Donating to the cause

alanair · Post by **alanair** » July 9th, 2017, 11:58 am

well it makes a change this time...
Instead of having our best players crocked playing for the National team... Now we have sacrificed 3 of our finest to the Lions cause...

So...
Henshaw - out till New year
SO'B - Shoulder in a sling leaving the ground yesterday ( Given his history no doubt will mean surgery - and a loss to Leinster)
Jonny - Ankle - ( again Bound to mean surgery)

sigh !!!

wixfjord · Post by **wixfjord** » July 9th, 2017, 2:18 pm

Will never understand this line of complaining.

Firstly you've no idea how bad SOB and Sexton are.
Secondly you do realise that these aren't our players, they're centrally contracted and as much the IRFU's as Leinster's?
Finally, what do you expect them to do, not play for the Lions? 'sacrificed 3 of our finest to the Lions cause'! Come on! You don't reckon they had some say in it no?

What's the point in complaining about injuries, they're part and parcel of the game. That's why we've a deep, deep squad.

alanair · Post by **alanair** » July 9th, 2017, 5:54 pm

firstly , of the Teams supplying multiple players, we were by far the worst affected, and secondly, if, you think that our 'deep deep' squad has like for like replacements at 10 and 12, then im afraid you are somewhat deluded

jimbobjoe · Post by **jimbobjoe** » July 9th, 2017, 7:01 pm

As much as the Lions may be a pinnacle for players, fans will always have an issue with it and possibly rightly so. Player management or their health is not on the Lions agenda, apparently it was for Gatland when he brought in the geography 6 but then bowed to media pressure and failed to actually use them except for HIAs or injuries.

Lions agenda is to win at all costs - those costs being the players. Case in point is allowing AWJ to return to the field on Saturday - he had clearly been knocked out and was visibly shaky on his feet but had to return following another injury - completely reckless actions from the coaching and medical staff. Maybe in this case it's a Gatland thing - he's shown disregard in the past with George North's concussions.

Leinster's players injuries are unlucky in this scenario as they can happen in any game but I'd be livid of one of our guys was in AWJs place or if Sexton got injured after playing three games in eight days.

Dave Cahill · Post by **Dave Cahill** » July 9th, 2017, 7:51 pm

Well no chance of an Irish player playing 3 games in 8 days - 8 months is more par for the course

paddyor · Post by **paddyor** » July 9th, 2017, 8:23 pm

So Sexton Henshaw and SOB won't be available at the start of the season and likely until just before the AIs...................no change in other words?

artaneboy · Post by **artaneboy** » July 9th, 2017, 9:23 pm

wixfjord wrote:Will never understand this line of complaining.

Firstly you've no idea how bad SOB and Sexton are.
Secondly you do realise that these aren't our players, they're centrally contracted and as much the IRFU's as Leinster's?
Finally, what do you expect them to do, not play for the Lions? 'sacrificed 3 of our finest to the Lions cause'! Come on! You don't reckon they had some say in it no?

What's the point in complaining about injuries, they're part and parcel of the game. That's why we've a deep, deep squad.

I understand the point and appreciate the reality that the players want to be Lions. But an equal reality is that those three players are centrally contracted to facilitate their playing for ireland- not the Lions.

Okay, fair enough the IRFU is a 25% shareholder in the lucrative franchise, but it's more a bit infuriating when to take Sexton as an example, we were informed (somewhere here) that he's only played 5 times for Leinster last season; probably played an equivalent number of matches for the national time. But he's played three times in one week for the Lions- and what... six times in six weeks? And of course he gets creased in the final match.

Will we see him before Christmas? Odds against. Will Ireland? - probably, but he'll likely be undercooked. Seanie will be little better in terms of last season and likely worse, in terms of the first half of next season! Henshaw is entering that frustrating twilight zone.

You can't expect either provincial or national fans to be happy with that scenario- even if the players are.

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wixfjord · Post by **wixfjord** » July 9th, 2017, 9:35 pm

artaneboy wrote:
wixfjord wrote:Will never understand this line of complaining.

Firstly you've no idea how bad SOB and Sexton are.
Secondly you do realise that these aren't our players, they're centrally contracted and as much the IRFU's as Leinster's?
Finally, what do you expect them to do, not play for the Lions? 'sacrificed 3 of our finest to the Lions cause'! Come on! You don't reckon they had some say in it no?

What's the point in complaining about injuries, they're part and parcel of the game. That's why we've a deep, deep squad.
I understand the point and appreciate the reality that the players want to be Lions. But an equal reality is that those three players are centrally contracted to facilitate their playing for ireland- not the Lions.

Okay, fair enough the IRFU is a 25% shareholder in the lucrative franchise, but it's more a bit infuriating when to take Sexton as an example, we were informed (somewhere here) that he's only played 5 times for Leinster last season; probably played an equivalent number of matches for the national time. But he's played three times in one week for the Lions- and what... six times in six weeks? And of course he gets creased in the final match.

Will we see him before Christmas? Odds against. Will Ireland? - probably, but he'll likely be undercooked. Seanie will be little better in terms of last season and likely worse, in terms of the first half of next season! Henshaw is entering that frustrating twilight zone.

