Liverpool Thread

[Dave Cahill]

I thought we got away with that one last night. Bournemouth showed a lot of character. Their 'goal' looked perfectly legit to me and ours was clearly offside. Still, from a Liverpool point of view, I thought we played several times better than last week's showing. There's still a lot of room for improvement, but it's heading in the right direction. I'm delighted to see BR favouring a back 4 - I thought the back 5 last season left us dreadfully short at the business end of the pitch. Lovren has been good, the new fullbacks are starting to bed in and Phil has adopted the mantle of playmaker-in-chief. Millner looks like he'll be an excellent signing. Benteke keeping up his record of a goal every two games. I thought we played to his strengths much better last night - Phil in particular was hovering around Benteke to pick up the knock-downs. Firminho is being introduced gradually - although he seems to play the same position as Phil, so that'll be a toughie for BR to sort out. Lallana continues to underwhelm - he has a couple of touches then stands still as though he has no clue where to move. I hope for everyone's sake he sorts that out in his own mind. It's still early season, so plenty of time for relationships to develop. Two abject performances - will surely get better. 6 points - you'd have to be happy with that.

I missed the very start of the game - it took me ages to work out who the 11th man (Lallana) was. If you painted him green you'd never find him again.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Thought Benteke was excellent aside from the miss at the end. Thought you really missed a holding midfielder when Bournemouth were on top at the start and in the last 20 mins or so. Expected Can to improve things but runners glided past him a few times and he didn't work hard to get back.

Bournemouth played some nice stuff but really lacked a cutting edge and seemed quite a slow side, can't see where the goals will come from.

[offshorerules]

Thought Bournemouth were a little unlucky not to get anything from the game. Before the match I had hoped for a convincing performance from Liverpool, I didn't get that. I had also hoped for 6 points so I am please with that. I would take a point against Arsenal now if offered it.

[Lamb of BOD]

I would take a point against Arsenal now if offered it.

I get what you're saying, and I'd probably take a point now, too, if offered. However, I cannot understand why Arsenal have been tipped by so many pundits to win the league. They have some super players and play lovely football, but will continue to struggle for goals and to put teams away if they continue to rely so much on Giroud. He wouldn't fill me with much confidence, if I was an Arsenal fan. He's a great man for the near misses, but doesn't have the out and out ability of a top finisher. (I hope I;m not jinxing the game for us next Monday!). If they were to land Benzema I think I'd revise my opinion, but I'm not sure how likely he is to leave Madrid. Of course, we're not any great shakes at the moment, but I don't think that Arsenal side have a strong enough backbone - and I think Benteke is exactly the sort of player who could cause them a lot of problems.

When is Sturridge due back, does anyone know?

[LeRouxIsPHat]

I can see both sides of the argument with Arsenal. They finished last season playing incredibly well in the league and even though they stumbled to their two FA cup wins, the fact is that they still won them and that should help them going forward.

On the guardian podcast they constantly talk about how they can only perform well when it doesn't count though and I think there's definitely something in that. Bottling the game against West Ham when there was so much expectation around them is a fine example of that.

[offshorerules]

The young Spanish lad (I can't pronounce it never mind spell it) looked tasty last night for the 21's.

[Lamb of BOD]

That was a close run thing tonight. On balance, I think a draw was a fair result. Arsenal had a lot more of the ball, I thought we had the better chances. Phil was excellent again. Firmino struggled to get into the game. Who is this Rossiter fellow who cane on for Lucas? He looked about 12, but didn't put a foot wrong for the game. Back four are looking solid enough. The two full back have been great additions. Millner could turn out to be our signing of the season

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Thought you looked much better without Henderson. Nothing against him but don't really see how himself and Milner fit together. Firmino did struggle a little bit but you could see how the role would work for him if he plays more games and gets up to speed, he made plenty of really good runs but wasn't picked out. Benteke is brilliant, really wish United had gone in for him. Wouldn't blame him for missing the chance from 6 yards out, I know the commentators gave him a hard time but I just thought it was an excellent save. Not sure how Sturridge will fit back into the side.

Arsenal were a complete shambles in the first half, they were blessed to still be in it.

[Avenger]

Considering the fixtures, I'm delighted to have 7 points after 3 games.

Pretty much a game of two halves last night. We should have been 3 up at HT but Arsenal owned the second half so a draw is probably fair enough. Milner was excellent and is going to be a super asset. Not just as a player but as a leader and professional too. Thought Firmino was poor myself but it was his first start and hopefully he'll improve with games. Big squad though so if he doesn't start producing he may not see the game time he needs. That said Ibe was terrible when he came on.

