo that. We only that 4 million people. We are the size of manchester and that only has two teamsthough I believe they are quiet good. How could anyone think we could maintain a full league. Four well funded teams with academies that would attract players to stay here and maybe some foreign players to come here would be good. The issue is finding someone to play. Maybe join the scottish league or attract them to a celtic league. be left playing each other multiple times to make some sort of season. European football would be a necessity.

Like your thinking on the other sports as well. Cricket would struggle but you have to start somewhere.

[StrangeButBlue]

Not sure how the European matches are going to help leinster fc. still only a few matches a year and they do bring in the crowds already when they happen.
unless a team starts in the vauxhall conference and works it's way up = maybe get ryanair to sponser them and accept massive losses until the reach the premiership it's not going to work. Still a better idea than the georgian, italian, spanish Celtic League Div 2 idea on the Italian thread

[Fireworks]

Not sure how the European matches are going to help leinster fc. still only a few matches a year and they do bring in the crowds already when they happen.
unless a team starts in the vauxhall conference and works it's way up = maybe get ryanair to sponser them and accept massive losses until the reach the premiership it's not going to work. Still a better idea than the georgian, italian, spanish Celtic League Div 2 idea on the Italian thread

It is just a suggestion not a ready made business plan. If everyone held back throwing out suggestions and ideas because they were scared they might not be right we would never make any progress. There is potential there for something but I am sure we have not found it yet. Even if it was four provincial teams playing in the Irish league it might take years but it could help to raise the standards by focusing the available talent in to fewer bigger teams.

[mtleinster]

The reality is that there is not enough people here who support football, only winner pickers who like buying football jerseys

you dont see many people wearing Aston Villa, Cardiff, Crystal Palace, Everton, Fulham, Hull, Newcastle, Norwich, Southampton, Stoke, Sunderland, Swansea, West Brom or West Ham jerseys

there are at least 15,000 empty seats for every International game. If Leinster FC were to play Man Utd, there would be 75% united supporters

remember League of Ireland XI?