You can't expect either provincial or national fans to be happy with that scenario- even if the players are.

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I think the IRFU point is pertinent considering the OP mentioned 'getting crocked for the national team'.

The Lions is towards the pinnacle of these guys careers.

Why are you saying we won't see him before Xmas? What information have you got on that? That's pure hearsay.

SOB isn't in a sling btw, that was a complete overreaction by the OP.

Provincial fans have to be aware enough to know that Ireland gets ultimate precedent and that these guys are not going to turn down a chance to play for the Lions. They're going to give their all, and rightly so. It strikes me that there's a certain group on here who fail to understand that.

artaneboy · Post by **artaneboy** » July 9th, 2017, 10:18 pm

wixfjord wrote:
artaneboy wrote:
wixfjord wrote:Will never understand this line of complaining.

Firstly you've no idea how bad SOB and Sexton are.
Secondly you do realise that these aren't our players, they're centrally contracted and as much the IRFU's as Leinster's?
Finally, what do you expect them to do, not play for the Lions? 'sacrificed 3 of our finest to the Lions cause'! Come on! You don't reckon they had some say in it no?

What's the point in complaining about injuries, they're part and parcel of the game. That's why we've a deep, deep squad.
I understand the point and appreciate the reality that the players want to be Lions. But an equal reality is that those three players are centrally contracted to facilitate their playing for ireland- not the Lions.

Okay, fair enough the IRFU is a 25% shareholder in the lucrative franchise, but it's more a bit infuriating when to take Sexton as an example, we were informed (somewhere here) that he's only played 5 times for Leinster last season; probably played an equivalent number of matches for the national time. But he's played three times in one week for the Lions- and what... six times in six weeks? And of course he gets creased in the final match.

Will we see him before Christmas? Odds against. Will Ireland? - probably, but he'll likely be undercooked. Seanie will be little better in terms of last season and likely worse, in terms of the first half of next season! Henshaw is entering that frustrating twilight zone.

You can't expect either provincial or national fans to be happy with that scenario- even if the players are.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I think the IRFU point is pertinent considering the OP mentioned 'getting crocked for the national team'.

The Lions is towards the pinnacle of these guys careers.

Why are you saying we won't see him before Xmas? What information have you got on that? That's pure hearsay.

SOB isn't in a sling btw, that was a complete overreaction by the OP.

Provincial fans have to be aware enough to know that Ireland gets ultimate precedent and that these guys are not going to turn down a chance to play for the Lions. They're going to give their all, and rightly so. It strikes me that there's a certain group on here who fail to understand that.

If you read the post you'll see that I'm not necessarily claiming that (sling or no sling) that Seanie- or Sexton, will be out until Christmas, just asking (rhetorically certainly) that with injury and rest, and that's definitely needed- will Leinster see much of them by then? Based on previous experience will we- best case, get three starts from either before the end of the year? Honestly...?

Henshaw will more than likely be out until then from injury alone. But when will we see McGrath and Furlong back in blue? Not much before mid-October I'd hazard. Now that to me is quite a sacrifice for the country and particularly for the province, to have to just suck up.

Of course I don't grudge the players the honour. Of course I watched all the tests live and most of the other games and was delighted for the Irish players- and especially our Club men. But I just don't accept that the Lions should trump all our national and club needs.

I'm not sure what can be done about it though...

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paddyor · Post by **paddyor** » July 9th, 2017, 10:22 pm

We don't pay there wages though, so not really a sacrifice on the part of Leinster at all. This is the wages of central contracts.

It seem like you were saying it rather than asking FYI.

artaneboy · Post by **artaneboy** » July 9th, 2017, 10:34 pm

paddyor wrote:We don't pay there wages though, so not really a sacrifice on the part of Leinster at all. This is the wages of central contracts.

It seem like you were saying it rather than asking FYI.

Saying we won't see much if them before Christmas? Sure- I don't believe we will see much of them- do you?

I posted to give a context as to why some of us are not delighted at the result of the Lions tour.

We have to- and are content to, accept that as its the IRFU paying that they call the tune when it comes to prioritising Ireland. But we aren't talking of our national team; we are restricted to access them on account of an invitational selection- albeit a high prestige one that the IRFU holds a very profitable quarter share in. But should that financial return and the players desire mean we should be happy at the disruption?

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Peg Leg · Post by **Peg Leg** » July 10th, 2017, 8:15 am

Speaking of donations etc. How profitable is the lions to the irfu?

paddyor · Post by **paddyor** » July 10th, 2017, 9:46 am

Peg Leg wrote:Speaking of donations etc. How profitable is the lions to the irfu?

IIRC, the unions made 6m from the Australia tour of which a quarter is the IRFUs. I think that's profit. No figures this time around so far.

curates_egg · Post by **curates_egg** » July 10th, 2017, 10:22 am

Peg Leg wrote:Speaking of donations etc. How profitable is the lions to the irfu?

Well, as this is a Leinster forum, for Leinster fans:
- how much of that profit will Leinster receive in compensation for losing 3 of our best players?
- will the IRFU give us money to sign an international centre, which we now clearly need having lost Henshaw and Ringrose?

Babbling 'brook