Rossiter is a local lad. The locals have been raving about him for years. He has looked exceptional at underage level - was 16 when dominating u18 games etc. He's 18 now. Strange seeing him come in for Lucas last night who was IMO having a very good game and I thought the game passed the young lad by a bit but the pace was high and it would have been difficult for a lad of his experience to come in and not struggle. He's pretty much a box to box midfielder who is good technically so he could turn out to be very good but its early days. Looks like he'll see some game time this year...

I agree that Milner and Henderson doesn't work yet. IMO a DM is a must in a midfield 3 but Rodgers doesn't agree with me
He seems to think that there will be games where we don't need one but I just think that the balance would always be better with one in there. Milner is such an intelligent footballer that I think he'll make it work. Hendo's form hasn't been great so far but he has quality so I'm sure he'll sort it out.

IMO Sturridge will play wide of the front 3 when he comes back. Benteke has shown enough in the 3 games to suggest he will always be the focal point of that attack. Sturridge will add pace to the front 3 too as while both Benteke and Phil are not slouches, neither of them would be super quick.
I wouldn't be too down on Benteke for the miss either. He tried to place it when at that range he probably would have been better off to put his foot through it and go high.

Phil's footwork before the shot that Cech pushed on to the post was amazing skill. Super little player.

[Peg Leg]

That was a close run thing tonight. On balance, I think a draw was a fair result. Arsenal had a lot more of the ball, I thought we had the better chances. Phil was excellent again. Firmino struggled to get into the game. Who is this Rossiter fellow who cane on for Lucas? He looked about 12, but didn't put a foot wrong for the game. Back four are looking solid enough. The two full back have been great additions. Millner could turn out to be our signing of the season

If fifa 15 is anything to go by, Rossiter is an academy graduate with a lot of potential. Never really makes the grade though and is sold along with 4 other "nearly men" in the 2016 christmas window to raise funds for the purchase of Edison Cavani. That works out really well btw.

[offshorerules]

That was a close run thing tonight. On balance, I think a draw was a fair result. Arsenal had a lot more of the ball, I thought we had the better chances. Phil was excellent again. Firmino struggled to get into the game. Who is this Rossiter fellow who cane on for Lucas? He looked about 12, but didn't put a foot wrong for the game. Back four are looking solid enough. The two full back have been great additions. Millner could turn out to be our signing of the season

If fifa 15 is anything to go by, Rossiter is an academy graduate with a lot of potential. Never really makes the grade though and is sold along with 4 other "nearly men" in the 2016 christmas window to raise funds for the purchase of Edison Cavani. That works out really well btw.

Got to get me that game!

[Peg Leg]

That was a close run thing tonight. On balance, I think a draw was a fair result. Arsenal had a lot more of the ball, I thought we had the better chances. Phil was excellent again. Firmino struggled to get into the game. Who is this Rossiter fellow who cane on for Lucas? He looked about 12, but didn't put a foot wrong for the game. Back four are looking solid enough. The two full back have been great additions. Millner could turn out to be our signing of the season

If fifa 15 is anything to go by, Rossiter is an academy graduate with a lot of potential. Never really makes the grade though and is sold along with 4 other "nearly men" in the 2016 christmas window to raise funds for the purchase of Edison Cavani. That works out really well btw.

Got to get me that game!

APOLOGIES FOR THE THREAD DERAILMENT!

Need to start a new career, pretty much altered my annual budget to a Wages only budget and developed a team of free transfers on huge wages.
3 - 3 - 1 - 3

Ronaldo 94 - Aguero 93 - Neymar 89
Coutinho 91
Sterling 89 - Pogba 89 - Walcott 92
Marcello 89 - Laporte 90 - Ginther 89
Neuer 94

Cavani, Ibrahimovic, Fabergas, Hamsik, Moreno, Bangoura, Bravo

[offshorerules]

All I can say is Oh God!

[LeRouxIsPHat]

A few weeks back I said that Lovren might improve with the way the team was shaping up but couldn't believe how bad he was on Saturday. Obviously I'm a United fan but it was so bad that it was just funny. I've rarely seen a player so lacking in confidence, the poor guy obviously just wanted the ground to swallow him up when he missed that chance near the end.

If its any consolation, United are a mess at the moment. We look better organised and more comfortable in possession than we have done for a while, but there's no sense that that is leading us anywhere special, no plan B, a bizarre reliance on Januzaj and Hernadez for the first few weeks and now it looks like they're both off, and to top it off we look to be panic buying unproven players. So many of our problems have been obvious since Moyes took over so to not do more to fix them before now is a complete joke.

[Lamb of BOD]

I'm glad the Leinster match was scheduled for the same time as the Liverpool vs Man Utd game, so I didn't have to watch another debacle. From the MOTD highlights, we created a chance or two, but that was about it. Reliant on yet another belter to get on the score sheet, we scarcely threatened otherwise and the defending was sub par - yet again. I have to admit I was taken in by Rodgers. I thought he was a man who knew what he wanted and knew how to get it. I still think he knows what he wants - because he sees it playing at Camp Nou every weekend - but I have no confidence that he has any idea how to coach players up, buy the right players or devise the right tactics. In short, I reckon he's a very good con-man. He certainly duped me, but he also managed to dupe FSG. The question now surely is who gets the heave-ho first, himself or Jose?

[Avenger]

I have to admit I was taken in by Rodgers. I thought he was a man who knew what he wanted and knew how to get it. I still think he knows what he wants - because he sees it playing at Camp Nou every weekend - but I have no confidence that he has any idea how to coach players up, buy the right players or devise the right tactics. In short, I reckon he's a very good con-man. He certainly duped me, but he also managed to dupe FSG. The question now surely is who gets the heave-ho first, himself or Jose?

I can relate to that sentiment.

When he was appointed I loved his talk of footballing philosophy and his death by football and a high pressing game but its all nonsense. That one wonderful season was because of one man and when that man was gone Rodgers abandoned his principles and philosophy. He talked of playing a system that I want to see played. He talked of pressure and harrying opposition when Liverpool didn't have the ball. He talked of never stop moving and resting when we had the ball. He talked of turning Anfield in to a fortress. And all it took for all of that to be swept away was the departure of one player... fair enough he's one of the top 5 players in the world in terms of ability and application and determination... he has it all... but why does the team not press any more? Did the loss of one player mean that Rodgers had to abandon his work-rate and high press game? I just can't buy in to that.

There's a great piece on Anfield Index called Falling Out of Love with Brendan Rodgers’ Liverpool. One paragraph in particular stands out for me.

I have one main issue with Brendan’s Liverpool team now above all others, forget the awful defence which he has never shown signs of being able to fix. Ever. Forget the stubborn fixation with Lovren over Sakho, which I find utterly bewildering. Forget the fact that a team that had just been smashed at home by Bournemouth and Leicester came to Anfield and won for the first time in 43 years at a canter. That’s all bad of course, but this is what’s worse. Much worse. The man with the plan, the dossier, with the blueprint on how to build a system of play, has built a team, HIS team, with absolutely no identity. Just what do we do? What is our plan? We have no pace, we aren’t direct, we don’t counter. What DO we do? We pass laterally and aimlessly. Where is the pressing? When he came in the door the talk of Anfield as a fortress was very much to the fore with Rodgers. He said it, again and again. We won’t allow teams to settle, we’ll be relentless. Yet now we just don’t press cohesively. Ever since that incredible one man workhorse, that magnificent little genius packed his bags and headed off to win everything at the Nou Camp that pressing game has mainly vanished. It remerged recently for a half hour spell at the Emirates. That’s it. Can one man alone set such a tone? Maybe he can, but by now a season later after the money that’s been spent surely there should be signs of some solution to coping without him? Surely being able to press effectively requires organisation and fitness qualities which should be the absolute minimum for a manager who built his blueprint on it. Rest with the ball he said, we rest with it alright, as do the f%~king opposition when we have it.

I too see nothing that can fix this for him. I don't believe he has the courage of his convictions. He must have known after the pathetic lifeless soulless way his team finished last season that he would on thin ice - with the fans if not FSG. I've never seen Anfield empty like it was with 10 minutes to go in the West Ham game. From what I can make out from internet forums (so hardly scientific) most want him gone and think it's simply a matter of time before FSG pull the trigger.

I think there's a quote from him about his sacking art Reading where he talks about his regret that he wasn't true to himself and his philosophy (that word again) in the pursuit of results and that he regretted that. He's done exactly the same thing again IMO.

[Lamb of BOD]

As a matter of interest, what do you think happens once he's gone? (I can't see him making it to Christmas at this rate. Unless there's a massive improvement he'll surely be replaced sometime in November.) Klopp is said to be still waiting in the wings. Do we have the players at the club to play attractive, effective football, or are we heading for yet another rebuild? After all the money that's been wasted (admittedly not just by Rodgers) will there be any appetite from on high to bankroll a new manager? As an aside, why the flip does Rodgers persist in buying players who play brilliantly for another club in a particular position and then insist on playing that player in any position/scheme other than the one in which he previously excelled?

[Avenger]

I don't believe Klopp is a realistic option. I'd focking love him but I believe he'll be Germany manager after the Euro's.
I doubt that Ancelotti would agree to work under the FSG structure too - as its pretty dysfunctional he would know that.
They'll probably go for young and upcoming again so it'll be someone like Monk (sorry Swansea) or Koeman. This is also a mistake as the fanbase at the moment is fragmented and neither of those would unify it like a proven winner would.

[offshorerules]

That was probably not a bad result considering the team selected.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

That was probably not a bad result considering the team selected.

You mean a team full of Liverpool players?